Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
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18-10-2013, 05:41 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 05:28 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Why exactly is my attitude bad? Because I have reasoned that homosexuality is not equivalent to heterosexuality? I'm sorry but it isn't. And because it isn't, there is a rational basis to hold homosexuality in lesser regard.

Boooo. They're not the same, but to say one is lesser than the other and then support legislation saying so is bigoted.

Bigotry, by definition, does mean to disagree with the opinion of others. But it has since come to mean expressing intolerance towards others based on race, gender, sexuality, etc. There is no shame in disagreeing with ideas and viewpoints. You should, however, feel shame in viewing fellow human beings as less than you because of their sexual preference, a view you learned from a religion.

If Jesus died for our sins, why is there still sin? If man was created from dust, why is there still dust? If Americans came from Europe, why are there still Europeans?
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18-10-2013, 05:43 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 04:44 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  If you'd read my post (187) you'd know why your church (I'm assuming you're catholic) ...

HayseedBlowsGirly is no such thing Doc, he's a troll.




#sigh
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18-10-2013, 05:48 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 05:28 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(18-10-2013 05:17 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  RE
"I want to see anti-discrimination laws trash canned."

Good boy, that's a step in the right direction. Now be a real man. Pick up the phone and invite a gay couple around for dinner. They're bound to bring a nice bottle of wine with them.

Then, admit to everyone on this forum that you've had a bad attitude, but you've changed. You'll get a whole lot more respect if you do. You will be happier, and the world will be a better place.

Why exactly is my attitude bad? Because I have reasoned that homosexuality is not equivalent to heterosexuality? I'm sorry but it isn't. And because it isn't, there is a rational basis to hold homosexuality in lesser regard.

Because you upset homosexual people and thereby create divisiveness in society. Homosexual people are our brothers and sisters and they deserve our
love and respect.

You won't admit it, but your opposition to homosexuality goes beyond the rational argument. It is obvious you dislike homosexuals. You don't have any homosexual friends do you?

You might think on rational grounds that Mercedes make better cars than Ford. Yet I'm sure you would not discriminate against someone because they drove a Ford. Yet you will discriminate against homosexuals, won't you? Correct me if I'm wrong.
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18-10-2013, 05:48 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 05:26 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  No, I actually agree they are garbage legislation. I am also against the holocaust denier laws in europe.

Yeah those laws are clear case of bigotry in legislation....but those that pushed those bills into law.....its the right bigotry so that makes it okay.

Anyways back on to the question. Do Catholics have the moral right to legislate against homosexuality? I think Catholics have cause to hold homosexuality in lessor regard, but that is about as far as I can go. I don't think I could make a compelling argument that homosexuality is immoral to this audience.
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18-10-2013, 05:50 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 05:48 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  I don't think I could make a compelling argument that homosexuality is immoral to this audience.

That says a hell of a lot about your argument.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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18-10-2013, 05:59 PM
Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 02:35 PM)Othmar Wrote:  
(18-10-2013 12:22 PM)Crimson Flyboy Wrote:  Civil marriages are certainly not a sacrament, so why should the Catholic Church dictate civil marriage?
I don't think It should. See my earlier post:
(18-10-2013 05:47 AM)Othmar Wrote:  Homosexual (civil) marriages are not (catholic) ecclesiastical marriages. Marriage as the Church understands it is a sacrament uniting a man and a woman. That is completely separate from civil marriages, which are more like a contract granting rights. In Europe, the two 'kinds' of marriage can't even be held at the same time, as seems to be the American custom.

Right on.

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18-10-2013, 06:03 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 05:35 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(18-10-2013 05:28 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Why exactly is my attitude bad? Because I have reasoned that homosexuality is not equivalent to heterosexuality? I'm sorry but it isn't. And because it isn't, there is a rational basis to hold homosexuality in lesser regard.

Nope. Homosexuality is not equivalent to heterosexuality in only one regard, procreation. However that is easily remedied, so it's a moot point. There is no rational basis to hold it in lesser regard.

Even if technology allows homosexuals to reproduce a rational argument can still be made.

Assumption 1: It is better to procreate with someone you love instead of a surrogate.
Assumption 2: Homosexuals cannot procreate with people they love, only with a surrogate.
Assumption 3: Heterosexuals can procreate with people they love without the need of a surrogate.
Conclusion: Therefore it is better to be a heterosexual.

If you accept the assumptions as true. You should put more value on heterosexuality over homosexuality.
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18-10-2013, 06:07 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 06:03 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Even if technology allows homosexuals to reproduce a rational argument can still be made.

Assumption 1: It is better to procreate with someone you love instead of a surrogate.
Assumption 2: Homosexuals cannot procreate with people they love, only with a surrogate.
Assumption 3: Heterosexuals can procreate with people they love without the need of a surrogate.
Conclusion: Therefore it is better to be a heterosexual.

If you accept the assumptions as true. You should put more value on heterosexuality over homosexuality.

Assumption 1: Having a family with someone you love is what matters, not how the family is created. Your assumption is your assumption, not a rational argument.

All of your other assumptions are based on number 1, so I guess I'm done.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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18-10-2013, 06:13 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 05:48 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(18-10-2013 05:28 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Why exactly is my attitude bad? Because I have reasoned that homosexuality is not equivalent to heterosexuality? I'm sorry but it isn't. And because it isn't, there is a rational basis to hold homosexuality in lesser regard.

Because you upset homosexual people and thereby create divisiveness in society. Homosexual people are our brothers and sisters and they deserve our
love and respect.

You won't admit it, but your opposition to homosexuality goes beyond the rational argument. It is obvious you dislike homosexuals. You don't have any homosexual friends do you?

You might think on rational grounds that Mercedes make better cars than Ford. Yet I'm sure you would not discriminate against someone because they drove a Ford. Yet you will discriminate against homosexuals, won't you? Correct me if I'm wrong.

Yeah I would discriminate against homosexuals, I wouldn't choose one as a mate. But I have hired, rather flamboyant homosexuals before based solely on the recommendation of my homosexual friend. I ended up being very happy about his recommendation.

Now suppose the earth was doomed and we built a spaceship to carry 250,000 human beings to some new planet somewhere in another solar system. Further suppose I was the sole judge of who got to go on that ship. There wouldn't be one gay person on it(unless they hid their homosexuality of course).
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18-10-2013, 06:19 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(18-10-2013 06:03 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(18-10-2013 05:35 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  Nope. Homosexuality is not equivalent to heterosexuality in only one regard, procreation. However that is easily remedied, so it's a moot point. There is no rational basis to hold it in lesser regard.

Even if technology allows homosexuals to reproduce a rational argument can still be made.

Assumption 1: It is better to procreate with someone you love instead of a surrogate.
Assumption 2: Homosexuals cannot procreate with people they love, only with a surrogate.
Assumption 3: Heterosexuals can procreate with people they love without the need of a surrogate.
Conclusion: Therefore it is better to be a heterosexual.

If you accept the assumptions as true. You should put more value on heterosexuality over homosexuality.

So you judge everyone by their ability to procreate?

-Hey, does your dick work?
-No, I have an erectile dysfunction
-YOU'RE INFERIOR!!!
- Dodgy

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