Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
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28-03-2017, 02:42 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 02:38 PM)DoubtingThomas Wrote:  
(28-03-2017 02:33 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  If they know that you disagree, then yes it is disrespectful. Ability to block whatever they spout doesn't make their behavior excusable.

It really isn't hard concept to grasp - guy x didn't ask for your opinion so you don't tell him. You may have good arguments but he have every right to not giving a damn about them.

Ok well I guess we just disagree. If challenging people's views without direct permission were so bad, then news channels wouldn't exist. I'm comfortable challenging people's beliefs on a public platform. However, I never do this one-on-one unless I'm asked. I don't believe in "pushing" my perspective on anyone. But I DO believe I have the freedom to state my own views publicly

We disagree cause in OP you asked on advice how to best proselytize and then now you go for some idiocy about news channels.

If you wouldn't be interested in pushing your perspective onto others then you wouldn't ask about how get across to religious people.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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28-03-2017, 02:51 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 02:42 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  We disagree cause in OP you asked on advice how to best proselytize and then now you go for some idiocy about news channels.

If you wouldn't be interested in pushing your perspective onto others then you wouldn't ask about how get across to religious people.

Getting across to someone isn't pushing your perspective on them. I simply want to state a public opinion on a public platform & I want to do it in the most effective and respectful way. I'm not sure why you see this as a problem. I'm not out there bashing religious folks. I just care about the effect religion has in the real world & I'd like to speak up about it.
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28-03-2017, 03:01 PM (This post was last modified: 28-03-2017 03:09 PM by Szuchow.)
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 02:51 PM)DoubtingThomas Wrote:  
(28-03-2017 02:42 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  We disagree cause in OP you asked on advice how to best proselytize and then now you go for some idiocy about news channels.

If you wouldn't be interested in pushing your perspective onto others then you wouldn't ask about how get across to religious people.

Getting across to someone isn't pushing your perspective on them. I simply want to state a public opinion on a public platform & I want to do it in the most effective and respectful way. I'm not sure why you see this as a problem. I'm not out there bashing religious folks. I just care about the effect religion has in the real world & I'd like to speak up about it.

Your OP doesn't look like you're interested in stating a public opinion on public platform, I see it as question how best proselytize. It seems to me (perhaps wrongly) that only now you changed your tune and you try to play innocent.

Edit: Considering your earlier thread I simply don't believe that you aren't interesting in proselytizing.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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28-03-2017, 03:19 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 03:01 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  Your OP doesn't look like you're interested in stating a public opinion on public platform, I see it as question how best proselytize. It seems to me (perhaps wrongly) that only now you changed your tune and you try to play innocent.

Edit: Considering your earlier thread I simply don't believe that you aren't interesting in proselytizing.

You can see from my OP and my earlier thread that I've been using Facebook... a PUBLIC platform. I'm not going door to door, I'm using a public stage.
And I'm obviously stating my opinion for people to think about it & hopefully change their perspective. Call it proselytizing, but that's all I'm doing and that's exactly what I've said this whole time.
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28-03-2017, 03:25 PM (This post was last modified: 28-03-2017 03:30 PM by Szuchow.)
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 03:19 PM)DoubtingThomas Wrote:  
(28-03-2017 03:01 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  Your OP doesn't look like you're interested in stating a public opinion on public platform, I see it as question how best proselytize. It seems to me (perhaps wrongly) that only now you changed your tune and you try to play innocent.

Edit: Considering your earlier thread I simply don't believe that you aren't interesting in proselytizing.

You can see from my OP and my earlier thread that I've been using Facebook... a PUBLIC platform. I'm not going door to door, I'm using a public stage.
And I'm obviously stating my opinion for people to think about it & hopefully change their perspective. Call it proselytizing, but that's all I'm doing and that's exactly what I've said this whole time.

