Children and punishments
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16-01-2014, 04:37 PM
Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:25 PM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(16-01-2014 02:59 PM)Luminon Wrote:  You're right, I'm ignorant of your situation. And if I am completely off the mark, there is no reason to get upset. Maybe it's just me, I have a huge reason to get upset, because I was not treated as a person when I was a child. People who treat their children as persons don't need to get angry at me, they can only pity me and maybe agree with me.

Then perhaps is it even slightly possible that your experience as a child is clouding your ability to see there moderation can exist?

I don't have kids, so I'm not upset about anything. I just don't care much for over simplification of situations that make things very black/white.

Nor am I a big fan of anyone who is overly dramatic on the issue of spanking to call it abuse. To do so minimizes actual abuse that involves starvation, beating, burning, kicking, punching, sexual abuse, and so on. That is abuse. A swat on the butt for consistently testing boundaries as a last resort is not abuse.

"Moderation" of hitting doesn't apply in the world of adults. It teaches nothing except that the adult is bigger, stronger, and can inflict pain.

There is a better way, why not strive to be a better parent? Why not strive to be more patient? More loving, more empathic? Be the best you can be so your child has a role model that is consistently modeling the best possible behavior. Why shouldn't that be the goal?

I'm not perfect, I've made mistakes. But I don't hit and I don't demean....ever. That doesn't mean for a second that I don't ever get frustrated and think to myself, "what the FUCK were you thinking????" when my kid does do something really STUPID.
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16-01-2014, 04:44 PM
Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:24 PM)Bows and Arrows Wrote:  
(16-01-2014 04:17 PM)hotnostril Wrote:  I always explained in graphic detail what we were doing what the plan was and why and how I expected him to behave beforehand.
Take shopping for instance...I'd tell him where we were going and what we were getting. My son loved the local pet store so I would try to incorporate stopping there or something he enjoyed.
If there wasn't time to make the trip I'd tell him, so he wasn't surprised. As the time to go approached to leave I'd let him know it was almost time to go and immediately start telling him all about what we were doing next and how he could help or be apart of it.
Once I recall a total meltdown as we were waiting in a long line, outside, on a gravel surface, for ice cream. He was almost three. There were some children there running around throwing rocks. I told him not to. I explained getting hit by one hurts and it's not a nice thing to do. I told him if he choses to throw a rock, he wouldn't get ice cream and we would have to leave. He picked up and threw a rock. I simply picked him up and carried him to the car. He was crying and yelling... "I made the wrong choice! I made the wrong choice!" He was sobbing. I calmly said, "I know, I'm sorry you made the wrong choice ...but next time, I know you'll make the right one" he sobbed and sobbed...damn near killed me to follow through. I didn't get angry, I didn't yell, I didn't demean and I didn't hit him.

Sorry about the multi posts. I'm new and using tapatalk and for some reason it wouldn't allow me to c&p multiple links.
this is how we operate too.

And it doesn't always work - I lose my shit and get frustrated plenty of times too, but this is what we are striving for every day. It takes work to include the little people who walk around like they are drunk most of the day. It takes buckets of patience- some days I have more than others. But our goal isn't compliance with my orders, its to learn.

I'll be quiet now unless someone has a specific question.

You nailed it! More about me teaching and them learning than it is about obedience. Funny thing though...when there's a level of mutual respect ....obedience comes naturally. Children really do want to please their parents. Praise for doing good goes way farther than a smack for a mistake.
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16-01-2014, 04:47 PM
RE: Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 09:01 AM)NoraBrimstone Wrote:  I like this thread. I have screencaps of the relevant parts of this thread and I'm going to call these fine people later and find out where I can email them to.

See, someone in the world cares about your son, Jeremy. He'll be safe and far away from his violent monster of a father in no time. I hope you like prison food. Big Grin

It is exactly this type of stupidity that results in children slipping through the cracks. You tie up CPS with your ridiculous claim that some internet character is abusing his kid by doing something YOU KNOW is legal, while children that are being ACTUALLY BEATEN have no one.

Way to tie up those resources fuck nuts. Thanks for being such a wonderful "advocate for the children." Too bad your ability to actually think your actions through is the same as those you claim to advocate for.

Fucking internet heroes. Dodgy

So many cats, so few good recipes.
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16-01-2014, 04:48 PM
Children and punishments
http://youtu.be/sr5B-mEKGY4

This video really upsets me too. This child is displaying care, concern and empathy and his dumb ass father laughs hysterically.
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16-01-2014, 04:49 PM
RE: Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:27 PM)Luminon Wrote:  
(16-01-2014 04:09 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Ok seriously? You need to go play somewhere else. You can't possibly think anyone would want to talk to you after this crap. You don't know KC and you don't have any right to judge him. I would say your attitude and use of language would be more harmful to a child than the occasional spanking. I really hope you don't have any kids.
Does a bad language disturb you? Fuck the language. My parents screamed at me and beat me without using a single dirty word ever and see what good it did to me.
No slaver thought of his slaves as Afro-Americans and no parent thinks of his children as persons. Dehumanization is what disturbs me, these are my priorities. Pleasant language is a bit lower on my list.
My attitude is anger and indignation, which is a healthy response in contact with evil and corruption. If I have healthy responses to suffering of others, I may be trusted in the future to deal with children with empathy.


