Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
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05-03-2017, 07:20 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(05-03-2017 06:55 AM)hecrow55 Wrote:  I told all of you that it would be done soon. Patience is a virtue.

So is not lying. You know, not pretending to know things you do not actually know to be a fact. Too bad that seems to be beyond your reach.

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05-03-2017, 07:37 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
Re: My post on what the Jewish belief about the End Times being the end of the Mosaic Law and the beginning of Messianic era.

This is from the Jewish site:

What Is the Jewish Belief About Moshiach?

What is the “End of Days”?

The term “End of Days” is taken from Numbers 24:14. This has always been taken as a reference to the messianic era. Here we shall explore—albeit briefly—the Jewish belief in the coming of Moshiach.

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cd...f-Days.htm

The complete answer is a very interesting read. Speaks of the prophets Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Amos, Joel and Hosea all refer to the messianic era.
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05-03-2017, 07:38 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
Time for service. Will go into the fable of Adam and Eve later today.
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05-03-2017, 07:44 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(05-03-2017 07:38 AM)hecrow55 Wrote:  Time for service. Will go into the fable of Adam and Eve later today.

Cool story bro. I'll be sure to rub one out for you while you're gone. Thumbsup

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05-03-2017, 08:41 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(05-03-2017 06:53 AM)hecrow55 Wrote:  Science involves producing evidence obtained either by observation or experimentation. I'm sharing only that which I've observed. That it is not what is the traditional teachings of the Christian or Jewish religions doesn't matter.

It does matter, as you know nothing about the culture that produced the literature. You're connecting random dots. It's NOT science as you have no METHOD and no established criteria. Not only are you a scholar of NOTHING, you also don't even begin to know how science works. Science is not connecting random observations. This garbage is not science. You are a fraud.

Quote:Evidence testifies to what is true or not. And truth doesn't require anyone to believe it for it to be the truth. It will always be the truth.

Random connections are evidence of nothing. Nothing is true because a non-expert claims it's true. Your entire main premise that something written long before something else makes something later true is complete bullshit. You have in no way established the basis for all this random crap.

Quote:Whether or not you or others consider what I share as evidence is irrelevant.

You are not "sharing" anything. You lied, and lied repeatedly. You are a dishonest FRAUD. You ASKED a question in the OP, and you have never even attempted to answer it. You don't know how stupid it is. It's NOT SCIENCE. You refuse to answer the questions posed to you. Then you self-righteously do all thus bullshit of "in the love of Christ" crap. You fool no one here. No one here buys your snake oil. You are incompetent, dishonest and delusional. No one here believes your garbage. You obviously have no education in the field you pretend to be expert in.

Connecting dots between two sets of fiction, does not make fiction true. Connecting dots between two myths is NOT SCIENCE. Your premise and foundation is false. You're wasting your time and your life. You are the typical pathetic internet nut case who thinks he's an expert in something others missed. You're not.

Claiming stupid shit like the fables had 4 books and there are now 4 gospels constitutes evidence of something is utterly preposterous nonsense. Your"observations" are not evidence, you have no methods or expertise and this crap is not science. You've convinced no one of anything.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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05-03-2017, 08:54 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
So... he's just here to parade around what he considers evidence, regardless of whether it meeting any scientific standard? What a waste of time. No one is stopping him believing stuff, based on weak or even no evidence.

What discussion is to be had?

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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05-03-2017, 09:35 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
None at all, if people quit responding to his idiocy.
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05-03-2017, 10:39 AM (This post was last modified: 05-03-2017 10:42 AM by mordant.)
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(05-03-2017 08:54 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  So... he's just here to parade around what he considers evidence, regardless of whether it meeting any scientific standard? What a waste of time. No one is stopping him believing stuff, based on weak or even no evidence.

What discussion is to be had?
None.

It is VERY common in faith traditions to confuse systematic study (invariably using a fundamentally flawed system) with "being scientific" about it. Invariably, theists who claim to be "scientific" or "objective" or "intellectual" have near-zero understanding of what any of those things actually are.

The fundamental problem with virtually all systems of religious study is that they are founded on a failed epistemology, namely, religious faith -- the acceptance of asserted truth with no requirement of evidence and, indeed, no decent evidentiary standards and therefore NO way to distinguish dogma / theology / doctrine / scriptural interpretation from their imagination.

Another manifestation of this is the faux "discipline" of theology. It is simply a formalization of dogma and an attempt at high-minded sounding apologetics / justification for it. My go-to tome back in the day was Lewis Sperry Chafer's Systematic Theology, and bound sets of it were prized possessions of all our ministerial students particularly. But that bound set would be laughed out of court at Princeton or Yale or indeed any theological cemetery -- er, seminary -- outside of the evangelical world. It would not be acceptable to Seventh Day Adventists, Catholics, Mormons, JWs, and most liberal Christians. It would have certain conclusions that would be out of vogue at Fuller or Talbot, even if acceptable in broad terms.

If there were such a thing as "systematic" (let alone "scientific") theology, there would be NO such disagreements. It is arguably true that you can get both broad and deep agreement within one of countless conflicting interpretive SYSTEMS, but not within Christianity, much less within the Abrahamic faiths, much less worldwide. There is no unified theory of faith beliefs, and therefore, inherently, most of the world at any given point in time must have mistaken beliefs*. It is a useless system and understanding it in some definitive way is a fool's errand.

* Of course each acolyte of a particular interpretive system thinks all others are mistaken. We atheists just take it one step further and acknowledge that they are ALL mistaken.
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05-03-2017, 11:35 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(05-03-2017 10:39 AM)mordant Wrote:  If there were such a thing as "systematic" (let alone "scientific") theology, there would be NO such disagreements.

I keep telling religious people they should get their act together among themselves before they try to preach to atheists, but no one listens. Dodgy
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05-03-2017, 11:59 AM
RE: Can the study of scripture be done in a scientific way?
(05-03-2017 11:35 AM)Jay Vogelsong Wrote:  
(05-03-2017 10:39 AM)mordant Wrote:  If there were such a thing as "systematic" (let alone "scientific") theology, there would be NO such disagreements.

I keep telling religious people they should get their act together among themselves before they try to preach to atheists, but no one listens. Dodgy

The problem is that they think they do have their act together. They really think that if they show some way that the bible could be interpreted in a consistent manner then we'd have to accept that that makes it automatically true because... well, Jesus (or Mohammed or Vishnu or...). It's like the whole process of critical thinking is just turned off when they think about their religion; they understand how it works with other scriptures so it's not lack of intelligence or ability... it's just baffling to me when they can't apply it to their own. Compartmentalization is a hell of a thing.

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