I call it proselytizing and I find your protestations to be without merit. You want to convert people to your way of thinking as evidenced in post I just answer to. I find it both futile and presumptuous - is it as you know what would be better for them than themselves. I see religion as shit but it is not my job to show people the way, they have brains of their own and it seems that even in my lack of respect for theists I'm more respectful of them than you, who want to get them to think.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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28-03-2017, 03:46 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 03:25 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  I call it proselytizing and I find your protestations to be without merit. You want to convert people to your way of thinking as evidenced in post I just answer to. I find it both futile and presumptuous - is it as you know what would be better for them than themselves. I see religion as shit but it is not my job to show people the way, they have brains of their own and it seems that even in my lack of respect for theists I'm more respectful of them than you, who want to get them to think.

No one said it was your "job" to show them the way. I agree that we have no obligation to disillusion anyone. Its just my personal desire bc I care about the consequences of dangerous religious ideas. Again, we're not going to agree on this. I just know that if it weren't for people like Richard Dawkins & Sam Harris, I would've stayed in my delusion.
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28-03-2017, 03:52 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 03:46 PM)DoubtingThomas Wrote:  
(28-03-2017 03:25 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  I call it proselytizing and I find your protestations to be without merit. You want to convert people to your way of thinking as evidenced in post I just answer to. I find it both futile and presumptuous - is it as you know what would be better for them than themselves. I see religion as shit but it is not my job to show people the way, they have brains of their own and it seems that even in my lack of respect for theists I'm more respectful of them than you, who want to get them to think.

No one said it was your "job" to show them the way. I agree that we have no obligation to disillusion anyone. Its just my personal desire bc I care about the consequences of dangerous religious ideas

I saw how much you care - [...]Their faith seems harmless (besides the fact that they believe homosexuality is a sin & women are inferior to their husbands). But besides that, their faith makes them more compassionate people.[...]

Those aren't words of someone who see dangers of religious ideas. Try to sell your bullshit to someone else.

Quote:Again, we're not going to agree on this. I just know that if it weren't for people like Richard Dawkins & Sam Harris, I would've stayed in my delusion.

I did not needed others to do the thinking for me. Also you're no Dawkins nor Harris.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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28-03-2017, 04:04 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 03:52 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  I saw how much you care - [...]Their faith seems harmless (besides the fact that they believe homosexuality is a sin & women are inferior to their husbands). But besides that, their faith makes them more compassionate people.[...]

Those aren't words of someone who see dangers of religious ideas. Try to sell your bullshit to someone else.

Quote:Again, we're not going to agree on this. I just know that if it weren't for people like Richard Dawkins & Sam Harris, I would've stayed in my delusion.

I did not needed others to do the thinking for me. Also you're no Dawkins nor Harris.

I'm sorry that I can't be more clear to you. But yes, I think religious people are generally harmless bc most of them don't act on their beliefs. That doesn't make their beliefs any less dangerous though. They're not out killing gays (harmless), but they DO think gays deserve eternal torture (dangerous).
And I never claimed to be a Dawkins or Harris.
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28-03-2017, 04:13 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 04:04 PM)DoubtingThomas Wrote:  I'm sorry that I can't be more clear to you. But yes, I think religious people are generally harmless bc most of them don't act on their beliefs.

It's not that you aren't clear. I think you don't even know what you really want to say and this result in gems like ones quoted in my prior post.

We are from different countries so perspective is different, but I wouldn't call 39% of Poles (in country with about 95% catholics) who are against euthanasia harmless, nor I would say it about 53% who are against same-sex marriages.

Quote:That doesn't make their beliefs any less dangerous though. They're not out killing gays (harmless), but they DO think gays deserve eternal torture (dangerous).

It's nonsensical distinction. And idiotic to be honest - not killing homosexuals does not equal being harmless. They easily can be against same rights for same-sex couples and this equals harm.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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28-03-2017, 04:21 PM
RE: Best Medium to talk to Religious People?
(28-03-2017 04:13 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  It's nonsensical distinction. And idiotic to be honest - not killing homosexuals does not equal being harmless. They easily can be against same rights for same-sex couples and this equals harm.

Very true, but where I'm from most people are FOR same sex rights, so in that sense it's harmless. But I'm curious if you think people like Dawkins & Harris are proselytizing? And do you disagree with what they're doing
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