KC is a normal self-proclaimed redneck parent, raised by rednecks and raising rednecks who will probably raise more rednecks, unless they read discussions like this. If he finds it offensive, then he would want to change himself, that's his thing. People do as they are done to and then they order others to do. (Joe Abercrombie)
My thing is going around and calling things their true names. True names have power, because right now we call shit gold and we all love gold. Unless we call things their true names, we have no choice if we want to keep them or not. My job is to give names and thus choices.

Yes your use of language bothers me. It sucks that your parents abused you. My parents were calm abusers. They never yelled at me or cursed at me. They simply told me I was being punished for my behavior. My mother was pretty good with her wooden spoon but it was daddy's belt that we were all afraid of. That being said, I never felt abused as a child. My mother was very loving she spent a lot of time with us she taught great things. Even after becoming atheist and rejecting my mother's ways I still value some of the lessons she taught me.
It is completely ignorant to say, no parent thinks of his children as persons. It's not true. Who are you to claim knowledge of the thoughts of millions of parents who you do not know? Being a parent certainly isn't easy and no one has the answers. As our children are little drunks wondering around doing stupid things, we are all just bumbling fools following after them trying to make the right choices and hoping that our mistakes won't be ones that ruin our kids. I don't spank my kids. I don't plan to ever spank them, but I don't think the occasional spanking is that big of a deal. It is not abuse.
Your attitude is anger and indignation which explains why you think you have a right to attack strangers and judge them. Meh I hope for your sake you are 15 so that you have plenty of time to grow up. There's no point in blaming the world for your past. Blame the ones who hurt you for hurting you and then try to move on. Being angry is a sad way to waste your life.

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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16-01-2014, 04:50 PM
RE: Children and punishments
Wow! U guys are still going.
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16-01-2014, 04:57 PM
RE: Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:48 PM)hotnostril Wrote:  http://youtu.be/sr5B-mEKGY4

This video really upsets me too. This child is displaying care, concern and empathy and his dumb ass father laughs hysterically.

Really? -_-

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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16-01-2014, 04:57 PM
Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:37 PM)Slowminded Wrote:  
(16-01-2014 04:06 PM)Bows and Arrows Wrote:  I don't think a smack would help. It would just make the child scream more.
think of it this way- you have been working a double shift, you are physically and mentally exhausted, you put the last bite of food in your mouth and someone jerks you out of your seat and says 'move' time to go, I said go- time to go. Wouldn't that get you in a pissy mood? then they smack you because you didn't jump when they said jump to improve your character.

yes, I exaggerated to make a point. But the point is we all want to feel respected and as parents we need to walk kids thru healthy relationships, not just bully them into following orders.

Thank you for posting an example. I don't want it to sound like I am singling anyone out because they parent different from me. I AM NOT. I do think parents can teach each other methods, techniques and such to improve our lives, and having a scenario that is neutral to all of us is a key in discussing it.

Let me just say this, I won't go into details but If I didn't learn to swallow my pissy mood and to follow orders when they came from proper authority I wouldn't be alive today.

Anyway , I am not a parent, and I am not saying that spanking is a great way to raise your kids. I will avoid it as best as I can when I have my kids. I was just reacting to the ,imo, gross overreacting by some people.

I'll leave you guys to it.

I really do hope you take the time to read the links I posted up thread. I think everyone should.
For the sake of argument, let's say a swat or two every once in awhile doesn't cause lasting harm. It doesn't make it okay. It still doesn't have the desired long term effect. It still isn't teaching your child anything beneficial. So why continue to do it? Excuse it? Or defend it?

It's still just wrong.
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16-01-2014, 04:59 PM
Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:57 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  
(16-01-2014 04:48 PM)hotnostril Wrote:  http://youtu.be/sr5B-mEKGY4

This video really upsets me too. This child is displaying care, concern and empathy and his dumb ass father laughs hysterically.

Really? -_-

Yes, really. It's why I can't watch shows like Americas Funniest Videos. I see nothing funny about people almost getting killed or seriously hurt. It makes me sick when I hear parents laughing as their own children have a brush with serious injuries. I think there is something seriously wrong with those people.
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16-01-2014, 05:04 PM
RE: Children and punishments
(16-01-2014 04:59 PM)hotnostril Wrote:  
(16-01-2014 04:57 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Really? -_-

Yes, really. It's why I can't watch shows like Americas Funniest Videos. I see nothing funny about people almost getting killed or seriously hurt. It makes me sick when I hear parents laughing as their own children have a brush with serious injuries. I think there is something seriously wrong with those people.

That video is adorable. I don't like a lot of the AFV videos for the same reason but no one is really hurt in that video. Sometimes you can't help but laugh when your kids are silly and it's even funnier when they get mad at you for laughing.

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Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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