Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
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12-10-2015, 01:28 PM
Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
So Ben Carson recently said that if the German citizens had more guns, they'd have been able to stop the Nazi party, and that the Nazis were bearing down on the German citizens by restricting gun control.

As I understand, this is historically false. But that the party in power before the Nazis had stricter gun control laws. The Nazis actually loosened the laws over the years. And that armed citizens were simply not going to be able to stop the Nazis once they got their grip on power and people realized their threat.

What are your thoughts on this?

I think he's a bit off his rocker, personally.
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12-10-2015, 01:34 PM (This post was last modified: 12-10-2015 02:26 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Lunacy
(12-10-2015 01:28 PM)kineo Wrote:  So Ben Carson recently said that if the German citizens had more guns, they'd have been able to stop the Nazi party, and that the Nazis were bearing down on the German citizens by restricting gun control.

As I understand, this is historically false. But that the party in power before the Nazis had stricter gun control laws. The Nazis actually loosened the laws over the years. And that armed citizens were simply not going to be able to stop the Nazis once they got their grip on power and people realized their threat.

What are your thoughts on this?

Yeah that guy is amazingly stupid for having gotten to where he is. He really makes me wonder ... how *did* he get to where he is ?

The German people first wildly embraced Hitler before any hostilities broke out, then thought he was nuts when he proposed invading France, (The generals thought he was a wacko at that point, and actively were thinking of getting rid of him). Austria first was crazy about him. Then when he actually invaded the first few places, and they won a few battles, they really thought he was a military genius. Carson knows nothing (except apparaently how to separate conjoined twins). He really is a quiet/calm lunatic. Praise Jebus. Weeping

Sorry to say this, but the myth that brain surgeons are really really smart, just ain't so. That field is highly structured, with "protocols" for pretty much every eventuality, and the intensivists and nurses and pediatricians manage the systemic problems and changes. Sure they're skilled in the OR, but ya know what, it's a shit job. Mostly they sit and listen to back pain complaints all day, (I've heard)....although the peds people probably wouldn't do that.

And Neurosurgery has absoluely nothing that gives anyone expertise in political solutions and compromize or economic solution skills. In fact it would be the opposite. They're little dictators in their little world.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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12-10-2015, 02:25 PM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
Somebody better tell Alla. No doubt she would defend him. Carson is a lunatic.

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12-10-2015, 02:31 PM (This post was last modified: 12-10-2015 02:49 PM by Lord Dark Helmet.)
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
This thread is racist.

(The tea party and republicans in general have been called racist for years for being anti Obama. The tea party and a ton of republicans loves Ben Carson. So the new interwebz trend is to call everyone racist who posts anything negative about Carson to point out the hypocrisy)

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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12-10-2015, 03:17 PM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
He's not the first person to make this stupid claim. I've heard it before. It's nonsense.

The German army blew through countries that were armed with guns, planes, tanks, etc. Poland lasted a few days. France lasted weeks. The British army was chased off the continent at Dunkirk. Then they plowed their way through a third of Russia. The idea that there was a way to resist the onslaught, if only they had guns, is just ridiculous.

Btw, the Jews in Warsaw did fight back. And, they were able to hold out for about a month or so. They ran out of ammo, which is what would have happened had the Jews been armed. The end would have been delayed by weeks.

It's a completely ridiculous argument and is not based on any historical facts at all. And, Carson should be embarrassed for throwing it out there. He won't be, though.

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12-10-2015, 03:43 PM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
I read his comments and think he's kind of right. He said German citizens, not just jews. No way the jews, by themselves, could have stopped the Nazis. But if the German citizens were better armed (guns were banned before Nazis gained power, some German citizens were allowed arms if they were deamed "trustworthy") and they actually grew a pair of balls as a country they could have stopped the Nazis. Hell, even if every German citizen was armed as some like to pretend, maybe they didn't want the Nazis out of power. They obviously did nothing to defend the Jews against the Nazis. So either they were not well armed enough, or scared, or they were in support of the nazi plan and went along with it.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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12-10-2015, 03:55 PM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
(12-10-2015 01:28 PM)kineo Wrote:  So Ben Carson recently said that if the German citizens had more guns, they'd have been able to stop the Nazi party, and that the Nazis were bearing down on the German citizens by restricting gun control.

