Can a conservative be an atheist?
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10-08-2017, 08:23 PM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 08:14 PM)reeveseb Wrote:  
(10-08-2017 06:45 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Nah. Not just you.

This section of the forum comes under the category of The Heavy Stuff so it can get, well, heavy sometimes.

We have a diverse bunch here and many enjoy vigorous debate (with appropriate amounts of sulphuric acid). It can be a bit like running the gauntlet when you've just arrived.

Others prefer meandering discussions and sharing ideas, joining dots and we appreciate diversity of opinion.

If you are in the latter group I recommend avoiding the bait that's dangled in your direction... at least until you've got your feet under the table.

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Very good advice. I think spirited debate is fun. I'm still learning though, so maybe I will be a little more cautious with my questions and the forum topics I choose to post under.

Caution be damned. Big Grin It's a perfectly good question and has been asked on TTA a few times recently... to the point that I've been reevaluating my (British) notions of Liberal and Conservative in an attempt to understand where the US vs. UK definitions have diverged (or maybe they haven't and it's my own biases that are confusing me).

Hence the question I asked earlier.

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10-08-2017, 08:49 PM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 06:37 PM)reeveseb Wrote:  I didn't say they had to be perfect. I certainly am not. But at some point I feel a line should be drawn by the governed. How much is too much for taxes? When does it become too much? When they come into our bedrooms? When they dictate how many children we are authorized to have? When they decide who can live or die in a courtroom disregarding the wishes of family members? I am of the opinion the less government is better, to a point. Right now, it's too big (bloated) and wasteful.

The thing is, in US history, not that long ago, Americans got a dose of "no" government, when the idiot Gingrich shut down the government over the budget. He lost his job, and power. And for years, Republicans stopped talking about "too much government". It's nice to piss and moan when we have enough government. If your area had a natural disaster, a bridge collapse, and no FEMA, you'd be pissing and moaning about "where was the government". It's easy to say ''things are too bloated" with no specifics. If it were that easy, there wouldn't be such contention.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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10-08-2017, 08:53 PM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 07:38 PM)reeveseb Wrote:  
(10-08-2017 07:04 PM)Dom Wrote:  Note that I put "lazy" in quotes. Not sure how you are going to actually determine whether someone is lazy.

I think I am lazy. I have always provided for myself, but I am a lazy cook, a lazy gardener, a lazy many things. I like being lazy. I like putting my feet up and having some coffee and reading a good book. I am not driven to be active all the time.

Now, I assume you don't mean me or my lazy compadres, but the "lazy" people you refer to are people on welfare? How will you figure out which ones are the lazy ones that deserve to die of famine and disease?

Nobody is (yet) forced to do things at gunpoint in this country, at least not legally.

I get your point. But I don't think anyone reading that would mean someone who kicks back in a recliner after a long day at work to enjoy a beer. I'm talking about the guy in California who was asked why he stays in welfare. He responded saying it's all he really needed and he wouldn't be able to surf and hang out with his friends if he got a job. Another one who said she doesn't feel like she should have to work because she's an artist and people should take care of her so she can continue exploring her "talents". Determining who is or isn't "lazy" is somewhat of a problem, but one that I'm certain can be worked through. Maybe not to everyone's liking, but I think the majority could be persuaded. Welfare isn't supposed to be a lifetime of dependence. It's supposed to be a short-term hand up. Teach to fish.

In general, people like this don't get welfare. They may have lied on their applications. At least as far as MA for paying hospital bills, I see strict enforcement.
And in fact, who did the last major welfare reform in the US ? William Jefferson Clinton's administration. Tongue

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10-08-2017, 09:37 PM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 06:33 PM)Lackluster Wrote:  According to people like you, we white males are just supposed to commit suicide to appease every other culture or else we're being "racist", "sexist", and every other kind of "ist".


Exaggerating much? Would be nice if you could back this hysterical assertion somehow.

Quote: We can't have any pride for who we are or it's "white supremacy" or "racism".


Being proud of being white is just fucking stupid.

Quote: I mean, never mind that black on black crime is astronomically disproportionate in this country, or that muslims beat their women for unveiling themselves or trying to learn to read. White, male, American's are the racist, sexist, imperialist, pigs!


So alleged wrongs of others mean that white people can't be bad?

No matter how you cut it some are sexist and imperialist.


All in all want some cheesse with that whine?

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10-08-2017, 09:43 PM (This post was last modified: 10-08-2017 09:48 PM by jerry mcmasters.)
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 08:53 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(10-08-2017 07:38 PM)reeveseb Wrote:  I get your point. But I don't think anyone reading that would mean someone who kicks back in a recliner after a long day at work to enjoy a beer. I'm talking about the guy in California who was asked why he stays in welfare. He responded saying it's all he really needed and he wouldn't be able to surf and hang out with his friends if he got a job. Another one who said she doesn't feel like she should have to work because she's an artist and people should take care of her so she can continue exploring her "talents". Determining who is or isn't "lazy" is somewhat of a problem, but one that I'm certain can be worked through. Maybe not to everyone's liking, but I think the majority could be persuaded. Welfare isn't supposed to be a lifetime of dependence. It's supposed to be a short-term hand up. Teach to fish.

In general, people like this don't get welfare. They may have lied on their applications.

You may have just given the game away.

EDIT: Ok I have edited this three times and the "Preview Post" looks fine and then then I post and the actual post looks completely different. All I am doing is bolding the part where Bucky says They may have lied on their applications. Trying again...
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11-08-2017, 12:38 AM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 09:43 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  
(10-08-2017 08:53 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  In general, people like this don't get welfare. They may have lied on their applications.

You may have just given the game away.

EDIT: Ok I have edited this three times and the "Preview Post" looks fine and then then I post and the actual post looks completely different. All I am doing is bolding the part where Bucky says They may have lied on their applications. Trying again...

If the quote is long, forum collapses it automagically. You can see the bolding if you click to expand it.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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11-08-2017, 12:51 AM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
This has probably been covered already but...

Yes, you can. The two positions are entirely unrelated. Atheism is only concerned with the lack of belief in deities, whatever they are, and nothing more.

I'm not really too concerned with whether someone identifies as "a liberal" or "a conservative". I just listen to their views on whatever subject we're talking about. I find any kind of over-identification to be dogmatic and dangerous. I might agree with "liberals" on some things and "conservatives" on others. I take each issue on its merits.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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11-08-2017, 05:29 AM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(11-08-2017 12:51 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  This has probably been covered already but...

Yes, you can. The two positions are entirely unrelated. Atheism is only concerned with the lack of belief in deities, whatever they are, and nothing more.

I'm not really too concerned with whether someone identifies as "a liberal" or "a conservative". I just listen to their views on whatever subject we're talking about. I find any kind of over-identification to be dogmatic and dangerous. I might agree with "liberals" on some things and "conservatives" on others. I take each issue on its merits.

You're right in a technical sense. Unrelated. However, the question was posted because there seems to be an undeniable link between atheists and those who fall to the left of center in their beliefs. I was curious to know what others thought.

I agree with your assessment on labels. I think breaking away from my self-imposed labels is probably the best, yet hardest thing to do, but necessary to continue to grow and learn.

It pays to keep an open mind, but not so open your brains fall out.
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11-08-2017, 05:33 AM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 08:06 PM)Lackluster Wrote:  
(10-08-2017 06:39 PM)Vera Wrote:  Says the person who came LYING he wanted to commit suicide because he isn't getting any. Not getting any from pretty women (even though women are nasty hypocrites), mind you, none of those desperate ones for me, on sirree Drinking Beverage
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11-08-2017, 07:15 AM
RE: Can a conservative be an atheist?
(10-08-2017 08:53 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(10-08-2017 07:38 PM)reeveseb Wrote:  I get your point. But I don't think anyone reading that would mean someone who kicks back in a recliner after a long day at work to enjoy a beer. I'm talking about the guy in California who was asked why he stays in welfare. He responded saying it's all he really needed and he wouldn't be able to surf and hang out with his friends if he got a job. Another one who said she doesn't feel like she should have to work because she's an artist and people should take care of her so she can continue exploring her "talents". Determining who is or isn't "lazy" is somewhat of a problem, but one that I'm certain can be worked through. Maybe not to everyone's liking, but I think the majority could be persuaded. Welfare isn't supposed to be a lifetime of dependence. It's supposed to be a short-term hand up. Teach to fish.

In general, people like this don't get welfare. They may have lied on their applications. At least as far as MA for paying hospital bills, I see strict enforcement.
And in fact, who did the last major welfare reform in the US ? William Jefferson Clinton's administration. Tongue

Lol. Nice revision of history.

Welfare reform was passed by the Republican controlled congress. Welfare reform was written by republicans. Clinton wanted welfare reform but he never came to the table with a plan. In fact, Clinton vetoed the first two welfare reform bills that the congress passed because they "went too far" and he even complained that the one he eventually signed was too "conservative." Most of the "no" votes were democrats. 165 out of 170 no votes in the house were democrats and 24 out of 25 no votes in the Senate were democrats.

Clinton nor democrats reformed welfare.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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