Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
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26-02-2015, 02:00 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
Quote:I mean a literal theocracy. The nation ran by the church, whatever era church you would like. If there were an actual possibility of that happening would you support it?

Strictly in the province of Rome, and nowhere else. I mean if it did happen somewhere else, I wouldn't exactly hate it, but I wouldn't try to stop it either.
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26-02-2015, 02:18 PM (This post was last modified: 26-02-2015 02:21 PM by Impulse.)
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 01:56 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  Did you ever consider that the reason they don't report them is because they don't know they're doing it?

If you know and I know, how would the Vatican not know...? Yes, maybe not at first, but once they found out, why didn't they turn them over then?

Edit:
Still think the Vatican didn't know?

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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26-02-2015, 02:56 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 11:47 AM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  ... I don't see a bunch of bureaucrats that retroactively declared themselves as the moral authorities of the entire world based on absolutely nothing, as reliable about anything.

Boy you got that right. That's certainly why I don't pay the Vatican and its Pope any heed.

You weren't referring to them? Well, that statement fits them perfectly. Funny how disparaging statements made about others apply so precisely to the disparager.
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26-02-2015, 03:00 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 01:56 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  
Quote:Pedophiles are criminals. When has anyone in the Catholic church, including those in the Vatican, ever turned a single priest or clergy member over to the police for this crime? Even if it was some rogue branch doing the covering up, the Vatican should step up and order them turned over to the police, but they haven't done so. Why do you suppose that is? Consider

Did you ever consider that the reason they don't report them is because they don't know they're doing it?

This is laughable. There are numerous documented cases where they did know they did it, and instead of taking appropriate action, they just transferred the offender to a different parish -- in effect, giving him a new set of victims. Although I still maintain that this has nothing to do with the validity (or lack of it) of the Catholic faith, it is nevertheless reprehensible.
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26-02-2015, 03:06 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
Quote:If you know and I know, how would the Vatican not know...? Yes, maybe not at first, but once they found out, why didn't they turn them over then?

Maybe because they didn't find out until we did because either they hid themselves doing it, or there was no concrete proof at the time?

Quote:Edit:
Still think the Vatican didn't know?

Uh, the article says that they first defrocked them, and then turned the information into the police. What's wrong with that, exactly?
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26-02-2015, 03:08 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 02:56 PM)Airportkid Wrote:  
(26-02-2015 11:47 AM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  ... I don't see a bunch of bureaucrats that retroactively declared themselves as the moral authorities of the entire world based on absolutely nothing, as reliable about anything.

Boy you got that right. That's certainly why I don't pay the Vatican and its Pope any heed.

You weren't referring to them? Well, that statement fits them perfectly. Funny how disparaging statements made about others apply so precisely to the disparager.

The Vatican's authority is based on God. Even if you don't accept the validity of Christianity, you have to admit they at least 'claim' to have a basis of authority. The U.N. and their subsequent Universal Bill of Human Rights has literally no basis of authority other than "We say so.", it doesn't even claim to have any.
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26-02-2015, 03:39 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 03:06 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  Maybe because they didn't find out until we did because either they hid themselves doing it, or there was no concrete proof at the time?

The article says otherwise, but what would stop them from reporting it when they did find out anyway? They have NEVER done so to date.

(26-02-2015 03:06 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  Uh, the article says that they first defrocked them, and then turned the information into the police. What's wrong with that, exactly?

Reading problems? Here's what it really says:

Quote:The Holy See defrocked 848 priests and slapped 2,572 clergy members with lesser sanction in the past decade

and

Quote:Reports from The Associated Press show that the Vatican addressed 401 cases of sexual abuse last year and about 3,400 cases in the past 10 years.
Quote:Before 2010, few sanctions were imposed on about 100 priestseach year, likely because the Vatican had not directed its bishops and leading clergy to report abuse cases to authorities if local laws required it.

No police involvement. And clearly they knew. Clearly, they didn't even care about local laws on the subject; they were more concerned about protecting themselves.

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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26-02-2015, 03:39 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 12:07 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  
Quote:In fact the entire notion is preposterous. There is no "substance" of a thing, apart from the "thing". The notion that the "substance" of bread and wine are changed into the "substance of something else, is simply meaningless in 2015. It's an ancient dualism that no longer contains any meaning, at all.

No it's still valid. Sorry.

Not because you say it is without a shred of evidence of logic.
Sorry yourself.
Fail.

Vatican II was a validly called Council attended by bishops appointed mostly by PRE-Vatican II popes. To intimate is was not somehow valid is rediculous.
You really are no Catholic are you ?

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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26-02-2015, 04:04 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 03:08 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  
(26-02-2015 02:56 PM)Airportkid Wrote:  Boy you got that right. That's certainly why I don't pay the Vatican and its Pope any heed.

You weren't referring to them? Well, that statement fits them perfectly. Funny how disparaging statements made about others apply so precisely to the disparager.

The Vatican's authority is based on God. Even if you don't accept the validity of Christianity, you have to admit they at least 'claim' to have a basis of authority. The U.N. and their subsequent Universal Bill of Human Rights has literally no basis of authority other than "We say so.", it doesn't even claim to have any.

When you say things like that I have no idea if you actually mean it, or if you're just a troll.
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26-02-2015, 04:09 PM
RE: Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....
(26-02-2015 03:39 PM)Impulse Wrote:  
(26-02-2015 03:06 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  Maybe because they didn't find out until we did because either they hid themselves doing it, or there was no concrete proof at the time?

The article says otherwise, but what would stop them from reporting it when they did find out anyway? They have NEVER done so to date.

(26-02-2015 03:06 PM)PetrovPolak Wrote:  Uh, the article says that they first defrocked them, and then turned the information into the police. What's wrong with that, exactly?

Reading problems? Here's what it really says:

Quote:The Holy See defrocked 848 priests and slapped 2,572 clergy members with lesser sanction in the past decade

and

Quote:Reports from The Associated Press show that the Vatican addressed 401 cases of sexual abuse last year and about 3,400 cases in the past 10 years.
Quote:Before 2010, few sanctions were imposed on about 100 priestseach year, likely because the Vatican had not directed its bishops and leading clergy to report abuse cases to authorities if local laws required it.

No police involvement. And clearly they knew. Clearly, they didn't even care about local laws on the subject; they were more concerned about protecting themselves.

Oh, looks like I misread it. Never mind though, as the article turned out to be mostly crap anyways: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world...n/5227903/
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