CARM
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
09-08-2016, 06:31 PM
CARM
So, maybe you've heard of The Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry (CARM) founded by Matt Slick. They obviously focus on apologetics and giving people the tools to debate nasty atheists like us and also helping people leave cults and to know "true christianity ". The last part seems pretty hysterical, I know. It's like hey leave your cult because it's wrong and join the "true" cult.

Anyway, I digress. I was watching this little debate on abortion between 2 believers (if you can believe that) on Twitter today and somehow the topic switched to evolution and of course the christian says it's just a theory so I linked her to this pg. http://www.nas.edu/evolution/TheoryOrFact.html
She replied with this http://www.discovery.org/a/6401
I let her know evolution is now considered fact whether you believe it or not it will still be true. She tells me yes facts are true just like god is true whether you believe or not. God sent his son to die on for our sins, yadda, yadda. Smh... then I get sent this link, which to be honest I really don't understand wtf they are saying. Logic is true, therefore god is true? What?

Anyone have a counter to this argument? It's using the same words over and over again (absolute logic) it's given me a headache. Not to mention if god/jesus/christianity were true why would they need organizations dedicated to apologetics and explaining true christianity? I just chuckle at the term christian apologetics. It's so... well.. illogical! Heres the link and check out this website to really have your mind blown with babble. https://carm.org/transcendental-argument
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Keri81's post
10-08-2016, 08:38 AM
RE: CARM
Maybe start here: http://wiki.ironchariots.org/index.php?t...l_argument

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Hafnof's post
10-08-2016, 09:33 AM
RE: CARM
The difference between "True Christianity" and "False Christianity" -- is -- "True" is the version you have. "False" is what those smelly hypocrites at the church down the block have....

Unless of course you're in the church down the block -- then it's those other bastards that are doing it wrong......

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like onlinebiker's post
11-08-2016, 07:27 AM
RE: CARM
He uses word salad woo-woo to trick people into thinking he has an argument. When really it's total bs.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-08-2016, 08:01 AM
RE: CARM
The use of the argument in this instance is an example of a strawman.

The fact of evolution has nothing to do with the existence or otherwise of a deity.

The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike
Excreta Tauri Sapientam Fulgeat (The excrement of the bull causes wisdom to flee)
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Silly Deity's post
11-08-2016, 09:24 AM
RE: CARM
The reason the argument makes no sense to me is because it's presupposes that god is real. We would have no logic if god didn't give it to us. So if god is real and it gave us logic is something logical because he said so? Or is it logical already and god uses the same logic anyway? Does that make sense? Could he just change logic on a whim? Or would logic always be logical in spite of god? It's all so preposterous
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-08-2016, 09:48 AM
RE: CARM
(11-08-2016 09:24 AM)Keri81 Wrote:  The reason the argument makes no sense to me is because it's presupposes that god is real. We would have no logic if god didn't give it to us. So if god is real and it gave us logic is something logical because he said so? Or is it logical already and god uses the same logic anyway? Does that make sense? Could he just change logic on a whim? Or would logic always be logical in spite of god? It's all so preposterous

You can always tell whether an argument has been conceived forward (observations lead to premises, lead to conclusion) or backwards (conclusion leads to premises, which are then fit to observations) by how many leaps of logic are taken in it. In this specific case, it's clearly backwards, most obviously because of the enormous leap from "a being that creates and maintains logical absolutes," to "Matt Slick's specific christian deity," but also because the formulation of the argument is nothing more than "god needs to exist because you can't tell me any other way the logical absolutes could exist."

It's an argument from ignorance, which is mainly what you're going to find when you go looking for reasons why a specific thing must exist, rather than actually having evidence before believing in it, that it does exist. The latter actually presents the thing in question, while the former just attempts to cut a god shaped hole in the universe, then acts surprised when god, why, he just fits right in there! Angel
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Esquilax's post
11-08-2016, 10:06 AM
RE: CARM
Exactly, Equilax. Which is why when the original tweeter sent me this link saying she believes in this garbage all I could say was good for you. It takes to much energy and wastes to much time trying to point out the obvious to people that believe it.

No matter what they're conclusions will always be correct to them because they force the puzzle piece into the puzzle to complete it. It's simple to refute, but because slick made up this whole seemingly confusing and intricate argument they think it's not so simple. Watch Dan Barker debate Slick, he so easily refutes him and Slick says "I don't think you understand." "You are twisting my logic/words." No Slick, we understand you're assertions have no merit.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Keri81's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: