Central Banks.
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
05-09-2011, 06:31 PM
Central Banks.
Ok id like people to watch these and then......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dmPchuXIXQ

........tell me what you think???

I have discussed this in great detail on conspiracy forums........and to be honest there lies a certain way of seeing the world in conspiracy.........it can be very paranoid and distrusting, fear mongering is prevelant in content.

So I look forward to hearing maybe more rational neutral views, even arguements against the video will be welcomed by me as I need to hear it to help me make a rational decision.

You're never going to say the things you want to say.
The things you want to change will usually stay that way
The promises you break outweigh the ones you keep.
Paint upon the wall for the hundredth time.

Jesus Jones
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-09-2011, 02:12 AM
RE: Central Banks.
Yes, Zeitgeist explained everything perfectly. The problem is that this is not a conspiracy, this is a known fact, the way all banks in the world do business. If you ever studied economy, this, or at least a part of this is what you would be learning, so there is not much opened for discussion here. I always pay with cash, so that at least nobody can charge something extra for "crediting" me through those cards. I try to avoid banks as much as possible, but all business goes through them, so there is not much escaping there... Unfortunately, nothing will ever change, until we have a worldwide bankrupt and until we make something new, a whole new system like in Star Trek, without any money, in Zeitgeist they called it Project Utopia. Very optimistic name, that says it all...

[Image: a6505fe8.jpg]
I have a theory that the truth is never told during the nine-to-five hours.
-Hunter S. Thompson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Filox's post
06-09-2011, 11:26 AM
RE: Central Banks.
This is more nonsense. Man, I loathe conspiracy theories and people who perpetuate them. They are generally based on just enough truth and facts to get you thinking about them, and make them seem believable, but large parts of the story are left out.

I did not get through the entire video but I watched the first half and saw some factual problems for it. For example, the US Federal Reserve is not lending money to itself so the idea that we are generating money to pay ourselves back, creating endless debt, is wrong. The way the Federal Reserve works is it lends money out to commercial banks and those banks then in turn lend money out to businesses and to people. This money becomes car loans, mortgages, business loans, etc. This type of credit and liquidity keeps the economy moving. What killed the US, and the world's, economy during the Depression was not the massive stock market crash. It was the lack of credit and liquidity in the markets. That was the single biggest problem. So, there is nothing nefarious about how the central banks work, in theory. And, as conspiracies go, one that is done open and notoriously like with a central bank is a pretty poor one. So, based on the almost 3 minutes of this I watched, I think it's just complete crap.

Now, all that said, there are issues with at least the US federal reserve. There is a complete and total lack of accountability and they do have, in my view, way to much power and not nearly enough transparency. Ron Paul has been mentioned on these forums in the past and one of the positions he advocates is more transparency, if not the outright elimination, of the Fed. I think eliminating the central bank is a horrific idea as you can lose all ability to control your currency and economy, but accountability and transparency is never a bad idea. There are plenty of things to complain about with how things are done right now. You don't need some nutty conspiracy theory. Just open your eyes and read a news paper.

One final comment on the US Federal Reserve; I believe in Europe the central banks focus on inflation only. In the US the Fed focuses on both inflation and employment. There is a bit of a conflict between these two concepts, and the US focuses on a "natural rate of unemployment" of about 5% to keep inflation in check. In Europe, legislators manage employment, central banks deal with inflation only and Europe historically has a much higher rate of unemployment than the US (but also a much small percentage of their population in prison which also plays a role I'm sure). I'm not sure if the US way of handling this is better or worst but it is starting to get some attention. My hope is that we will have some intelligent discussions on this and decide whether the Fed should keep both powers or just deal with inflation but my expectation is it will be the typical partisan bickering where both sides say the other is evil, doesn't get it and is waging war on the American tax payer without ever addressing the actual merits of the arguments.

But, as for the so-called "conspiracy"? Whatever. People have way too much time on their hands is all I can say.

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-09-2011, 09:23 AM
RE: Central Banks.
Ive not abandoned this thread guys.......thanks for your answers. Im currently thinking of ways to highlight apsects in neutral ways......so it can be fully open for discussion. I will come back to this.Smile

You're never going to say the things you want to say.
The things you want to change will usually stay that way
The promises you break outweigh the ones you keep.
Paint upon the wall for the hundredth time.

