CHRIST'S TOMB
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06-02-2014, 04:13 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
(06-02-2014 04:01 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 02:32 PM)alpha male Wrote:  Hate to admit it but I was thinking pretty much the same as Robby, just didn't feel like pursuing it.

Hey alpha male,

I suspect the real reason you're here is

1. you appreciate REAL conversations, and you can't have them with your Christian friends

2. deep down you have serious doubts about your beliefs, and you're honest enough to put them to to the test. You're just a few steps away from being true to yourself by admitting you're an atheist.

What do you have to say to that? Try to be honest now!
1. I don't consider what I get here to be conversation, but rather argumentation. I do appreciate a good argument, and no, I obviously don't get good arguments from like-minded friends.

2. You're way off base. My beliefs are firmer now then when I started this 15 years ago. There's no way I could be an atheist, as a universe from nothing and life from inert matter are utterly ridiculous.

Thanks for playing though...we have a version of the home game for you on your way out. Thumbsup
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06-02-2014, 04:39 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
toadally, I have some first rate angel feathers for sale which could negate the piece of the true cross cljr has $10,000 (US) each. In my previous transaction cljr got away because I did not realize the defunct Zimbabwean dollar even existed at one time. I did not then directly ask for US dollars which I make obvious now.

About that bridge the picture of it is beautiful. I remain in on the action and my experience as an engineer may give me some insight into how to move it.
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06-02-2014, 04:43 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
(06-02-2014 04:13 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:01 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Hey alpha male,

I suspect the real reason you're here is

1. you appreciate REAL conversations, and you can't have them with your Christian friends

2. deep down you have serious doubts about your beliefs, and you're honest enough to put them to to the test. You're just a few steps away from being true to yourself by admitting you're an atheist.

What do you have to say to that? Try to be honest now!
1. I don't consider what I get here to be conversation, but rather argumentation. I do appreciate a good argument, and no, I obviously don't get good arguments from like-minded friends.

2. You're way off base. My beliefs are firmer now then when I started this 15 years ago. There's no way I could be an atheist, as a universe from nothing and life from inert matter are utterly ridiculous.

Thanks for playing though...we have a version of the home game for you on your way out. Thumbsup

Just amazing. So, in the end it's not really a relationship with a deity that motivates and energizes you, but, but a total "god of the gaps" *insert*, as you have no better explanation (which does exist out there...you're just too uneducated to know where and what it is).

Fascinating.
At least you admit that's all it is.
A NEED for "cognitive closure".

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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06-02-2014, 05:08 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
Alpha, you and I have had some minor disagreements on here and in other threads, but I've never been confused by your stance until now.

First, you mentioned that you come here to challenge your beliefs (I think that's how you put it) and that is perplexing. Why are you doing that? Christians don't challenge their beliefs, they promote them and try to prostelityze those who question their beliefs. What kind of Christian looks for reasons to doubt and then say their faith has never been stronger? I find that hypocritical or at the very least dishonest.

Then you say you could never be an atheist because you find it utterly ridiculous that the universe came from nothing and life could spring from inert matter. While you are wrong on both of these points, I can see how an indoctrinated person could view it that way. Even so, are you saying if science could prove life could come from inert matter, which it pretty much has a theory tied to abiogenesis already, and that you could learn that the Big Bang was not only probable but that it didn't come from nothing, at least to the extent that it would satisfy you, that you would then have an atheist stance?

I find this dishonest, too, because you either wrote it that way to be intentionally provocative or you aren't as faithful as you profess, which would mean you are being dishonest again.

Check out my atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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06-02-2014, 05:17 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
(06-02-2014 04:43 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Just amazing. So, in the end it's not really a relationship with a deity that motivates and energizes you, but, but a total "god of the gaps" *insert*, as you have no better explanation (which does exist out there...you're just too uneducated to know where and what it is).

Fascinating.
At least you admit that's all it is.
A NEED for "cognitive closure".
Your lack of reading comprehension is what's amazing. Well, considering the procreate thing, no, I'm not surprised at all. Anyway, the set of reasons that I could not be an atheist is not necessarily identical to the set of reasons that I am a Christian. Duh.
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06-02-2014, 05:31 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
(06-02-2014 05:08 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Alpha, you and I have had some minor disagreements on here and in other threads, but I've never been confused by your stance until now.

