Bruce Jenner and other Christians
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03-06-2015, 03:27 PM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
(03-06-2015 09:18 AM)dancefortwo Wrote:  
(03-06-2015 05:28 AM)Fodder_From_The_Truth Wrote:  Me? I think if I want to share my opinion on the matter I'm free to do so. And there's hardly a channel on tv not blabbing on about it. Hell I even went to my sports forum and it was being discussed.

But what you missed was my real issue with the "story". It has little to do with Bruce/Caitlyn. It has much more to do with the fact that this is a national news craze. This is a national news story? This nation has real problems, real issues, and average Joe and Jane are stuffing their face with the gender issues of a man who has been whoring himself out to reality TV for the last 7 years. By the way, didn't he/she just kill someone in a car wreck? This is just more "shock TV" for the herd.

For some this story is relevant, and understandably so. It is positive for some to know "they are not alone", so to speak. That's its okay and it will be okay. But do not laud Bruce Jenner as a hero.

Well, it's true, the news media is always looking for an interesting story and they suck the life out of anything they get a hold of, but Jenner herself I don't think had any choice but to be public about it. If she had tried to do it privately the paparazzi would have been lurking behind every bush, chasing her down like an animal, so this was probably the only way to get control of the situation.

I don't have cable so I've never watched the show about the Kardashians. A couple of people I know who have watched it told me that Jenner was actually the best behaved of the entire family. They said the Caitlyn was kinda quiet and reserved on the show. So there's that.

From what I know about the accident Jenner was hit from behind which sent her careening across the road head on into another car which killed the driver. There were three or four cars involved. She did stop and help and stayed at the scene during the entire time.

I know you're sick of the subject, I understand that, but if you have time and want to learn more about the brain of transgender people you might want to check out the many scientific studies. There's probably more physical evidence in the brain for transgenderism than being gay.

http://aebrain.blogspot.com.au/p/transse...ntity.html

I tend to disagree but I could be wrong in regards to the media attention. I don't think Bruce/Caitlyn wasn't that much of a celebrity where she could've slid back into obscurity. From all that I've heard, she went out of her way to make sure her transition was publicized and she profited extensively.

I've also read that she has no intentions to remove male genitalia. What are your thoughts there?
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03-06-2015, 05:43 PM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
(29-04-2015 11:53 AM)Clockwork Wrote:  I've had transgender friends, and one let me ask her all kinds of questions. I'll be honest, I do not understand it. However, I don't have to. Who or what people feel they're happy as and who they want to frolic with naked in no way hurts me one bit.

That's why I support dance's daughter. Can't wrap my brain around it, but as long as she and dance are working for happiness I'm all for it. My friend told me about the problems she had with her dad, and I was glad she finally started having a better relationship with him. (He went from having two sons to a son & daughter.)

People are obsessed with what's between others' legs and with whom they jiggle it. The problem is they lose the part that's between the ears. Love and acceptance is important.

I find what's in people's heads much uglier than their naughty bits.

Totally agree. I have been thinking of how to say this but Clockwork did a great job.

I don't get it because I haven't experienced those thoughts and feelings. But I don't have to get it.

Why can't people just let other people be happy? If we all liked the same things and behaved exactly the same it would be a pretty boring world.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF

We're all mad here. The Cheshire Cat
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03-06-2015, 08:02 PM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
(03-06-2015 12:58 PM)jennybee Wrote:  
(03-06-2015 12:50 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  Labels are kinda important. Without them nobody knows what the fuck anyone is talking about.

You wouldn't be able to figure out what was going on if you saw two men or two women walking down the street, holding hands, passionately kissing each other without a label? A man who once was Bruce Jenner and who now goes by Kaitlyn Jenner--you would need a label to tell you that this is someone who now identifies as a woman?

Labels are most useful for paperwork, where people are depersonalized and categories reign supreme. Labels are convenient for clerks and accountants.
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15-06-2015, 08:03 PM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
I know, I suck.But I'm going to fess up: I have always been less, patient, accepting, and convinced of "trans" identity shifting than just about anything else, including sexual orientation. Call me a fuckpig, if you must.

But in the case of Jenner, I just can't shake the suspicion, based on much of what has been discussed above that, yeah, she feels (now) like a woman, not the male identity she was born with. But it feels pretty, I dunno, publicity conscious, his/her (I know, fucking kill me — I'm supposed to say "her") seemingly calculated PR efforts which — surprise! — have led to a (yawn) reality TV show.

She has evidently stated that she will keep her male genitalia. I haven't heard about hormone treatments, but she has augmented her breasts and, witness her first sexy cover shoot, wants people to view her as (yawn) a sex object. So, I can call her a "she" and so on, but curse me 'til I'm dead, I feel ... manipulated.

Story, perhaps not relevant and bound to get me in more fucking trouble. I was part of a men's group in the early '90s in Santa Fe. No, this was not MRA horseshit, but seemed to me of some value, in that participants were trying to be better husbands, fathers, etc. No face-painting or running around the woods in this group. There was one guy, Jim. One night he came in and said he was embracing his Scottish roots and wished to be called "McKenzie." "Ho!" we all shouted, clapping him on the back, and so it was that he was McKenzie.

Less than two months later, McKenzie arrived one night and pronounced that, in honor of his new interest in Tibetan culture, he now wished to be called Jhumpa/Jompa (I'm spelling phonetically). Most of the group shouted "Ho!" and Jhumpa he was. Except for me. That was it. I just couldn't do it. Couldn't buy his revolving identities and the notion that, if I didn't accept it with my whole heart, unquestioned, I was an asshole or a meanie or something. I never went back. (There was also the little matter of a "guest speaker" someone brought in — a dude who called himself Yokar and claimed to be a "channeled entity." The "entity" spoke in a bad quasi-Teutonic accent and spouted horseshit galore; I believe Yokar is still floating about the web in places).

