Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
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05-07-2016, 11:04 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
I'm a high-level government welfare recipient working on the highest-level documentation.

Humanism - ontological doctrine that posits that humans define reality
Theism - ontological doctrine that posits a supernatural entity creates and defines reality
Atheism - political doctrine opposed to theist doctrine in public policy
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05-07-2016, 11:07 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
(05-07-2016 11:04 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  I'm a high-level government welfare recipient working on the highest-level documentation.

And this is precisely why you are useful to society.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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05-07-2016, 11:10 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
(05-07-2016 10:46 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(05-07-2016 10:16 AM)Heatheness Wrote:  I agree. It also shows bad judgment on the whole state dept. for lack of security. He referenced several times about incoming emails from others in the state dept. as being as poorly secured. Hope that is fixed now.

At about 11 minutes into Director Comey’s press statement he says something very damning, I’m paraphrasing here, “even though some of the sensitive e-mails were not labeled classified or top secret the senders and receivers of those emails knew the topic was sensitive and should have acted accordingly.”

I have since listened to Clinton’s response and it left me wanting. The crux of why she used a personal account instead of the required security phones and PC was for “convenience”. That is so fucking lame.

And right after her meeting with the FBI she did an interview with MSNBC and said she never sent anything sensitive through her server.

The FBI's findings prove she lied. From the beginning until the end.

"Well, Chuck, that's a mouthful. Let me just repeat what I have repeated for many months now. I never received nor sent any material that was marked classified and there is a process for the review of material before it is released to the public. And there were decisions made that material should be classified. I do call that retroactively classifying. So, therefore, it would not be publicly released, but that doesn't change the facts as I have explained many times."


Just because it was retroactively classified, doesn't mean she shouldn't have known at the time she was sending it. She's the Secretary of fucking state. She should know if something she was discussing was sensitive or not. And if she doesn't understand something that simple, she shouldn't be president.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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05-07-2016, 11:12 AM
RE: FBI: No Recomendation Of Indictment For Hillary Clinton
Since when does INTENT mean anything in improper handling of classified material???????

Just because you didn't mean to be an idiot, shouldn't get you off the hook for sending classified material over a non-secure line.....

I'm sure such a defense wouldn't have worked if I'd done such a thing when I was handling top secret traffic. (which I did, daily)....


"Gee sorry Captain -- I didn't MEAN to send out a top secret message over an open channel.."...

Yeah, I'm sure that would have made everything just fine...


Sad

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05-07-2016, 11:26 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
(05-07-2016 10:22 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(05-07-2016 10:14 AM)Slowminded Wrote:  "Extremely careless" and "Gross Negligence" seems just semantics to me, but I accept that there is some nuance that I don't recognize.

It is a matter of degrees. Basically she was stupid to do this but not to a degree where it is criminal.

Actually, that was not the conclusion. What he basically said was they couldn't find precedent for a prosecution on this evidence and a reasonable prosecutor wouldn't expect a conviction. He never said there was no evidence of a crime. On the contrary, I thought he laid out very well that a crime was committed (in so far as the statute includes gross negligence as an element ).

Two things really bugged me about Comey's position. The first is the idea that a series of actions that are, by their nature, rare events shouldn't be prosecuted because there is little precedent for such a prosecution. The second is the entity charged solely with investigating and fact gathering using the difficulty of obtaining a conviction as a factor in whether or not to recommend moving for an indictment. I thought that was pure bullshit and a disservice to the American public. That is not the job of the FBI. Let the prosecution make that call.

But, it is incorrect to say they found no evidence of criminal wrongdoing. They just felt there was low probability of a successful prosecution. It's not the same thing.

There was a lot said in that press briefing to attack her with the next 4 1/2 months but I doubt it will matter. With this out of the way, I think she's a near lock to win. Something can happen to change that but absent that "something", I think this is over.

We will see.

