Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
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04-03-2017, 04:31 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 04:30 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  As I stated before, Jesus says He came to fulfill the law and the prophets, not to destroy. Therefore, if it can be shown that they were fulfilled by Him, then it is evidence to His saying being true.

Using the OT, which you just called jewish fables. If they are fables there's nothing to fulfill. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
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04-03-2017, 04:42 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
This is a conversation on me joining this forum I've had the past few days with an atheist friend from another site who has been a part of debates over the past 7 years.

Quote: Me
I got bored with the Trump thread on Scribblers. Was looking for some other outlet to inspire me to write again.
Facing the same opposition as I did in the beginning on authonomy, but some atheists and agnostics usually seem more exceptive eventually to what I share than do Christians. Tongue
They can also ask very good questions.

Quote:her
That's because what you have to say doesn't feel like an existential threat atheists/agnostics, where a lot of the Christians you find yourself talking to online are conservative evangelicals with an exclusive fundamentalist doctrine. It's literally against their religion to tolerate other beliefs or views.

These kinds of groups tend to treat in-group heretics even more punitively than members of an enemy out-group because they're not only in opposition to the doctrine of the group, they threaten the group's internal cohesion. You identify as Christian, but you're the wrong kind of Christian; they gotta make an example of you to keep the others in line. (It's not just religion, you see the same kind of rhetoric around "race-traitors".)

I've made quite a few friends with agnostics, atheists, and people who beleive something else over these years.

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04-03-2017, 04:48 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 04:31 PM)abaris Wrote:  Using the OT, which you just called jewish fables. If they are fables there's nothing to fulfill. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
If it was ascribed to God, then Jesus was determined to fulfill it. It would be contrary to His character to not do this. If He simply said, "My Father didn't do any of those things your ancestors wrote He did" then that would be an act of destruction and against what He had spoken. His opposition and dislike of hypocrisy would then be hypocritical itself. Integrity is His character trait, therefore what He said He does.
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04-03-2017, 04:51 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 04:48 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  If it was ascribed to God, then Jesus was determined to fulfill it. It would be contrary to His character to not do this. If He simply said, "My Father didn't do any of those things your ancestors wrote He did" then that would be an act of destruction and against what He had spoken. His opposition and dislike of hypocrisy would then be hypocritical itself. Integrity is His character trait, therefore what He said He does.

OK, you said that.

(04-03-2017 04:24 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  I don't believe the Jewish fables recorded in the Bible to be true, thus I don't believe the epic of Gilgamesh is true.

So what prophecies out of fables were there to fulfill?

And secondly, do you believe in the trinity? If so, was Jesus god? The one and only god?
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04-03-2017, 05:00 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 04:51 PM)abaris Wrote:  
(04-03-2017 04:48 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  I don't believe the Jewish fables recorded in the Bible to be true, thus I don't believe the epic of Gilgamesh is true.

So what prophecies out of fables were there to fulfill?

And secondly, do you believe in the trinity? If so, was Jesus god? The one and only god?

I also want to know this, Harold.

Why do you believe that Jesus is the fulfillment of Jewish prophecies? Do you have an example of Jewish prophecy that you think Jesus fulfilled?
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04-03-2017, 05:02 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 05:00 PM)Aliza Wrote:  I also want to know this, Harold.

Why do you believe that Jesus is the fulfillment of Jewish prophecies? Do you have an example of Jewish prophecy that you think Jesus fulfilled?

These being fables by his own admission. Don't open doors that aren't there.
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04-03-2017, 05:16 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 03:23 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  It is evidence that what I posted earlier that the origins of many, if not all, of the religions have are the same, namely Sumerian. These tales where adapted and modified to fit the political climate and society in each distinctive area.

With the Hebrew stories and the later Christian stories being no exception to that rule.

(04-03-2017 03:29 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  Which gospels were chosen and what order they were placed in that matches so closely to what was written concerning Moses is evidence of guidance in the matter.

No, it is not evidence of guidance. You can't just claim that you know why particular decisions were made unless you can demonstrate that (a) there is such a guiding force, (b) it operated in this case, and © no other option is reasonably possible. Your assumption that it was guided and that your particular god did the guiding is pure speculation. It's theology, not science, and not reason.

Specific causation needs to be demonstrable. You have nothing except faith and faith is not a path to truth.

(04-03-2017 04:13 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  I am only arguing that the words attributed to Jesus are true.

Prove it. It's time to shit or get off the pot. First prove that Jesus actually existed, then that he actually said any of the things attributed to him. Good luck with that since there are exactly zero contemporary references.

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04-03-2017, 05:19 PM (This post was last modified: 04-03-2017 05:24 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 04:21 PM)hecrow55 Wrote:  The End Times Jesus speaks of is the Jewish belief that there would be an ending to the Mosaic law by it being fulfilled thus the beginning of the Messianic period. This did take place and is recorded in the scriptures with supporting evidence in the Roman historian reports of the growth of Christianity. Which is another self-similar event with Moses.

Totally false.
That's not what Jews thought was to happen. They NEVER thought there would be an end to the Mosaic Law. No Jew would agree with that.
The Messiah (and only some Jews were *messianic Jews) was to re-establish the Kingdom. Jesus said "THIS generation shall not pass away until all these things have happened."
The Kingdom is not re-established. Stop lying.

Quote:The generation that followed Moses into the wilderness perished before entering into the promised land. The Prophet like unto Moses also had a generation that would perish before realizing the coming of the Kingdom (The Bible).

More lies. The Bible does not say that. Moses was never "in the wilderness".
Moses was a myth,
"The Bible" .... hahahahahahaha

You cherry-pick your Bible verses. You have never once told us what your criteria are by which you determine something is true or not, and then you have the balls to claim it's "scientific".
You are a fraud.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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04-03-2017, 05:23 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
!!!TO HECROW55!!!

Thanks for the story. But I didn't understand: What did you learn exactly? This: "Every man of the children of Israel shall pitch by his own standard, with the ensign of their father's house: "?

English is my second language.
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04-03-2017, 05:27 PM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(04-03-2017 05:23 PM)Alla Wrote:  !!!TO HECROW55!!!

Thanks for the story. But I didn't understand: What did you learn exactly? This: "Every man of the children of Israel shall pitch by his own standard, with the ensign of their father's house: "?

Joseph having to go to Bethlehem for the census because that was the home of his heritage. Self-similar to what was written about the Israelites' having to pitch by the standard that depicted their father's house.
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