As I understand, this is historically false. But that the party in power before the Nazis had stricter gun control laws. The Nazis actually loosened the laws over the years. And that armed citizens were simply not going to be able to stop the Nazis once they got their grip on power and people realized their threat.

What are your thoughts on this?

I think he's a bit off his rocker, personally.

He said WHAT?! That may be the dumbest thing I have seen all week, and I just read a post that amounted to 'lol ISIS is a US puppet', so it's got some strong competition.

How does he think the citizens could have stopped the Nazis? I mean, based on what practicality? First, at the height of their political action (pre-Hindenburg's death), the Nazis enjoyed strong support by the people; they were seen as a shining beacon of the old Imperial days; a testament to order and discipline (and clean uniforms) in a period where the people were incredibly disillusioned toward the government which was seen to be largely disorganised and seemed too paralysed to do anything about the many problems plaguing Germany.

Secondly, and perhaps most importantly, pre-the merging of Chancellor (Hitler's legally appointed office) and President (head of state, held by Hindenburg until his death), the Nazis had the SA; a paramilitary group that at it's prime was around 3 million members strong, and the SA didn't fuck around; (for a paramilitary group of the time) they were well trained, organised and not too poorly equipped. They frightened the heads of the military because they presented such a huge threat to the government if they ever decided to do anything major.

Personally I can't see the people being able to do much to the nazis even if they were all armed to the teeth during Hitler's rise. I can see them being even less able to do anything full-rise when Hitler had control over the Reichswehr.

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13-10-2015, 02:43 AM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
(12-10-2015 03:43 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  I read his comments and think he's kind of right.

In what?

(12-10-2015 03:43 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  He said German citizens, not just jews. No way the jews, by themselves, could have stopped the Nazis.

Here we agree.

(12-10-2015 03:43 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  But if the German citizens were better armed (guns were banned before Nazis gained power, some German citizens were allowed arms if they were deamed "trustworthy") and they actually grew a pair of balls as a country they could have stopped the Nazis.

Here we don't agree. Nazis rise to power wasn't issue of guns but of wounded pride, prejudice, disappointment and lack of faith in Weimar Republic, antisemitism, fear about communism and more factors.

(12-10-2015 03:43 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  They obviously did nothing to defend the Jews against the Nazis.

Generalization. As far as I know mainly true, but if you write that they did nothing no more than one example will shatter your claim vide Victor Klemperer and his wife.

(12-10-2015 03:43 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  So either they were not well armed enough, or scared, or they were in support of the nazi plan and went along with it.

Or at first they weren't treating Hitler serious, then they applaude him cause of his success and then they woke up in police state? Seriously though ammount of literature on the subject is enormous and one would be hard pressed to find some evidence for claim about guns.

Claims about lack of weapons being important to Nazi success aren't anything more than idiotic fear mongering used in USA internal political fights.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

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13-10-2015, 02:55 AM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
(13-10-2015 02:43 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  ...
fear mongering used in USA internal political fights.

Yup. That about sums it up.

Carson did a Godwin.

Dodgy

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13-10-2015, 05:29 AM
RE: Ben Carson's Calm Crazy
He's got some twisted history, that's for sure.

Germans were restricted since the Treaty of Versailles in `1919 from owning weapons. Later on in 1928 they loosened up the laws a bit - but still you had to be "somebody" before they'd let you own a gun.

So basically when Hitler came along - the majority of the population was already unarmed. (except for those people that keep illegal fireams).

Any new laws the NAZIs passed would have made little difference.

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