Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
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12-11-2013, 10:30 PM (This post was last modified: 12-11-2013 10:33 PM by DoubtingDragon.)
Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
Here I am again, trying to come up with answers or thoughts in debating one of my family members who is a devout x'stian. One thing she harps on is bible prophecy. Now then, when she claims that the new testament is fulfilling old testament prophecies, I very easily dismiss this. It would be quite easy for a new testament writer to read old testament stuff and make up prophecies. There is no way to verify, so I can easily brush these off.

But the one that does trip me up is Ezekiel 37:11-13, The re-gathering of the Jews into their homeland and Ezekiel 37:10-14; Isaiah 43:5, 6; 66:7-8 The rebirth of Israel as a nation in 1948, in one day.

My question is about this whole Israel becoming a nation again in 1948. She claims this is prophecy fulfilled.

I would appreciate some thoughts on this please.
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12-11-2013, 10:53 PM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
Its clearly a self fulfilling prophecy, the people and states involved is the establishment of modern Israel were possible 90+% aware of the Bible story ,
and even without the non-secular influence its highly probable it would have happened with or without the holocaust sympathy.

End of British Mandate[edit]
On 29 November 1947, the General Assembly of the United Nations adopted a resolution recommending the adoption and implementation of a plan to partition Palestine into "Independent Arab and Jewish States" and a "Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem" administered by the United Nations (Resolution 181 (II)).[10] Britain declared that the Mandate was to end on 15 May 1948. On 14 May 1948, David Ben-Gurion, in a ceremony in Tel-Aviv, declared the establishment of a Jewish state in Eretz-Israel, to be known as the State of Israel.[11]
Eliahu Epstein, Agent, Provisional Government of Israel said in a letter to President Truman seeking recognition from the U.S government, sent immediately after the Declaration of 14 May 1948, that the state of Israel has been proclaimed as an independent republic within frontiers approved by the General Assembly of the United Nations in its Resolution of November 29, 1947.[12]

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12-11-2013, 11:53 PM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
(12-11-2013 10:53 PM)sporehux Wrote:  Its clearly a self fulfilling prophecy

Indeed. Watch "Waiting for Armageddon". It's on netflix, and I bet you can watch it on a number of other sites for free. It goes a bit in depth into some political organizations even here in the US that are funding and pushing for movements to infiltrate the gov't in order to forward policies that would incite a final world war starting in Isreal, which they believe will bring about the apocalypse.

It's truly chilling to watch these people take such joy in propagating such a destructive and hateful agenda. Never underestimate the power of absolute delusion, and the evil of herd mentality.

I'm not overly anti-theist for the most part, but it's shit like this that makes me support those who are. Not everyone is an armchair christian, and the world is not safe from those who really believe that it's their duty to bring the wrath of god upon us all.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

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13-11-2013, 02:08 AM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
(12-11-2013 10:30 PM)DoubtingDragon Wrote:  Here I am again, trying to come up with answers or thoughts in debating one of my family members who is a devout x'stian. One thing she harps on is bible prophecy. Now then, when she claims that the new testament is fulfilling old testament prophecies, I very easily dismiss this. It would be quite easy for a new testament writer to read old testament stuff and make up prophecies. There is no way to verify, so I can easily brush these off.

But the one that does trip me up is Ezekiel 37:11-13, The re-gathering of the Jews into their homeland and Ezekiel 37:10-14; Isaiah 43:5, 6; 66:7-8 The rebirth of Israel as a nation in 1948, in one day.

My question is about this whole Israel becoming a nation again in 1948. She claims this is prophecy fulfilled.

I would appreciate some thoughts on this please.
Drinking Beverage

If I remember correctly, for years prior to Israel ever re-becoming a thing, Jewish extremists had plagued the Palestine and were using methods similar to those used by their now Palestinian extremist opposition to push the Palestinians out and make their way in; they wanted to fulfill their book. The Jews wanted their book-given 'homeland' and demanded it (even non-extremists probably loved the idea almost as much as the nutjobs did, but probably without the prophesy wishing).

