Bohdan2's collected concerns about NDEs and Out of Body Experiences?
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25-01-2017, 01:35 AM
RE: Guys do you believe Howard Storm's NDE?
If he is not lying then he is delusional.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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25-01-2017, 03:03 AM
RE: Atheists, I want to know your explanation for these Out of body experiences?
Very simple.

It's hokum.

To elaborate -it's self-delusional bullshit - to make up for a life wasted in devotion to stupid religion, created by people who thought the world was flat and the center of all creation.

Fucking get over it already.

There's no "afterlife" and there's no fucking "OBE", "NDE" or "GOD".

.....

Sorry -- somebody needed to tell you.

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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25-01-2017, 03:44 AM
RE: Atheists, I want to know your explanation for these Out of body experiences?
It's not up to atheists to debunk all nonsense that theists believe in - people need to use that things called brain sometimes.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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25-01-2017, 03:53 AM
RE: Atheists, I want to know your explanation for these Out of body experiences?
(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  I wanted to know what you think about OBEs. There have been a few cases that seem difficult to debunk.

Nope. They're all easy to debunk.

Quote:Dr. Peter Fenwick has dealt with thousands of OBEs in Near Death [...]

Fenwick is 82 years of age, and possibly showing signs of onset dementia.

Quote:How did Dr. Fenwick find so many cases if they are just coincidences?

Wishful thinking.

In 1985 a patient was referred to Fenwick following an operation that had gone wrong. The patient had found himself leaving his body and hovering over his hospital bed. He told Fenwick he had journeyed down a long tunnel towards a bright light before being pulled back "into my body again".

"I didn't really believe in near-death experience," says Fenwick. "But after seeing this patient I thought, we'd better have a look." He began collecting stories and in 1987 presented the results on television. Within days he had 2,000 letters, each telling a personal story of near-death experience.


—Jane Wheatley, Independent, 6 Oct 06.

Those 2,000 letters are not evidence.

No

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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25-01-2017, 03:57 AM
RE: Guys do you believe Howard Storm's NDE?
(24-01-2017 08:32 PM)unfogged Wrote:  What future events did he predict?
Wars and rumors of wars. That's Biblical man. Banana_zorro

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25-01-2017, 04:40 AM (This post was last modified: 25-01-2017 04:48 AM by Ace.)
RE: Guys do you believe Howard Storm's NDE?
(24-01-2017 08:10 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  This is a man who apparently used to be an atheist, but then during his NDE he was tortured in hell until he called out to Jesus.

one what basis can we verify he actually experienced any of this ?
how do we distinguish his claims are authentic and not hallucinations, lucid dreams, drugs, or stuff he just made up ?
also the "former atheist now devout religious person due to blah blah blah happening" is nothing new, we've heard it many times

Quote: He was a former arts prof so in his NDE he saw 80 new primary colours

so he saw colors... I hate to break it to you but primary colors are not a fundamental property of light but is related to the color vision system in animals, it is nothing but an arbitrary group of colors that can be mixed together in combinations to create any other color
the only real requirement for any color to be considered a primary color is that mixing them should be able to produce all known colors
so the new 80 primary colors are bullshit

Quote:he was able to predict world events in the future. He became a priest afterwards.

what are his predictions ?
did he claim to have predicted an event after it happened ? if so then he's just making shit up since anyone can claim they predicted it after it already happened
if it hasn't happened yet then ask for specific details like when, where, how etc... if he predicted an earthquake in Taiwan on 12AM 12/12/18 with a magnitude of above 4 then unless an earthquake happens at that time his prediction of it would be wrong automatically

Quote:What do you guys think, assuming he was not lying about his experience? His videos are very common all over youtube, and

assuming he's not lying is impossible, until he brings actual evidence to verify his claims he's honesty should be brought into question

Quote:he still goes to conferences and cries every time he tells his story.
appeal to emotions fallacy
I don't care if he fills his pants with diarrhea... I want evidence not tears

Quote: He also wrote a few books about it.

