Case for christ for kids
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24-09-2015, 01:08 PM
RE: Case for christ for kids
I feel for you man. You mention you want your son to believe based on good evidence, not bad, but to us there is no good evidence so unless you can supply a book of your own with good evidence for christ... Is your wife buying this book for your son as a result of him saying he didn't believe in god?
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24-09-2015, 02:36 PM
RE: Case for christ for kids
No offense to your wife, but I consider childhood indoctrination child abuse. I would strike up a deal with a religious partner of "Let the kid decide for themself." Even with an atheist partner I would have the same deal. Basically teach the kid how to think, then show the kid what is (the existence of religion and the existence of non-religion). No matter how right you think/know you are, the kid should be the one to make the choice.

I prefer fantasy, but I have to live in reality.
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24-09-2015, 02:42 PM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(24-09-2015 02:36 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  No offense to your wife, but I consider childhood indoctrination child abuse. I would strike up a deal with a religious partner of "Let the kid decide for themself." Even with an atheist partner I would have the same deal. Basically teach the kid how to think, then show the kid what is (the existence of religion and the existence of non-religion). No matter how right you think/know you are, the kid should be the one to make the choice.

Nah, is a fine line to walk but not child abuse IMO. If parent is genuinely worried that kid is gonna be bit by a snake, does he waste time thinking "Fuck, I better let the kid decide"? Fuck no. So although I consider religion detrimental, cannot consider it abuse. Abuse... I call it abuse if it's done with deliberate intent to harm.

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-09-2015, 05:02 PM (This post was last modified: 24-09-2015 05:05 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Case for christ for kids
This is an excellent opportunity to introduce your progeny to logic and logical fallacies. No need to be proactive and piss off the wife, he'll come to you with the questions.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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25-09-2015, 10:50 AM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(24-09-2015 10:58 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  "Yes, dear, you can give it to him, after I annotate it."

Hell if I did that the book would be 3x longer.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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25-09-2015, 10:55 AM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(24-09-2015 01:08 PM)Iñigo Wrote:  I feel for you man. You mention you want your son to believe based on good evidence, not bad, but to us there is no good evidence so unless you can supply a book of your own with good evidence for christ... Is your wife buying this book for your son as a result of him saying he didn't believe in god?

Now that is an excellent question. I really don't know but my gut say she didn't. I know that she wants the kids to believe. The real question is does she want them to believe for good or bad reasons. That one I honestly can't answer because I am not so sure she cares as long as they think it's real. I don't think she is open to changing her mind or even considering the possibility, even in the remotest sense, that she may be wrong. I have asked her directly if Thor showed up and set it all straight whether she would change her mind and she dodged the question.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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25-09-2015, 11:02 AM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(24-09-2015 02:36 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  No offense to your wife, but I consider childhood indoctrination child abuse. I would strike up a deal with a religious partner of "Let the kid decide for themself." Even with an atheist partner I would have the same deal. Basically teach the kid how to think, then show the kid what is (the existence of religion and the existence of non-religion). No matter how right you think/know you are, the kid should be the one to make the choice.

I consider it abuse myself depending on how it's done. If the parent is knowingly giving false information to the child or consciously deceiving the child just to get them into the cookie cutter, then it is child abuse IMO. However, I don't think that a majority of believers even have a clue about what is wrong with these arguments, know the history of the bible, the bible itself, and are not even aware of the lack of evidence to support their claims. I blame ignorant/dishonest pastors and slimy apologists who should and often do know that what they are saying is not true considering how many things that are taught is seminary that aren't passed to the congregation. Whenever a pastor says that biblical slavery was different than pre-civil war slavery, that makes me livid because if they have ever read the book, they know how absolutely false that is. I can't blame the sheep in the pasture for not knowing what the farmer knowingly isn't feeding.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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25-09-2015, 12:00 PM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(25-09-2015 10:50 AM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  
(24-09-2015 10:58 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  "Yes, dear, you can give it to him, after I annotate it."

Hell if I did that the book would be 3x longer.

Oh, I know. I went through TCFC with a highlighter, the idea being to do a chapter-by-chapter demolition for and atheist blog I used to visit.

I dried out a brand-new highlighter within the first 70 pages.

You'd probably have to paper-clip your commentary to the appropriate pages.
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25-09-2015, 12:19 PM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(25-09-2015 12:00 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(25-09-2015 10:50 AM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  Hell if I did that the book would be 3x longer.

Oh, I know. I went through TCFC with a highlighter, the idea being to do a chapter-by-chapter demolition for and atheist blog I used to visit.

I dried out a brand-new highlighter within the first 70 pages.

You'd probably have to paper-clip your commentary to the appropriate pages.

Highlighter was too academic, you should have used crayons.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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25-09-2015, 01:05 PM
RE: Case for christ for kids
(23-09-2015 11:10 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Get the kid a copy of Sagan's 'Demon Haunted World', or just have him watch Steve Shive's take-down of Stobel's book. Give the kid access to good information, and if he has a good grasp on critical thinking, let him sift through the bullshit himself and trust that he'll find the truth when it's presented to him. Neither you, nor your wife, have the right to dictate what your kid thinks. The best you can do is to arm him with the necessary tools to allow him to find his own path; and the better you arm him, the better his chances will be of weeding through the bullshit.

Probably best if you DON'T expose a kid to Steve Shives. Maybe a teenager, but not younger. Steve's awesome in a lot of respect but he don't watch his swears.

....

Actually, if it's a choice between swears and Bible, go with swears.
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