Can we all agree on some government programs?
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30-10-2012, 08:15 PM
Can we all agree on some government programs?
I think the role of the government should be to offer aid and support to those who don't have the means to support themselves. I was wondering if we can come to agreement (on this forum) of necessary programs that the government should have.

I'll start with an obvious one in the wake of Katrina and now Sandy: FEMA

Individuals affected by global disasters need help and money. Most people aren't lucky enough to have enough in the bank to rebuild their entire house. People need food, temporary shelter, water, medical aid, etc. I think this is the easiest one to start with as far as coming to an agreement.


The next one, I think, would be the FDA. Though I think it needs a serious restructuring.

The idea of a group in charge of fact checking claims put forth by mega-corporations trying to make money off people is a great idea. But instead of just telling us what's in each food item and making sure it's free of poisons, the FDA should ban companies from using misleading claims. "Energy drinks" should have warnings that it's just a can of sugar. "Health foods" loaded with crap should be made obvious, such as "granola bars" that are just sugar and chocolate.


And to pay for whatever programs we put in place, we'll need some sort of tax organization. Definitely not the IRS, because they carry the stigma of being a hybrid of the mafia mixed with the Spanish Inquisition. At times, they seem to be a super power that transcends all other laws, like the Catholic Church at the height of its power. You can't question the word of the IRS.


Thoughts? Are roads, public education, and police a go-ahead as well? Or are there better alternatives?

What programs to you are no-brainers?

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30-10-2012, 08:36 PM
RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
I don't think any of those programs are universally agreeable, I certainly do not agree to any of them, but I simply don't have the will to go into all of it tonight. I will respond in detail tomorrow night, but suffice it to say that I am for adherence to the Constitution, and I am an Anti-Federalist, and Libertarian.

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30-10-2012, 09:54 PM
Thumbs Up RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
(30-10-2012 08:36 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  ...but I simply don't have the will to go into all of it tonight. ... I am an Anti-Federalist, and Libertarian.

You're right, you do need some sleep. I'm curious if it's the predictable rambling that deifies the Constitution, and crusades against the big mean "Government". We'll see.

Back to reality.

1. Society requires a central authority, 2. social contract divests powers to said authority, and the 3. authority uses said powers to maintain a social safety net for society. Whether it's through utilities, aid, or referee. The main goal is the well being of society.

I do hope that users will stick to the original topic of the thread and LIST PROGRAMS. If you want to dabble with Anarchy, start a new thread.
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30-10-2012, 09:58 PM
Re: Can we all agree on some government programs?
Butthurt much?
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30-10-2012, 10:20 PM (This post was last modified: 30-10-2012 11:00 PM by PoolBoyG.)
RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
Off the top of my head, which I accept is not complete:

a. Cut subsidies to insanely profitable corporations. Big oil is one example. They make billions in pure profit, and yet some receive subsidies simply because they have the money to lobby for it.
b. Reduce tax cuts for said insanely profitable corporations, and the insanely rich.
c. Block as many of the tax loopholes as possible. No sending money overseas and returning it with not tax.
d. Set up a relevant progressive taxation policy.

This will free up and produce an obscene amount of revenue that will allow one to fund all the programs to your hearts content.

As for programs,
1. Cut the budget to military industries. As above, these are insanely profitable corporations that can lobby for contracts or subsidies that go towards executives and local politicians pockets rather than to the aid of the soldiers.
1b. However, this will be eased. Since the money saved from the cutting this cancerous part of the budget will go to retraining citizens who were employed in these industries.
1c. Drastically increase benefits towards soldiers.
1d. Drastically reduce the size of military bases and deployment abroad, and cutting funding to NATO, and other military groups.
2. Increase educational programs. Every single citizen has the RIGHT to decent, and accessible education.
3. Increase health service programs. Every single citizen has the RIGHT to decent, and accessible healthcare to live a full free life.
4. Increase health and safety regulations for all industries. It's become too lax, and still a good many are trusted to "regulate themselves". No cutting corners in order to squeeze out pennies.
5. Increase subsidies towards environmentally sound, and non-hazardous energies. Allow these industries a leg up in order to thrive.
6. Invest in programs for the maintenance and update of existing infrastructures. Whether it's buildings, roads, bridges, electrical, piping, rail, etc.
7. Cut all programs that deal with spying on citizens, collecting data that isn't approved by the courts.
8. Cut all programs that go towards torture, or secrete military aid in external affairs, etc.
9. Cut the War on Drugs. Cut all programs related to the war on drugs, and ease laws on marijuana.
10. Cut all subsidies towards private prisons. As well as drastically reduce the privatization of prisons.
11. Invest towards towards scientific and space exploratory endeavours.
12. Fund the hell out of oversight committees that will make sure as hell that money gets the hell out of politics. If NONE of these programs or policies are to be listened to, this one must. This returns power back to the citizens, rather than letting it lie with special interests and lobbyists.

