Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
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06-11-2014, 10:37 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(06-11-2014 10:24 AM)TreeSapNest Wrote:  Outside of any religious concerns, we would all be wise to watch carefully how the laws of assisted suicide are crafted and evolve. As sentiments evolve, and with the influence of national health care, things could evolve into a certain expectation under certian circumstances. Even the refusal to provide certian health care after a certian age or prognosis. Think I'm crazy?

http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2014/09/19/...e-past-75/

Your referenced article is alarmist tripe. The article by Dr. Emanuel is cogent, well thought out, and personal.

Dr. Emanuel Wrote:Again, let me be clear: I am not saying that those who want to live as long as possible are unethical or wrong. I am certainly not scorning or dismissing people who want to live on despite their physical and mental limitations. I’m not even trying to convince anyone I’m right. Indeed, I often advise people in this age group on how to get the best medical care available in the United States for their ailments. That is their choice, and I want to support them.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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06-11-2014, 10:44 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
It also shows the sentiment is already out there.
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06-11-2014, 10:46 AM (This post was last modified: 06-11-2014 10:52 AM by dirtstar.)
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(04-11-2014 05:46 PM)Nurse Wrote:  I had to watch a woman guppy breathe all night last night while we waited on her to die after withdrawing care (meaning turned off the ventilator, pulled the breathing tube). She was still suffering when I clocked out this morning. Sadcryface There's no compassion in that! I say open the fentanyl drip wide open.

That's terrible. I can empathize with you having worked in a heart hospital for awhile. I wasn't part of the medical team, I was a Sys Admin for the hospital but at times it was necessary to resolve issues with equipment in the patient rooms. I've seen suffering, a lot of tears, and heartbreaking moments. There's nothing fair about the end but having experienced what I have I am more than convinced that sometimes there's a time to simply terminate the suffering and accept fate on our own terms.
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06-11-2014, 10:57 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(06-11-2014 10:44 AM)TreeSapNest Wrote:  It also shows the sentiment is already out there.

What sentiment? Paranoid fear of death panels?

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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06-11-2014, 10:58 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
Ya, that one. :-)
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06-11-2014, 11:31 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(06-11-2014 10:24 AM)TreeSapNest Wrote:  Outside of any religious concerns, we would all be wise to watch carefully how the laws of assisted suicide are crafted and evolve. As sentiments evolve, and with the influence of national health care, things could evolve into a certain expectation under certian circumstances. Even the refusal to provide certian health care after a certian age or prognosis. Think I'm crazy?

http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2014/09/19/...e-past-75/

See my post # 47. Again, out of the yearly 40,000 deaths here in Oregon, only around 40 to 45 people a year use the Death With Dignity act. And this has remained consistent throughout the almost 20 years of the law.

Your religious concerns are all hog wash.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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06-11-2014, 05:03 PM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(06-11-2014 10:44 AM)TreeSapNest Wrote:  It also shows the sentiment is already out there.

Yes the article clearly shows that one man holds the opinion that everyone over 75 should die. That absolutely proves that everyone will think this if we decide to give people the option to end their lives if they have a terminal illness. Dodgy

Seriously, is there a more clear cut case of the slippery slope fallacy? Facepalm that article adds nothing to this discussion, and has no impact on it whatsoever.

I hope that the world turns, and things get better. But what I hope most of all is that you understand what I mean when I tell you that, even though I do not know you, and even though I may never meet you, laugh with you, cry with you, or kiss you, I love you. With all my heart, I love you. - V for Vendetta
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06-11-2014, 05:21 PM
Re: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
What's strange is that like wazzell my family was Catholic. However, even my Catholic family is for assisted suicide. My mom was friends with one of Kevorkian's last few patients.

When my dad died we already knew his wishes. The scans showed his brain was too far gone. My mother was on the nursing staff for 30 years so she knew what the scans showed.

The doctor told us he was on a high enough dose in his IV that he didn't feel a thing. I hope that he didn't know or feel.

For me, it's easy. I've told my family under what circumstances I am DNR and have a living will on file.

I don't think bad of anyone who is conflicted. It's not easy for most people.
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07-11-2014, 09:49 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(04-11-2014 08:30 PM)Anjele Wrote:  
(04-11-2014 08:27 PM)wazzel Wrote:  Logically it all makes since. So I do get and understand the points. Something just does not sit right. Could be a holdover from my catholic upbringing.

I bet you nailed it. Catholic upbringing.

I hope you are never in the situation to have to make a similar decision or to watch a loved one experience an agonizing, inevitable death - I think that you would look at things a different way now that you know that all the prayer in the world won't help.

I can attest to this. I watched at least two family members dying in agony while they essentially waited for a fatal complication. Thats what "being kept comfortable" means. It means you get the max dose of morphine while you wait for organ failure.

Why? What is the point of that? So that your family can have those last moments with you? I promise those last moments are nothing but agony for those watching helplessly. There was many many times that while I watched my beloved uncle struggle to breathe and listened to that horrible death rattle in his lungs that I just wanted to steal the morphine from the supply room and give him a fatal dose myself.

"At least we got to say goodbye" is horse shit. I didn't get to say goodbye because he couldn't hear me. To me, its no different than saying goodbye to a headstone or a casket. He can't hear me.

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07-11-2014, 10:17 AM
RE: Brittany Maynard - Her right to choose
(06-11-2014 05:21 PM)Clockwork Wrote:  What's strange is that like wazzell my family was Catholic. However, even my Catholic family is for assisted suicide. My mom was friends with one of Kevorkian's last few patients.

When my dad died we already knew his wishes. The scans showed his brain was too far gone. My mother was on the nursing staff for 30 years so she knew what the scans showed.

The doctor told us he was on a high enough dose in his IV that he didn't feel a thing. I hope that he didn't know or feel.

For me, it's easy. I've told my family under what circumstances I am DNR and have a living will on file.

I don't think bad of anyone who is conflicted. It's not easy for most people.

My parents are very religious. My dad on more than one occasion said that he wished the church's stance on suicides was different. He has no wish to live a painful last few "days" and would rather bite a bullet than suffer, but because the church teaches against it he will not. Even tho they feel this way they both have DNRs for us kids to follow. I guess it is a fine line, but I have no problem even with the idea of pulling the plug if that is all that is keeping them alive.
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