Jesus Jones
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
08-09-2011, 03:11 AM
RE: Central Banks.
What I see in the world economics is that it all functions on debt and on inflation. Those are the two primary things in todays economy, everything functions on imaginary money, if we all would go to the bank and ask for all our money, the bank would have only 10% of that amount. The time when every bank had to have gold reserves for the money they put out is long past, so now we are all running on imaginary money that comes from debt. This is a situation that will crash and it will crash hard when it all comes falling down.

BnW, you said it was all just "more nonsense", but I do not agree. This part about USA's Federal Reserves may or may not be true, that is hard for me and you to claim, but the part about the standard bank business is just what they thought me in college (Economy), so at least half of this "bank and economy" part of Zeitgeist is true and nobody is denying that. This money system cannot last forever, sooner or later the debt will become too large and the "debt bubble" will burst, when that happens, we are all bankrupted.

Of course, let's be real, there is not a slightest chance that anything will change (considering world economics) anytime soon, too much power is involved in all of this, so the only way for anything to happen on a global scale is to wait for the worldwide bankrupt and then get in with some new idea, some new kind of economy.

[Image: a6505fe8.jpg]
I have a theory that the truth is never told during the nine-to-five hours.
-Hunter S. Thompson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
08-09-2011, 04:28 AM
RE: Central Banks.
Fact.......or fiction???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vXgUBxqBQI

He is a god fearing man, although I wont judge him upon that.

You're never going to say the things you want to say.
The things you want to change will usually stay that way
The promises you break outweigh the ones you keep.
Paint upon the wall for the hundredth time.

Jesus Jones
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
08-09-2011, 07:02 AM
RE: Central Banks.
Filox

You missed my point. The part I say is "nonsense" is the conspiracy theory. There is no conspiracy. The banks are doing what they are supposed to do (to a point). There is a lack of transparency and a lack of accountability but that's not quite the same as some secret conspiracy.

Also, regarding this statement:

Quote:What I see in the world economics is that it all functions on debt and on inflation.

That's not quite right. Economies don't function on inflation. It's the other way around; inflation is a result of economies, and specifically growing economies. The way you combat inflation is by increasing the money supply. The problem is that deflationary pressures also tend to hinder economic growth, which can impact job creation. It becomes a balancing act that, to the best of my knowledge, no central bank in the world outside of the US makes on its own. As I said above, I'm not convinced either way if the US is better or worse off due to that. We've traditionally had lower unemployment than the rest of the world but there are a lot of other factors in that.

To your last point, all I can say is that all these crazy conspiracy theories always have enough facts in them to seem plausible. It doesn't make them any less crazy though. You are technically correct that, without gold backing currency, the value of money is somewhat illusory but not completely as it is backed by revenues the government collects from citizens in the form of taxes. So, there is actual value behind it. Sure, there is somewhat of a vicious circle in that as the taxes come from the same money the government creates but the money is a representation of wealth. My economics classes were a long time ago - I graduated college 20 years ago - so I don't recall all the logic on this but it's not really just a fiction. But, the point is that money is not the same as debt and lending money out is not this world wide evil.

What is a problem, though, is spending more than you take in. On that point I fully agree. The US and European democracies are heading for an even bigger crash if they can't get their financial houses in order. What we've seen in Greece and now spreading into the rest of Europe is going to continue to get worse. Governments can't continue to spend more than they take in and not expect to collapse. Our current level of spending is simply not sustainable. That's not a conspiracy, that's just a lack of responsibility.

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
09-09-2011, 03:55 AM
RE: Central Banks.
Well, yeah, I agree that this is not a conspiracy theory as much as normal functioning of banks and the whole monetary system and makes it even worse. But I really like Zeitgeist, I don't look at it as some crazy conspiracy video, it has some interesting points and facts. Is it all true? Probably not, but if only a part of it is true, it is still more than enough to worry about.

[Image: a6505fe8.jpg]
I have a theory that the truth is never told during the nine-to-five hours.
-Hunter S. Thompson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
09-09-2011, 07:27 AM
RE: Central Banks.
There is plenty to worry about when it comes to how economies are being manipulated, no doubt about it. What drives me nuts is when people look for boogeymen instead of just dealing with the real issues we have. We don't need to go searching for some secret cabal out to impoverish us all. We have the not-so-secret Goldman, Sachs who is trying to rob us blind in broad daylight, in full view of the US Department of Justice. And, of course, Obama and the DoJ will do jack-all about them. Money may not buy happiness but several million in campaign contributions can buy freedom from criminal prosecution or liability.

Again, I don't need to believe in some crazy conspiracy theory to be pissed off. I can just read a newspaper.

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: