Bill Nye gets owned!
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26-10-2013, 06:57 PM (This post was last modified: 26-10-2013 07:01 PM by grizzlysnake.)
Bill Nye gets owned!


Banana_zorro Checkmate Atheists!Banana_zorro




"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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26-10-2013, 07:47 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
Paused at 2:20 for the first video. All credibility lost at that point. Not like they had much to begin with.
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26-10-2013, 08:00 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
How can Canned Ham claim to teach evolution, when he seems to fail to grasp it himself? He criticizes Nye for mentioning evolution along with engineering, then describes how he wouldn't want to fly on one of his planes that were built by this process (by laying out the parts and randomly putting them together). Dipshit Pork Product doesn't realize that every plane he flies in, and every car he rides in, are a result of evolution, technological evolution. He should visit a museum of industry and see how these vehicles have evolved. Stupid Pigbelly.

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26-10-2013, 08:16 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
The videos weren't convincing, but it's hard to argue with dancing bananas.

That's disappointing as hell too. I was kind of liking my new identity as one of the baddest primates on the planet. Now I have to go back to believing that I'm nothing more than animated dirt... Sadcryface2

"Hey! Jesus was morally perfect. The book written by people who never met him and thought he was God said so..." Consider

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26-10-2013, 09:03 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
Very slick, the fundies are starting to look like the tobacco lobby.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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26-10-2013, 09:19 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
(26-10-2013 08:00 PM)Jeffasaurus Wrote:  Dipshit Pork Product doesn't realize that every plane he flies in, and every car he rides in, are a result of evolution, technological evolution. He should visit a museum of industry and see how these vehicles have evolved. Stupid Pigbelly.

That isn't a good analogy. Technological progress and innovation are more like Intelligent Design than evolution by natural selection in that they are teleological and guided by reason. Evolution by natural selection is neither teleological nor guided by reason. Evolution is a "blind" process it is not goal oriented such that one species is "better" than another. Engineering is goal-oriented and the design process is influenced by reason and creative insight.

You seem to be guilty of a common misunderstanding of evolution by natural selection. Evolution is not teleological. Homo sapiens sapiens aren't evolutionarily better than Nemopilema nomurai or "more evolved". Nemopilema nomurai do perfectly well in their ecological niche and survive and reproduce and by that measure are well-adapted to their habitat. Certainly Homo sapiens sapiens are more intelligent than Nemopilema nomurai and have a sophisticated cultures but from a gene-centric view of evolution these things are irrelevant. In gene-centric terms if your population is stable or growing over the long-term then your species is doing well. It is entrely possible that Homo sapiens sapiens become extinct and Nemopilema nomurai continue to thrive.

Ham's aeroplane assembly analogy doesn't work for different reasons. Assume you had 1 million complete sets of parts for a Boeing 747 and 1 million test pilots. At each iteration of the randomly guided construction process each Boeing 747 that could be assembled is assembled and an attempt is made to get it in flight and then when in flight it is kept there and landed only to refuel. Each plane that can fly is flown for at least 10,000 hours before the next build is attempted. If a build survives 10,000 hours of flight then that build is used as a basis for the subsequent build. The subsequent build is varied but if the plane doesn't survive 10,000 hours the build reverts to the last known good design and a different possible build is tried and so on, and so on. If this process continues then eventually you will arrive at the intended design and divergent designs that don't affect the flight of the plane (e.g. no seat version, versions where the seats face the rear of the plane etc.). That is more akin to how natural selection works than one iteration of a random assembly. Given a good source of random variation and a systematic selection process and sufficient time, evolution by natural selection will exhaust the "design space" and you can see by odd examples of such things as mammals that fly, birds that talk, fish that generate electric shocks etc. that it has done so and continues to do so.

Ham and freinds are YECs they believe that the entire universe is around 4000 years old. Speciation via evolution by natural selection can only be understood with reference to vast expanses of time, tens and hundreds of thousands of years. Ham and friends are correct that ~4K years is insufficient to produce the observed speciation via evolution and that is one reason why they are resistant to what you and I would regard as good evidence. You can't assess and critique their view of evolution piecemeal, it is part of a larger self-supporting worldview.

Lastly, Ham and friends are cunning in that they have picked up on an issue in the philosophy of biology and are working it as hard as they are able. It is true that evolutionary biology is epistemically different from the other subfields of biology and most other sciences. That isn't just my opinion and that of Ham and co. A recent book on the matter is Pigliucci and Kaplan's Making Sense of Evolution: The Conceptual Foundations of Evolutionary Biology. Evolutionary biology is historical in orientation, it is concerned with what has happened in a similar manner in which archaeology, history, paleontology and geology are. You can read this review to find the expression of a concern that any epistemological analysis of evolutionary biology is likely to be exploited by creationists. But even with its epistemic peculiarities evolution by natural natural selection is a superior explanation of speciation and adapatation than ceationism.
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26-10-2013, 09:20 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
(26-10-2013 08:16 PM)Can_of_Beans Wrote:  The videos weren't convincing, but it's hard to argue with dancing bananas.

That's disappointing as hell too. I was kind of liking my new identity as one of the baddest primates on the planet. Now I have to go back to believing that I'm nothing more than animated dirt... Sadcryface2
ah no worries, nothing more humble than dirtSmile

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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26-10-2013, 11:05 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
I feel suddenly stupider for having watched that. My wife got a huge laugh out of the first one around 1:05 when the Dr. Georgia Purdom started talking about the "complete lack of a genetic mechanism that allows organisms to gain genetic information to go from simple to complex over time". My wife has a PhD in Molecular Biology, and she seemed to think that statement was pretty stupid. Her exact words, "That's bullshit. She should know better."
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26-10-2013, 11:19 PM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
I thought that this was a pretty good response to the first video (other than a misspelling or two).



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27-10-2013, 01:27 AM
RE: Bill Nye gets owned!
(26-10-2013 09:19 PM)Chippy Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 08:00 PM)Jeffasaurus Wrote:  Dipshit Pork Product doesn't realize that every plane he flies in, and every car he rides in, are a result of evolution, technological evolution. He should visit a museum of industry and see how these vehicles have evolved. Stupid Pigbelly.

That isn't a good analogy. Technological progress and innovation are more like Intelligent Design than evolution by natural selection in that they are teleological and guided by reason. Evolution by natural selection is neither teleological nor guided by reason. Evolution is a "blind" process it is not goal oriented such that one species is "better" than another. Engineering is goal-oriented and the design process is influenced by reason and creative insight.

Technological progress is an example of memetic evolution.




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