Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
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13-08-2017, 08:34 AM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
Misogyny, racism and homophobia do seem to go hand in hand with right wing hate groups Sad

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13-08-2017, 09:07 AM (This post was last modified: 13-08-2017 09:24 AM by epronovost.)
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 08:34 AM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Misogyny, racism and homophobia do seem to go hand in hand with right wing hate groups Sad

Many members of those fringe groups are young men who didn't met their own expectation in life. They consider themselves as failures and not all the blame rests on their shoulder. Society can have very high expectation for cisgender white men from the middle class. When they fail, stumble or are simply faced with a string of defeat there is only two course of action: fight or flight. Most of them will keep at it with more reasonnable expectation and maybe work on their weaknesses. Others will be sucked in by those groupuscule and rest the weight of their failure and their dissapointment fully on the heads of others. They aren't celibate because they are mediocre lovers with unrealistic standards, but because women are bitches. They have trouble finding a job or performing not because their skills are lackluster, simply unlucky or not very good at interviews and unexperimented but because minorities with affirmative action programs are stealing all their jobs. The fear and hate homosexuals because they became anxious about their own virility. In the end, they hate all that represent their failed expectations.

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13-08-2017, 09:26 AM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 09:07 AM)epronovost Wrote:  
(13-08-2017 08:34 AM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Misogyny, racism and homophobia do seem to go hand in hand with right wing hate groups Sad

Many members of those fringe groups are young men who didn't met their own expectation in life. They consider themselves as failures and not all the blame rests on their shoulder. Society can have very high expectation for cisgender white men from the middle class. When they fail, stumble or are simply faced with a string of defeat there is only two course of action: fight or flight. Most of them will keep at it with more reasonnable expectation and maybe work on their weaknesses. Others will be sucked in by those groupuscule and rest the weight of their failure and their dissapointment fully on the heads of others. They aren't celibate because they are mediocre lovers with unrealistic standards, but because women are bitches. They have trouble finding a job or performing not because their skills are lackluster, simply unlucky or not very good at interviews and unexperimented but because minorities with affirmative action programs are stealing all their jobs. The fear and hate homosexuals because they became anxious about their own virility. In the end, they hate all that represent their failed expectations.

I've never thought of it in those terms but that makes a lot of sense.

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13-08-2017, 09:39 AM (This post was last modified: 13-08-2017 10:08 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
It's interesting that political unrest is usually associated with economic security. The disruptions from globalization, the high (impossible) costs of education (for some), the last recession, and the long unchecked, (much warned about) fact, that the highest percentage of generated economic wealth going to a very small percent are still very much a factor in many parts of the US. It's one of the reasons why Trump got in. Trump could actually *be* the best president in US history if his administration formulated a program and put in place a fast/simple "intern/training plan" to train and quickly (non-college) prepare young people for the millions of "skilled jobs" that are presently going begging, because very specific skills are not had, nor are there fast and quick training programs for them. Fix that, and America could be great again.
http://money.cnn.com/2017/06/06/news/eco...index.html

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13-08-2017, 10:14 AM (This post was last modified: 13-08-2017 10:18 AM by GenesisNemesis.)
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 09:39 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  It's interesting that political unrest is usually associated with economic security. The disruptions from globalization, the high (impossible) costs of education (for some), the last recession, and the long unchecked, (much warned about) fact, that the highest percentage of generated economic wealth going to a very small percent are still very much a factor in many parts of the US. It's one of the reasons why Trump got in. Trump could actually *be* the best president in US history if his administration formulated a program and put in place a fast/simple "intern/training plan" to train and quickly (non-college) prepare young people for the millions of "skilled jobs" that are presently going begging, because very specific skills are not had, nor are there fast and quick training programs for them. Fix that, and America could be great again.
http://money.cnn.com/2017/06/06/news/eco...index.html

That would never happen under a conservative govt, because conservatives want life to be horrible for everyone, and their ideology isn't based on being forward thinking at all. If they won't even raise the minimum wage, why would they bother with a "fast track" to get jobs?

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13-08-2017, 10:25 AM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 10:14 AM)GenesisNemesis Wrote:  That would never happen under a conservative govt, because conservatives want life to be horrible for everyone, and their ideology isn't based on being forward thinking at all.

It doesn't really seem like that will happen under either side. Both have had their opportunities and both have squandered it.

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13-08-2017, 12:25 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 09:39 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  It's interesting that political unrest is usually associated with economic security.

Peter Hayes in his book "Why? Explaining the Holocaust" said that antisemitism rise and fall in inverse relationship to stock market. I think it's not only antisemitism as we have at least one historical precedent of economic unrest producing support for extremists - Nazism. Without economy going down Hitler likely would remain clownish figure screaming in beer halls.

So given current state of economy unrest isn't surprising. But I don't think that is much that we can do about it.

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14-08-2017, 08:02 AM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 12:25 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  
(13-08-2017 09:39 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  It's interesting that political unrest is usually associated with economic security.

Peter Hayes in his book "Why? Explaining the Holocaust" said that antisemitism rise and fall in inverse relationship to stock market. I think it's not only antisemitism as we have at least one historical precedent of economic unrest producing support for extremists - Nazism. Without economy going down Hitler likely would remain clownish figure screaming in beer halls.

So given current state of economy unrest isn't surprising. But I don't think that is much that we can do about it.

The problem with your point is that Wall Street (the stock market) no longer reflects Main Street (economic conditions faced by the middle class).

The stock market is fine, the economy is growing; on paper, everything looks great, but wages are stagnant and the gap between rich and poor is widening, and unless this gap is addressed, the majority of the population, who see themselves and their children being reduced to near-serfdom, will turn to whoever promises relief, regardless of whether they can deliver.

Enter the demagogue.

Just because the first edition (Trump) is too stupid to capitalize on this advantage (because he keeps pandering to his shrinking base) is no reason for rejoicing. The situation could be much worse if a more competent demagogue were to come to power.

IMO, rising income inequality is the single greatest reason for the rise in anti-democratic sentiment, including anti-Semitism.

(I make this last point in general, not in response to your comment Szuchow, since I realize you may agree)

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14-08-2017, 08:09 AM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(13-08-2017 06:40 AM)reeveseb Wrote:  Random observation for today.

Normally the subject phrase is used on politicians, but this morning while flipping through local channels, I happened across a local religious program with an older man speaking earnestly to the viewers. I only watched for long enough to catch him say something to the effect of, "If you're wondering where we go from here, I've got a book right here with all of the answers to ensure our future," while holding open a bible, and with "Charlottesville" in big text behind him on the screen.

I just thought it was curious that he would use that language. A douchebag ran his car into people, killing and injuring dozens. Perhaps god could've used his powers to stop that guy from doing that. But then I'm sure the standard answer would be how he works in mysterious ways and that it's not our place to understand.

How is it that so many people can so willingly follow this type of logic? It's hard to understand why this type of thinking is preferred by so many people.

They're on autopilot. Taught not to listen to other sides of arguments because doubt is the ticket to hell. Religious preachers, Conspiracy Theorists, they do it for a living. Combine them both and you get this guy:

https://www.youtube.com/user/TheVigilantChristian

Have fun.

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14-08-2017, 09:07 AM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
One could ask if stock market reflected situation of the middle class in years past.

I don't think that Hayes statement should be taken literally, it seems to me that he was reprasing basic saying about bad economy creating bad times.

Having said that I agree, though I would add that how situation looks on paper is mostly irrelevant, even if sometimes perception is as important as reality.

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The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

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