Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
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23-08-2017, 03:46 PM (This post was last modified: 23-08-2017 03:51 PM by Momsurroundedbyboys.)
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 02:45 PM)Propwash Wrote:  
(23-08-2017 10:16 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  White supremacists, KKK members, and Nazis from all over congretated in Charlottesville, Virgina, ostensibly to oppose the removal of a statue of Robert E. Lee, the General in charge of Confederate troops during the American Civil War over slavery..

Toppling Lee's statue seems a bit of a shame to me, because the statue commemorated not just him but all the southern boys who died, so toppling it is almost like desecrating their graves.
And hey, negroes fought for the South too, so the issue is not as cut-and-dried as it seems, so maybe we should just let history stay as history without trying to airbrush bits of it out?
]"Several thousand blacks were enlisted in the Rebel cause.."
http://www.history.com/this-day-in-histo...k-soldiers


Yes it is, cut and dried. The south wanted to keep slavery! That was their agenda. It's in their formal letters of secession. They all voted for it. Slavery was the number one issue for them.

The right of states to keep other humans as chattel, all their economic reasons were tied to slavery. Toward the end of the civil war, because the south was losing, they did force black people to fight for them. The option was do this or die (some used the opportunity to escape too and if found by the rebels were shot on sight). Black soldiers did fight for the north too and if they were captured by the southerns they were shot, while white soldiers weren't

Two days before Lee's surrender, Louisiana held slave auctions.

The statue in question sat in front of a courthouse and was constructed in the 1920s as a way to remind black people of their "place".

Also, please don't post in PINK, PuRPLE or Green Since those are moderation/Super Moderator and Administrator action colors and it becomes confusing


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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23-08-2017, 03:48 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
I would like to add a comment (or two) to the idea of equating the leaders of the Revolutionary War with the leaders of the Confederacy.

At the time of the Southern Rebellion (or whatever name you called it) there was a Constitution and all states were represented in Congress. There were legal/procedural means to address the complaints of the southern states. The only thing that was not already covered in the Constitution was the right (or not) of any state, once accepted into the United States, to reverse the process and leave. But there was a process for making amendments to the Constitution, so there was a path to independence, if they had chosen that route.

The Founders (or perhaps "the Damned American Traitors" to the British) were subject to all of the laws and taxes passed by the British Parliament while having zero representation in said body. The elected officials in America could send petitions to King and Parliament addressing grievances (and there were plenty of them) but had no other legal avenue when the petitions were ignored. So it was comply, or rebel. The Founders were fully aware that what they were doing was treason, and would get them hanged if they failed.

So no, George Washington and Robert E. Lee are not the same, even if both were slave owners.
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23-08-2017, 06:14 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 02:45 PM)Propwash Wrote:  Toppling Lee's statue seems a bit of a shame to me, because the statue commemorated not just him but all the southern boys who died, so toppling it is almost like desecrating their graves.
And hey, negroes fought for the South too, so the issue is not as cut-and-dried as it seems, so maybe we should just let history stay as history without trying to airbrush bits of it out?
"Several thousand blacks were enlisted in the Rebel cause.."
http://www.history.com/this-day-in-histo...k-soldiers


I take it that you didn't bring up "Several thousand blacks were enlisted in the Rebel cause.." for nothing. I feel you are trying to lead us to some conclusion about Lee, the Confederacy, and statues based on this information, could you make it explicit and explain what you mean?

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23-08-2017, 06:18 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 06:14 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  I take it that you didn't bring up "Several thousand blacks were enlisted in the Rebel cause.." for nothing. I feel you are trying to lead us to some conclusion about Lee, the Confederacy, and statues based on this information, could you make it explicit and explain what you mean?

I'm starting to like this guy. How come some of the others think you're a dick, Jerry? Are you a dick and I just missed it? My dickdar is usually pretty good.

#sigh
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23-08-2017, 06:56 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 06:18 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I'm starting to like this guy. How come some of the others think you're a dick, Jerry? Are you a dick and I just missed it? My dickdar is usually pretty good.

I think I play well with others. A couple unpleasant exchanges (for everyone involved) but nothing out of the ordinary.

I'm accused by Vera and Anjele of being a horndog for rep points but don't for the life of me know why. I have extremely thin skin (great quality for a forum) and actually DO care what people think of me, so maybe I compliment people? Here and there? I know on the Art thread I will say something nice about anybody and anything they post, you make yourself vulnerable by showing your art and I'm damn well going to find something positive in support. But I'm not sure. I did criticize Vera at one point but how leads to rep point seeking I don't know.

Girly thanks for opening the door for me to rant, it felt good sprinting through!

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23-08-2017, 07:00 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
That was good, right? Two or three points good, right?

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23-08-2017, 07:23 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 07:00 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  That was good, right? Two or three points good, right?

I used to be able to give 4. They took that away from me.

#sigh
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23-08-2017, 08:07 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 07:23 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I used to be able to give 4. They took that away from me.

You're no use to me. Fuck off. Smile

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23-08-2017, 08:14 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 08:07 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  
(23-08-2017 07:23 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I used to be able to give 4. They took that away from me.

You're no use to me. Fuck off. Smile

Your mother's a rep whore.

#sigh
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23-08-2017, 08:19 PM
RE: Charlottesville: Never let a good crisis go to waste
(23-08-2017 08:14 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Your mother's a rep whore.

I always thought she just liked attention.

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