unless his books have any data to back up what he's saying then I don't care about it
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25-01-2017, 04:43 AM
RE: Atheists, I want to know your explanation for these Out of body experiences?
(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  I wanted to know what you think about OBEs. There have been a few cases that seem difficult to debunk.
Dr. Peter Fenwick has delt with thousands of OBEs in Near Death and says that patients sometimes have been able to "float" to another room and get information of what other people behind closed doors said. Then, they verify it.
One man was floating above his body, found a baby crying in another room. He was apparently able to talk to the baby, found out the baby had a broken arm. Then, when he was revived, he checked with doctors, and it turned out the baby's limb was broken.
Here is a video which claims there is life after death:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeM4m_4dWeA

How can so many people accurately describe what occurs when they have a dying brain or a brain that is dead? It seems like a poorly functioning brain cannot do this. Do you think that these examples I provide, albeit anecdotal, potentially prove a soul exists?
How did Dr. Fenwick find so many cases if they are just coincidences?

I've "died" several times. There was no out of body experience.

People are full of shit.

Grow up.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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25-01-2017, 06:05 AM
RE: Guys do you believe Howard Storm's NDE?
(24-01-2017 08:10 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  This is a man who apparently used to be an atheist, but then during his NDE he was tortured in hell until he called out to Jesus. He was a former arts prof so in his NDE he saw 80 new primary colours, and he was able to predict world events in the future. He became a priest afterwards. What do you guys think, assuming he was not lying about his experience? His videos are very common all over youtube, and he still goes to conferences and cries every time he tells his story. He also wrote a few books about it.

When I hear "used to be an atheist" I hear - someone decided Christians were an easy way to make money from, so they made up some bullshit story that Christians like to hear so they could sell books and DVD's to them.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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25-01-2017, 06:20 AM
RE: Guys do you believe Howard Storm's NDE?
(24-01-2017 08:10 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  This is a man who apparently used to be an atheist, but then during his NDE he was tortured in hell until he called out to Jesus. He was a former arts prof so in his NDE he saw 80 new primary colours, and he was able to predict world events in the future. He became a priest afterwards. What do you guys think, assuming he was not lying about his experience? His videos are very common all over youtube, and he still goes to conferences and cries every time he tells his story. He also wrote a few books about it.

Why would this make anyone want to worship Jesus? Even if it was true.
Sounds like a bullshit money spinner to me.
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25-01-2017, 06:33 AM
RE: Atheists, I want to know your explanation for these Out of body experiences?
(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  I wanted to know what you think about OBEs.

I think that NDEs are the result of brain chemistry during traumatic, life threatening events. Like everything else that happens in our brains, it all boils down to chemistry.

(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  There have been a few cases that seem difficult to debunk.

Citations?

(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  Dr. Peter Fenwick has delt with thousands of OBEs in Near Death and says that patients sometimes have been able to "float" to another room and get information of what other people behind closed doors said. Then, they verify it.

Citations?

(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  How can so many people accurately describe what occurs when they have a dying brain or a brain that is dead? It seems like a poorly functioning brain cannot do this.

If a brain is "poorly functioning" then how can you rely on the NDE experience in the first place.

Also, no brain has been "dead" and recovered. People have been mistakenly declared dead but that remains a Near Death experience.

(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  Do you think that these examples I provide, albeit anecdotal, potentially prove a soul exists?

Nope.

(24-01-2017 10:50 PM)Bohdan2 Wrote:  How did Dr. Fenwick find so many cases if they are just coincidences?

Other posters have already addressed the science of NDEs, so I'm going to look at the numbers.

In 2015 alone, there were 4990 Bigfoot sightings in the US/Canada:
BFRO

In 2015 alone, there were 6830 UFO sightings in the US:
NUFORC

What about El Chupacabra?
chupacabra

Because of the numbers of reports, should we believe in Bigfoot, UFO's and Chupacabras?

The number of people who experience NDEs indicates that there is an actual NDE phenomenon. However the experience/phenomena can be explained by science without resorting to the supernatural.

We need to set our standards of investigation, verification and final belief very high. Otherwise, we're going to believe some really weird shit that probably isn't true.

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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