Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
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22-05-2013, 03:23 PM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
[Image: bird_forelimbs.gif]
Forelimbs of (A) Ornitholestes, a theropod dinosaur, (B) Archaeopteryx, © Sinornis, an archaic bird from the lower Cretaceous, and (D) the wing of a modern chicken (modified from Carrol 1988, p. 340; Carrol 1997, p. 309).

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22-05-2013, 03:33 PM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
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22-05-2013, 03:39 PM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
I think we can see macroevolution in our time! In plants. We humans have genetically changed the production of food, and the corresponding plants involved, dramatically! We have also extended human life. We have done other things which threaten our planet. Some of you will say that this is not "evolution". Why? Because humans and science were involved? Humans are part of earths ecosystem. Evolution is adaptation. It is not a move toward something. It doesn't have a plan. That would lead us to religion. Humans are changing (evolving) the planet.
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22-05-2013, 04:57 PM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
(22-05-2013 02:25 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I looked at the clade on Wikipedia and understand there may not be direct, smoking gun connections in evolution but I looked at all the photos online you posted and don't see "it".

I also don't understand why your post isn't a complete contradiction against nach's post. One of you says, "They didn't decide their feathers might be fun for flying... this happened gradually." The other, "these [gradual] changes were enhancing survivability."

Again, I understand there may not be what people used to think of as "direct descent" but you want me to believe there were 32 feathered species until they could fly... and that having forelimbs that were like wings without flight was a positive towards survival? What am I missing?


You are missing the fact that feathers are good for insulation.

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22-05-2013, 05:08 PM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
(22-05-2013 04:57 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(22-05-2013 02:25 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I looked at the clade on Wikipedia and understand there may not be direct, smoking gun connections in evolution but I looked at all the photos online you posted and don't see "it".

I also don't understand why your post isn't a complete contradiction against nach's post. One of you says, "They didn't decide their feathers might be fun for flying... this happened gradually." The other, "these [gradual] changes were enhancing survivability."

Again, I understand there may not be what people used to think of as "direct descent" but you want me to believe there were 32 feathered species until they could fly... and that having forelimbs that were like wings without flight was a positive towards survival? What am I missing?


You are missing the fact that feathers are good for insulation.

PJ is missing a whole lot more in this thread than just the multiple uses for feathers and he still won't read the recommendations he asked for.
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22-05-2013, 07:32 PM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
I just had to post this:






yes I know the video is rather old, but the concept is still the same. That and the video is slightly entertaining.
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23-05-2013, 08:54 AM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
Quote:I think we can see macroevolution in our time! In plants. We humans have genetically changed the production of food, and the corresponding plants involved, dramatically! We have also extended human life. We have done other things which threaten our planet. Some of you will say that this is not "evolution". Why? Because humans and science were involved? Humans are part of earths ecosystem. Evolution is adaptation. It is not a move toward something. It doesn't have a plan. That would lead us to religion. Humans are changing (evolving) the planet.

Great point. Mustard greens are indeed significantly different than broccoli, cauliflower, etc. But they are still plants, reproducing after their own kind. What kind of dramatic genetic engineering would be required for plants to become animals?
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23-05-2013, 08:58 AM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
Quote:PJ is missing a whole lot more in this thread than just the multiple uses for feathers and he still won't read the recommendations he asked for.

I've observed the multiple uses for feathers and commented on them (?). I am reading a lot and spending precious hours learning more and more--from secular sources and not apologists.

The issue is I asked multiple times for books that aren't "look at all the little changes and understand they lead to big changes", since I acknowledge the little changes already. I've further asked for books with smoking gun empirical evidence and genotypologies and phenotypologies--those recommendations I am reviewing, so thank you.

Meanwhile, I post links to articles about evolutionary straw men arguments like ambulocetus and people here won't even click the links to look at the ILLUSTRATIONS. When you pots are completed calling me a kettle, perhaps you will task answering my questions.

Showing a changed digit at the end of an appendage does not explain FLIGHT. Perhaps we should leave this for something less complex to discuss, like abiogenesis. I believe at this time that having many different birds in the creation to review in the ancient world in the fossil record has led to much confusion on your parts.
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23-05-2013, 10:02 AM
Re: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
The evidence for evolution isn't good enough!


My personal experiences of God are all the evidence I need to believe.

“Science is simply common sense at its best, that is, rigidly accurate in observation, and merciless to fallacy in logic.”
—Thomas Henry Huxley
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23-05-2013, 10:05 AM
RE: Book Recommendation for PleaseJesus
(23-05-2013 08:54 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  What kind of dramatic genetic engineering would be required for plants to become animals?

Its this type of comment that continues to prove that you have absolutely no fucking clue and are not reading anything that has been pointed out to you. It is utterly amazing to me that you have lived beyond a couple years out of the womb given the extreme idiocy you continue to demonstrate. I fully expect to see you in the darwin awards.
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