First, you mentioned that you come here to challenge your beliefs (I think that's how you put it) and that is perplexing. Why are you doing that? Christians don't challenge their beliefs,
This one does.
Quote:they promote them and try to prostelityze those who question their beliefs.
Have you seen me proselytizing?
Quote:What kind of Christian looks for reasons to doubt
The kind that wants as much confidence in their faith as possible.
Quote:and then say their faith has never been stronger?
The kind who finds their faith holding up well to the challenges.
Quote:I find that hypocritical or at the very least dishonest.
I find your use of stereotypes to be simplistic at best.
Quote:Then you say you could never be an atheist because you find it utterly ridiculous that the universe came from nothing and life could spring from inert matter. While you are wrong on both of these points, I can see how an indoctrinated person could view it that way. Even so, are you saying if science could prove life could come from inert matter, which it pretty much has a theory tied to abiogenesis already, and that you could learn that the Big Bang was not only probable but that it didn't come from nothing, at least to the extent that it would satisfy you, that you would then have an atheist stance?
No, it means that then I could possibly have an atheist stance.

Point is that even if I abandoned Christianity, I would adopt another theism or at least deism, because I find the first cause and design arguments compelling.
Quote:I find this dishonest, too, because you either wrote it that way to be intentionally provocative or you aren't as faithful as you profess, which would mean you are being dishonest again.
Or people misread it and make baseless accusations.
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06-02-2014, 05:54 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2014 05:58 PM by Mark Fulton.)
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
(06-02-2014 04:13 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:01 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Hey alpha male,

I suspect the real reason you're here is

1. you appreciate REAL conversations, and you can't have them with your Christian friends

2. deep down you have serious doubts about your beliefs, and you're honest enough to put them to to the test. You're just a few steps away from being true to yourself by admitting you're an atheist.

What do you have to say to that? Try to be honest now!
1. I don't consider what I get here to be conversation, but rather argumentation. I do appreciate a good argument, and no, I obviously don't get good arguments from like-minded friends.

2. You're way off base. My beliefs are firmer now then when I started this 15 years ago. There's no way I could be an atheist, as a universe from nothing and life from inert matter are utterly ridiculous.

Thanks for playing though...we have a version of the home game for you on your way out. Thumbsup

Okay, that's interesting.

Why, then, are you here?

Who are "we?" and what's this "home game?"

"way out" of what?
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06-02-2014, 05:56 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2014 06:00 PM by WillHopp.)
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
Alpha,

I wasn't stereotyping Christians, it's what they are supposed to do, to spread the good news. I didn't say YOU were proselytizing, I said that's what Christians are supposed to do, to convert those who aren't Christian. Who is misreading now?

Your answers ring hollow and are against Christian practices. Looking for doubt to enforce your faith? What the hell kind of logic is that? If faith were a real tangible thing I could possibly agree with this, like looking for problems in a contract to be sure to cover your ass, but it's faith, you aren't supposed to question it to strengthen it. If you haven't convinced yourself after 15 years of this then you clearly have faith issues.

You keep saying we are misreading or misunderstanding you, but that's not the case. My accusation that you were being dishonest isn't baseless. In fact you've only reinforced it by saying you could possibly have an atheistic stance only to say if you abandoned Christianity you'd jump on another deity train because first cause and design compel you. But I specifically asked you if science could prove these two things were not from a deity would you have an atheistic stance, and you said yes. So you're talking out of both sides of your mouth, or in other words, you're a liar.

Check out my atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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Atheism promotes critical thinking; theism promotes hypocritical thinking. -- Me
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06-02-2014, 08:03 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
(06-02-2014 05:17 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:43 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Just amazing. So, in the end it's not really a relationship with a deity that motivates and energizes you, but, but a total "god of the gaps" *insert*, as you have no better explanation (which does exist out there...you're just too uneducated to know where and what it is).

Fascinating.
At least you admit that's all it is.
A NEED for "cognitive closure".
Your lack of reading comprehension is what's amazing. Well, considering the procreate thing, no, I'm not surprised at all. Anyway, the set of reasons that I could not be an atheist is not necessarily identical to the set of reasons that I am a Christian. Duh.

Nice try. YOU explained it. Now you attempt to backtrack. Lovely.
WRONG YET AGAIN, Zed Male.
"Procreate" means involved along with a "creator". Perhaps you should include an English class when you decide to go get educated. No atheist uses the term "procreate", neither does ANY scientist. Only religious retards suffering from delusional Presuppositionalism. The word is "reproduction".

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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06-02-2014, 08:15 PM
RE: CHRIST'S TOMB
Bucky Ball, I must say you put a very narrow definition on "procreate". Certainly not one that I accept as the common usage of the term. Not that I disagree in general with your point of view but I think you are being a bit fastidious in this case of definition. Damn I love big words even when I have to check out the spelling.
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