Christian Misogyny
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12-02-2014, 11:15 AM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(11-02-2014 10:18 PM)Misanthropik Wrote:  lol, but that's the thing; she won't respect you or honor you if you don't make yourself shepherd.

Indeed she will. She'll respect me as a person who's just like her.
Maybe...but is that really what you want in a marriage - to be just like her?

There was an article in the NY Times last week which referenced a study showing that marriages with more egalitarian roles have a lesser sex life than those with more traditional male-female roles.

From an atheist viewpoint, evolution made women physically smaller and weaker than men. Is it so hard to believe that it produced psychological differences too?

My wife loves having me be the leader. It means a lot less for her to worry about.
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12-02-2014, 11:19 AM
RE: Christian Misogyny
While it is true that sexual dimorphism makes men physically stronger, I have yet to meet a man who can be classified as intellectually or psychologically my superior. Quite the opposite, actually. But I don't hold it against you Tongue
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12-02-2014, 11:49 AM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 11:19 AM)natachan Wrote:  While it is true that sexual dimorphism makes men physically stronger, I have yet to meet a man who can be classified as intellectually or psychologically my superior.
Here's part of the problem - subjective judgment regarding superiority/inferiority of traits and roles. You are apparently arrogant, but maybe you see that as a positive, while some see it as a negative. Regarding marriage, is it superior per se to be the leader, or is that just a subjective judgment you guys are making?
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12-02-2014, 12:05 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 11:49 AM)alpha male Wrote:  You are apparently arrogant

And anyone that has to tell others that they are an alpha male are most certainly not what they believe they are. They do it because they are arrogant.
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12-02-2014, 12:08 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 12:05 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(12-02-2014 11:49 AM)alpha male Wrote:  You are apparently arrogant

And anyone that has to tell others that they are an alpha male are most certainly not what they believe they are. They do it because they are arrogant.

The first rule of alpha male club is that you don't say you're in alpha male club. Otherwise you're just compensating.
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12-02-2014, 12:24 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 12:05 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(12-02-2014 11:49 AM)alpha male Wrote:  You are apparently arrogant

And anyone that has to tell others that they are an alpha male are most certainly not what they believe they are. They do it because they are arrogant.
Or because they're developing a web site with a lion theme, and "alpha male" just goes with the theme.

But anyway, in some ways I'm arrogant, but not on natachan's scale. I've met both men and women who are intellectually my superior. Or maybe natachan just hasn't met many people.
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12-02-2014, 12:39 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 12:24 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(12-02-2014 12:05 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  And anyone that has to tell others that they are an alpha male are most certainly not what they believe they are. They do it because they are arrogant.
Or because they're developing a web site with a lion theme, and "alpha male" just goes with the theme.

"Disemboweled zebra" would go with the theme as well, but I notice you didn't choose that name.
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12-02-2014, 12:45 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 11:49 AM)alpha male Wrote:  
(12-02-2014 11:19 AM)natachan Wrote:  While it is true that sexual dimorphism makes men physically stronger, I have yet to meet a man who can be classified as intellectually or psychologically my superior.
Here's part of the problem - subjective judgment regarding superiority/inferiority of traits and roles. You are apparently arrogant, but maybe you see that as a positive, while some see it as a negative. Regarding marriage, is it superior per se to be the leader, or is that just a subjective judgment you guys are making?

It's one thing for a couple to decide on a 'leader.' It's another to be raised being told that the man is superior and will be in charge whether you like it or not, because God.

If Jesus died for our sins, why is there still sin? If man was created from dust, why is there still dust? If Americans came from Europe, why are there still Europeans?
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12-02-2014, 12:50 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
(12-02-2014 12:45 PM)guitar_nut Wrote:  
(12-02-2014 11:49 AM)alpha male Wrote:  Here's part of the problem - subjective judgment regarding superiority/inferiority of traits and roles. You are apparently arrogant, but maybe you see that as a positive, while some see it as a negative. Regarding marriage, is it superior per se to be the leader, or is that just a subjective judgment you guys are making?

It's one thing for a couple to decide on a 'leader.' It's another to be raised being told that the man is superior and will be in charge whether you like it or not, because God.
I guess you missed the point that leaders are not superior per se, but rather you guys are attaching that subjective judgment to the role.

My boss owns the firm and is certainly in charge, but I don't see him as a superior human being to myself.
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12-02-2014, 01:18 PM
RE: Christian Misogyny
I may get panned here, but, I think I can see what AM may be trying to say here.

AM are you saying that a position of leadership does not necessarily infer with it a rank of superiority? Ie; your boss is in charge but it's merely a role, not a signifier of being better or a more worthwhile human being than you? ... If I understand you correctly, I agree.

I think the view some hold on here would not dispute this and I am definitely one of those.

From my perspective, as an atheist I take it a step further. I hold the view that, equal footing, submission and dominance are all ethically sound positions to hold, so long as all parties concerned have voluntarily taken on these roles. This usually isn't a choice, dominant people dominate and passive people submit. The issue I have with having it prescribed or enforced by religion or any other means, is that dominant people shouldn't be forced to submit and passive people shouldn't be forced to lead, nor should it be that a leader is selected if none is required. It makes even less sense to me that a leader should be nominated from a source external to the relationship.

Now, if I have assumed correctly that you and I are in agreement that a leader does not automatically infer superiority, why then does it matter who leads? Furthermore, why follow a dogma that in some specific cases will directly cause conflict between people, say a dominant female and a passive male, which would in turn probably be a source of sadness for both parties?

I'm genuinely interested in the theistic point of view on this.

A man blames his bad childhood on leprechauns. He claims they don't exist, but yet still says without a doubt that they stole all his money and then killed his parents. That's why he became Leprechaun-Man

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