Plus in Post-WWII, nobody knew what to do with them; the Brits were given the responsibility to find some place, they got sick of their shit and gave them back to the UN to deal with, leading eventually to the Palestinian Two-State divide we see now which has caused us all so much annoyance (if only Palestine and Israel could have been like North and South Korea and just fucking behaved for the most part!).

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13-11-2013, 02:34 AM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
(13-11-2013 02:08 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  could have been like North and South Korea and just fucking behaved for the most part!).

Lol. The DMZ , paradoxically the most militarized area on the planet. If the crazy Kim Jongs go Christian or Muslim ,South Korea will be decimated.

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13-11-2013, 04:41 AM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
(13-11-2013 02:34 AM)sporehux Wrote:  
(13-11-2013 02:08 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  could have been like North and South Korea and just fucking behaved for the most part!).

Lol. The DMZ , paradoxically the most militarized area on the planet. If the crazy Kim Jongs go Christian or Muslim ,South Korea will be decimated.

I'm just being fair; they hate each other and make no secret of it, but now they behave themselves when with each other (mostly) and even co-operate very slightly; unlike Palestine and Israel who constantly squabble over bullshit that they must know is unimportant and never seem to get tired of causing trouble for everyone in the region and abroad. Compared to them, North and South Korea are almost angelic as sibling nations...

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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13-11-2013, 05:26 AM (This post was last modified: 13-11-2013 05:30 AM by sporehux.)
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
I get your observation, and the DMZ is mostly a 1 bad guy issue.
But im swayed by my neighbour that its an equally dysfunctional boarder, a SKorean (very passionate about the split, arm waving and teary eyes) and once claimed since the dmz NK have abducted thousands of SK and imprisoned thousands that were visiting .

Then
Http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombardme...Yeonpyeong
And
Http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROKS_Cheonan_sinking

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13-11-2013, 05:38 AM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
(12-11-2013 10:30 PM)DoubtingDragon Wrote:  Here I am again, trying to come up with answers or thoughts in debating one of my family members who is a devout x'stian. One thing she harps on is bible prophecy. Now then, when she claims that the new testament is fulfilling old testament prophecies, I very easily dismiss this. It would be quite easy for a new testament writer to read old testament stuff and make up prophecies. There is no way to verify, so I can easily brush these off.

But the one that does trip me up is Ezekiel 37:11-13, The re-gathering of the Jews into their homeland and Ezekiel 37:10-14; Isaiah 43:5, 6; 66:7-8 The rebirth of Israel as a nation in 1948, in one day.

My question is about this whole Israel becoming a nation again in 1948. She claims this is prophecy fulfilled.

I would appreciate some thoughts on this please.
Drinking Beverage

Modern Israel is NOT a reconstitution of EITHER of the two ancient kingdoms of Israel. It's a secular democracy. The temple is not rebuilt. There are no sacrifices going on today. The Aronic priesthood is not reconstituted.
There are at least as many of the oracular pronouncements from the Oracle of Delphi that have come true.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ora...rom_Delphi

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13-11-2013, 06:51 AM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
(13-11-2013 05:38 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Modern Israel is NOT a reconstitution of EITHER of the two ancient kingdoms of Israel. It's a secular democracy. The temple is not rebuilt. There are no sacrifices going on today. The Aronic priesthood is not reconstituted.
There are at least as many of the oracular pronouncements from the Oracle of Delphi that have come true.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ora...rom_Delphi

I've not looked to much into this supposed "prophecy" and am just now learning about it, so please forgive even more questions that I have about what you've said here. Unsure

1. Are you saying that the bible says Israel is supposed to be a re-constitution of two different ancient kingdoms? Is there a verse?
2. Does the bible say that the temple is supposed to be rebuilt before this "new" Israel can be recognized as the Israel talked about in the prophecy?
3. I'm not sure what is meant by Aronic priesthood.
4. I don't follow the point of the Oracle of Delphi.

Thanks so much for the help.

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13-11-2013, 07:30 AM
RE: Bible Prophecy: Israel becoming a nation
Just tell her she's a stupid bitch.
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