Not program based, but change in policy,
-Reduce executive powers that allow them to go to war with slim to no congressional approval.
-Destroy the executives ability to kill domestic or foreign citizens without congressional, or judicial approval. "Targeted killings". How the hell is this even allowed?
-Getting the hell out of privatising or censoring the internet. Hell no.
-If executive powers are still powerful (and insane), consider revising the electoral college. No way in hell can a president that has lost the popular vote be allowed into an office that can kill citizens without congressional or judicial approval.

There's a depressing amount to add and cut. I'm kicking the ball to other users, but will add more if I come up with more and if other users haven't, or if I care to.
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30-10-2012, 10:36 PM
RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
FEMA yes, but people who build homes, or refuse to move from flood plains, or, as will be increasingly the case with rising oceans, refuse to move to safe places, should be told there will be no rescue, and no subsidy of stupid decisions.

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30-10-2012, 10:51 PM
RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
(30-10-2012 10:36 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  FEMA yes, but people who build homes, or refuse to move from flood plains, or, as will be increasingly the case with rising oceans, refuse to move to safe places, should be told there will be no rescue, and no subsidy of stupid decisions.

The government in most cases subsidies rebuilding in hurricane/tornado/flood zones. I'd rather much that was used that to invest in weather proofing, or updating infrastructure (flood levees for one) or to relocate citizens, instead of paying contractors to build over and over again. These aren't wealthy and mobile people; programs should do the best they can to provide the resources to help them relocate, and to find new jobs, and lives if worst comes to worst.
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30-10-2012, 11:23 PM
RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
Quote:the FDA should ban companies from using misleading claims. "Energy drinks" should have warnings that it's just a can of sugar.

Bloody hell you guys are so far behind on so many things.
*looks at energy drink nearby*
"Caution high caffeine content.
Not recommended for Pregnant or Lactating women and individuals sensitive to caffeine"

And everything has to list not only the ingredients but have a little table on the packaging telling total sugar/energy/sodium and a few other things as well as per 100ml. This drink contains 10.7g of sugar (per 100ml). 196kj of energy. 0 fat/protein. 52mg of sodium. 32mg of caffeine. 400mg of taurine. etc.. etc.. Contains 981kj of energy and it says recommended daily energy intake is 8700kj.

Do you not have any labeling like that?

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31-10-2012, 01:10 AM
RE: Can we all agree on some government programs?
(30-10-2012 11:23 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
Quote:the FDA should ban companies from using misleading claims. "Energy drinks" should have warnings that it's just a can of sugar.

Bloody hell you guys are so far behind on so many things.
*looks at energy drink nearby*
"Caution high caffeine content.
Not recommended for Pregnant or Lactating women and individuals sensitive to caffeine"

And everything has to list not only the ingredients but have a little table on the packaging telling total sugar/energy/sodium and a few other things as well as per 100ml. This drink contains 10.7g of sugar (per 100ml). 196kj of energy. 0 fat/protein. 52mg of sodium. 32mg of caffeine. 400mg of taurine. etc.. etc.. Contains 981kj of energy and it says recommended daily energy intake is 8700kj.

Do you not have any labeling like that?

No, we have the exact same thing. But the warnings are in fine print, hidden somewhere on the back. Plus there are ways to manipulate things to appear healthy. I'm looking at a can right now, it boasts on the front that it contains Vitamin-B, Taurine, Ginseng, and all this other crap to convince you that it's a vitamin filled health drink that gives you natural energy. The actual content is buried in a sea of text near the bottling factory information: 13mg of Taurine, 12mg of Ginseng, etc. These are insignificant amounts, only put in the can for the purpose of misinformation. As a lifter, I know that 5 grams of Creatine is optimal for the chemical to do its job. Yet I see drinks containing a couple of milligrams, trying to fool you into thinking you're not drinking pure sugar.

They're use key phrases like "all natural" or "whole grain" when that's not exactly true. They'll boast that there's "No High Fructose Corn Syrup!" and the 2nd main ingredient is Sugar. They've just changed the type of sugar in the face of all the negative press that HFCS has been receiving.

All I'm asking for is honesty.


And I'm drunk off Shock Top "End of the World Midnight Wheat" beer, so this may not make that much sense.

"Ain't got no last words to say, yellow streak right up my spine. The gun in my mouth was real and the taste blew my mind."

"We see you cry. We turn your head. Then we slap your face. We see you try. We see you fail. Some things never change."
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