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05-07-2016, 11:27 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
(05-07-2016 11:10 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Just because it was retroactively classified, doesn't mean she shouldn't have known at the time she was sending it. She's the Secretary of fucking state. She should know if something she was discussing was sensitive or not. And if she doesn't understand something that simple, she shouldn't be president.

Hear, Hear!

#AtheistsAgainstHillary

Humanism - ontological doctrine that posits that humans define reality
Theism - ontological doctrine that posits a supernatural entity creates and defines reality
Atheism - political doctrine opposed to theist doctrine in public policy
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05-07-2016, 11:28 AM
RE: FBI: No Recomendation Of Indictment For Hillary Clinton
(05-07-2016 11:12 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Since when does INTENT mean anything in improper handling of classified material???????

Just because you didn't mean to be an idiot, shouldn't get you off the hook for sending classified material over a non-secure line.....

I'm sure such a defense wouldn't have worked if I'd done such a thing when I was handling top secret traffic. (which I did, daily)....


"Gee sorry Captain -- I didn't MEAN to send out a top secret message over an open channel.."...

Yeah, I'm sure that would have made everything just fine...


Sad

There a lot of nuances to every decision about level of criminality. Intent is one of those levels. I'm sure, as he did state in his statement, that intent was not the only factor or even the deciding one.

I am not saying she didn't make a bad judgment here but I also respect his inside investigative information that we will never be privy to and his determination of what constitutes criminal negligence or a prosecutable offence.

However, I do expect a lot of anti-Hillary people will be grousing, sucking sour grapes and conspiracy theorizing. (This is not directed at you.) I hope they will still be respectful in discourse. It doesn't pay to do anything less, it won't change things.

I am also glad he made his statement in a way that clearly admonishes her. She certainly deserved that, as well as close future scrutiny.

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05-07-2016, 11:30 AM (This post was last modified: 05-07-2016 11:38 AM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
(05-07-2016 11:10 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Just because it was retroactively classified, doesn't mean she shouldn't have known at the time she was sending it. She's the Secretary of fucking state. She should know if something she was discussing was sensitive or not. And if she doesn't understand something that simple, she shouldn't be president.

She should've assumed that all of her conversations were classified by default. It's not good for her. If the GrandOldPoop comes out of convention with Kasich as the nominee, it's game over for the dems. If Trump comes out as the nominee it's still game over for the GOP and the Senate.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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05-07-2016, 11:30 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
(05-07-2016 11:26 AM)BnW Wrote:  
(05-07-2016 10:22 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is a matter of degrees. Basically she was stupid to do this but not to a degree where it is criminal.

Actually, that was not the conclusion. What he basically said was they couldn't find precedent for a prosecution on this evidence and a reasonable prosecutor wouldn't expect a conviction. He never said there was no evidence of a crime. On the contrary, I thought he laid out very well that a crime was committed (in so far as the statute includes gross negligence as an element ).

Two things really bugged me about Comey's position. The first is the idea that a series of actions that are, by their nature, rare events shouldn't be prosecuted because there is little precedent for such a prosecution. The second is the entity charged solely with investigating and fact gathering using the difficulty of obtaining a conviction as a factor in whether or not to recommend moving for an indictment. I thought that was pure bullshit and a disservice to the American public. That is not the job of the FBI. Let the prosecution make that call.

But, it is incorrect to say they found no evidence of criminal wrongdoing. They just felt there was low probability of a successful prosecution. It's not the same thing.

There was a lot said in that press briefing to attack her with the next 4 1/2 months but I doubt it will matter. With this out of the way, I think she's a near lock to win. Something can happen to change that but absent that "something", I think this is over.

We will see.

I'll have to look for it online later. I got up too late to see it live.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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05-07-2016, 11:34 AM
RE: Breaking news: FBI Director Comey to deliver statement at 11 a.m. ET
Too late? It was 8AM your time. What kind of slacker are you?

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
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