So. I'm grousing. Sorry. People get to be who they want to be, and who they are. But I get to be skeptical, don't I?

Don't I? Please, Yokar, it's me, Margaret.....

Now just running on. Thanks for letting me rant.

God does not work in mysterious ways — he works in ways that are indistinguishable from his non-existence.
Jesus had a pretty rough weekend for your sins.
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15-06-2015, 08:55 PM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
(15-06-2015 08:03 PM)claywise Wrote:  I know, I suck.But I'm going to fess up: I have always been less, patient, accepting, and convinced of "trans" identity shifting than just about anything else, including sexual orientation. Call me a fuckpig, if you must.

But in the case of Jenner, I just can't shake the suspicion, based on much of what has been discussed above that, yeah, she feels (now) like a woman, not the male identity she was born with. But it feels pretty, I dunno, publicity conscious, his/her (I know, fucking kill me — I'm supposed to say "her") seemingly calculated PR efforts which — surprise! — have led to a (yawn) reality TV show.

She has evidently stated that she will keep her male genitalia. I haven't heard about hormone treatments, but she has augmented her breasts and, witness her first sexy cover shoot, wants people to view her as (yawn) a sex object. So, I can call her a "she" and so on, but curse me 'til I'm dead, I feel ... manipulated.

Story, perhaps not relevant and bound to get me in more fucking trouble. I was part of a men's group in the early '90s in Santa Fe. No, this was not MRA horseshit, but seemed to me of some value, in that participants were trying to be better husbands, fathers, etc. No face-painting or running around the woods in this group. There was one guy, Jim. One night he came in and said he was embracing his Scottish roots and wished to be called "McKenzie." "Ho!" we all shouted, clapping him on the back, and so it was that he was McKenzie.

Less than two months later, McKenzie arrived one night and pronounced that, in honor of his new interest in Tibetan culture, he now wished to be called Jhumpa/Jompa (I'm spelling phonetically). Most of the group shouted "Ho!" and Jhumpa he was. Except for me. That was it. I just couldn't do it. Couldn't buy his revolving identities and the notion that, if I didn't accept it with my whole heart, unquestioned, I was an asshole or a meanie or something. I never went back. (There was also the little matter of a "guest speaker" someone brought in — a dude who called himself Yokar and claimed to be a "channeled entity." The "entity" spoke in a bad quasi-Teutonic accent and spouted horseshit galore; I believe Yokar is still floating about the web in places).

So. I'm grousing. Sorry. People get to be who they want to be, and who they are. But I get to be skeptical, don't I?

Don't I? Please, Yokar, it's me, Margaret.....

Now just running on. Thanks for letting me rant.

Well, comparing an interest in Tibetan culture and being transgender isn't quite the same thing.

I'll just leave you with this.

http://aebrain.blogspot.com.au/p/transse...ntity.html

And I'll add this. Scientists began following the hormone connection when they noticed a high rate of intersex and transgender men who were exposed to Diethylstilbestrol as a fetus. Diethylstilbestrol was given to pregnant women to prevent miscarriage among other things. Gender is established by hormone levels during pregnancy. There are cases when the hormone levels become disrupted due to maternal reaction to the fetus, environmental chemicals, or medications administered to the mother, where the fetus's brain will develop in conflict with the fetus's genitals.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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15-06-2015, 10:18 PM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
(29-04-2015 09:44 AM)dancefortwo Wrote:  As some of you might know my daughter is transgender. She started her transition when she was 20 and is now in college and incredibly happy. Anyway, when she first told me she was transgender I sat down at the computer and learned as much as I could about it.

http://www.cakeworld.info/transsexualism...milarities

Some of the Christians I know haven't spoken to me since they found out. Meh, no great loss and actually it was a great reason to dissociate myself from them and find out who my real friends are.

But when Bruce Jenner came out as transgender I did a kind of a quick look at comments on different news feeds to see how much hate was out there, and yup, it's a lot. It seems to be most prevalent in the US and mostly among Christians. Somehow hating gender and sex variance is quite acceptable among many Christians and it doesn't matter that Bruce Jenner is also Christian, religious hate trumps everything.

It's so frustrating. Just sayin'.

But perfectly understandable.
"God has a plan" doncha know.
The house of cards comes a tumbling down if you pull one card out.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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16-06-2015, 12:19 AM
RE: Bruce Jenner and other Christians
W.r.t. OP, yeah, I've seen a lot of Christians going ape shit over how wrong it is. No idea why. I thought God loved everyone unconditionally. Seems a bit mean of his followers to not do the same.

Also if God/Allah/whoever the fuck had a problem with it, I woulda thought they could sort it out at the big ol' detention centre in the sky. Why religious people feel the need to preemptively fuck up other people's lives I do not understand.

The Iran article was interesting. I would have thought they'd have *much* more of a problem with transgendered people. I mean, isn't that basically admitting that Allah fucked up and humans are now having to fix his mistakes? There's no way to assign blame to the victim there, it seems very un-religious of them. Of course they implement it in a total cock-up way, but ja... just if I was an Ayatollah I'd reject such Western nonsense as gender reassignment surgery and send 'em all for the chop.

Maybe they can't though, maybe there has to be an out. Gay people form a large percentage of most populations AFAIK, significant enough that if you try to kill all of them pretty soon everyone's gonna have lost a relative to your little purge. Maybe that then turns the population against you...

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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