Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
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22-06-2016, 10:40 AM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 07:25 AM)tomilay Wrote:  I am thinking run of the mill suicide is illegal because it rarely ONLY affects the perp. It usually comes with costs. Mental, social and financial.

Alcoholism isn't illegal, but it carves swathes of destruction through families and across generations.

Also, what are the social effects you have in mind that justify a legal ban?
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22-06-2016, 12:41 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
It's a good decission I think. Everybody should have right to die with dignity and end own suffering when one deem it is time to do it.

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22-06-2016, 02:10 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 10:40 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 07:25 AM)tomilay Wrote:  I am thinking run of the mill suicide is illegal because it rarely ONLY affects the perp. It usually comes with costs. Mental, social and financial.

Alcoholism isn't illegal, but it carves swathes of destruction through families and across generations.

Also, what are the social effects you have in mind that justify a legal ban?

The effects I had in mind, was the example I gave earlier. An extremely frustrated dad, breadwinner, husband, shoots himself. It brings closure to his frustrations. And also opens a can of worms for those left behind.

One can say that is none of their(the family's) business. Whether that is correct or not, people still feel the pain. Lives get screwed up. In some cases, it can be argued that the departed leaves more pain than they felt.

I get it that this type of suicide may not be representative, but tends to be more in the news, according to Dom. I don't know the numbers. But there seem to be good reasons to prevent people, or at least some of them, from killing themselves.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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22-06-2016, 02:27 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 02:10 PM)tomilay Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:40 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Alcoholism isn't illegal, but it carves swathes of destruction through families and across generations.

Also, what are the social effects you have in mind that justify a legal ban?

The effects I had in mind, was the example I gave earlier. An extremely frustrated dad, breadwinner, husband, shoots himself. It brings closure to his frustrations. And also opens a can of worms for those left behind.

One can say that is none of their(the family's) business. Whether that is correct or not, people still feel the pain. Lives get screwed up. In some cases, it can be argued that the departed leaves more pain than they felt.

I get it that this type of suicide may not be representative, but tends to be more in the news, according to Dom. I don't know the numbers. But there seem to be good reasons to prevent people, or at least some of them, from killing themselves.

None of these laws ever include anyone who is not terminal. I am saying the term terminal is applied too tightly. And that is up for discussion.

No one wants anyone to kill themselves on a whim, or because their girlfriend dumped them, or because they are upset about something. No long term solutions for short term problems.

But for those whose life has become a daily struggle and everything will only get worse because their bodies are failing, they should be able to decide about their own life. Being sentenced to years of suffering is cruel punishment of an innocent person.

Who owns your life?

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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22-06-2016, 02:51 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 02:27 PM)Dom Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 02:10 PM)tomilay Wrote:  The effects I had in mind, was the example I gave earlier. An extremely frustrated dad, breadwinner, husband, shoots himself. It brings closure to his frustrations. And also opens a can of worms for those left behind.

One can say that is none of their(the family's) business. Whether that is correct or not, people still feel the pain. Lives get screwed up. In some cases, it can be argued that the departed leaves more pain than they felt.

I get it that this type of suicide may not be representative, but tends to be more in the news, according to Dom. I don't know the numbers. But there seem to be good reasons to prevent people, or at least some of them, from killing themselves.

None of these laws ever include anyone who is not terminal. I am saying the term terminal is applied too tightly. And that is up for discussion.

No one wants anyone to kill themselves on a whim, or because their girlfriend dumped them, or because they are upset about something. No long term solutions for short term problems.

But for those whose life has become a daily struggle and everything will only get worse because their bodies are failing, they should be able to decide about their own life. Being sentenced to years of suffering is cruel punishment of an innocent person.

Who owns your life?
Dom,

I get that about these laws in place. Thumpalumpacus brought up the sub-text of legalizing suicide in general. It's what made me take this tangent. That's all.

That said, I am kind of undecided about the terminal patient thing. The irreversible nature of death. I'd vote against it in a referendum. If I am old in that situation, I'd tough it out; but I speak only for myself.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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22-06-2016, 03:08 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 02:51 PM)tomilay Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 02:27 PM)Dom Wrote:  None of these laws ever include anyone who is not terminal. I am saying the term terminal is applied too tightly. And that is up for discussion.

No one wants anyone to kill themselves on a whim, or because their girlfriend dumped them, or because they are upset about something. No long term solutions for short term problems.

But for those whose life has become a daily struggle and everything will only get worse because their bodies are failing, they should be able to decide about their own life. Being sentenced to years of suffering is cruel punishment of an innocent person.

Who owns your life?
Dom,

I get that about these laws in place. Thumpalumpacus brought up the sub-text of legalizing suicide in general. It's what made me take this tangent. That's all.

That said, I am kind of undecided about the terminal patient thing. The irreversible nature of death. I'd vote against it in a referendum. If I am old in that situation, I'd tough it out; but I speak only for myself.

It boils down to: who owns your life?

It is your choice to tough it out, it is your choice to use or not to use medical help, and it is your choice to live or die.

It's your own life, only yours. Otherwise it's slavery.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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22-06-2016, 03:47 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 03:08 PM)Dom Wrote:  It's your own life, only yours. Otherwise it's marriage.

fixt. Big Grin

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22-06-2016, 03:56 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 03:47 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 03:08 PM)Dom Wrote:  It's your own life, only yours. Otherwise it's marriage.

fixt. Big Grin

Hahaha!

Jokes aside, the way things are, we better have a partner who will stand by us and help us to cope with things as we see fit when the time comes. So often grief stricken loved ones just can't let go. So selfish, make someone suffer hour after hour because relatives don't want to face reality...

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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22-06-2016, 04:09 PM
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 02:25 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  I believe it is illegal to commit suicide for insurance purposes.
ie: You can't take out a half million dollar life insurance and off yourself the next day and expect the insurance company to pay out.

FEGLI covers suicide.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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22-06-2016, 08:06 PM (This post was last modified: 22-06-2016 08:12 PM by Thumpalumpacus.)
RE: Canada Legalizes Physician-Assisted Dying
(22-06-2016 02:10 PM)tomilay Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:40 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Alcoholism isn't illegal, but it carves swathes of destruction through families and across generations.

Also, what are the social effects you have in mind that justify a legal ban?

The effects I had in mind, was the example I gave earlier. An extremely frustrated dad, breadwinner, husband, shoots himself. It brings closure to his frustrations. And also opens a can of worms for those left behind.

One can say that is none of their(the family's) business. Whether that is correct or not, people still feel the pain. Lives get screwed up. In some cases, it can be argued that the departed leaves more pain than they felt.

I get it that this type of suicide may not be representative, but tends to be more in the news, according to Dom. I don't know the numbers. But there seem to be good reasons to prevent people, or at least some of them, from killing themselves.

And how would you command people to stay alive?

As for the repercussions you claim to have mentioned, they are familial and not socal, which was the gist of my question.

It is no business of government to determine the time, place, or method of a person's death.

That's my opinion, feel free to change my mind. But don't ask me to allow government interference in every family matter.
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