Christian Scientists
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28-01-2015, 07:13 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
Although I think there is a lot of compartilization, I don't think it is absolutely necessary, at least depending on the denomination. As stated, biblical literalists probably have the worst of it. But I think with the Anglican, Catholic and Orthodox can reconcile the two with little problem. And to a certain degree Calvanists and Lutherans as well.

First and foremost miracles shouldn't present a problem since both scientists and theologians will come to the same conclusion. That being that these things cannot happen in the normal order of things.
The branch of science that would truly interfere with faith would be geology and even then only for literalists as stated before.

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28-01-2015, 07:16 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
I think you are mistaking christian scientist, for scientist who so happen to be christian.

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28-01-2015, 07:42 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
Maybe I did confuse the two. Are we discussing "Christian Scientists" which tends to refer to fundamentalists who use a sort of pseudoscience to defend things like the age of the earth or are we discussing Christian scientists as in those who are devoutly christian and work in the field of science?

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28-01-2015, 08:02 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
(28-01-2015 07:42 PM)TarzanSmith Wrote:  Maybe I did confuse the two. Are we discussing "Christian Scientists" which tends to refer to fundamentalists who use a sort of pseudoscience to defend things like the age of the earth or are we discussing Christian scientists as in those who are devoutly christian and work in the field of science?

Oh my message was to the OP, not you

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28-01-2015, 08:35 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
(28-01-2015 08:02 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  
(28-01-2015 07:42 PM)TarzanSmith Wrote:  Maybe I did confuse the two. Are we discussing "Christian Scientists" which tends to refer to fundamentalists who use a sort of pseudoscience to defend things like the age of the earth or are we discussing Christian scientists as in those who are devoutly christian and work in the field of science?

Oh my message was to the OP, not you

My bad

I'm homophobic in the same way that I'm arachnophobic. I'm not scared of gay people but I'm going to scream if I find one in my bath.

I'm. Also homophobic in the same way I'm arachnophobic. I'm scared of spiders but I'd still fuck'em.
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28-01-2015, 09:36 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
Being a scientist has nothing to do with your extra beliefs. There are a lot of atheists who believe in psychic powers and magic and woo of all sorts.

Being a scientist merely means that you have studied and dedicated your life to the field of research you are in, and have sworn an oath to always uphold the scientific method.

However, those who follow the scientific method in life and in their research find themselves faced with the fact that deities, magic and so on can never be tested and because they do not conform to how reality is presented to us, to those of a logical, critical thinking and scientific mind, those claims must be dismissed until the correct evidence can be presented, tested, repeated, and scrutinized by your peers.

The difference between faith and science is that science says that it has found evidence , so what conclusions may we be able to draw from them? Then faith states that here is the conclusion, so what facts can we discover that will be able to support it.

In other words, from a scientifically minded person, they do not form the conclusion and then present it as the truth or anything like that. Stating the conclusion as its own premise is what faith does. That is what makes faith a circular argument and therefore, wrong as it is a fallacy. Science discovers facts or evidence and then it tests what it finds in order to discover or come up with a conclusion.

There are however, some people who are just so stubborn with their old way of thinking, or simply too afraid of being wrong for so many years previous to becoming a scientifically minded person, that they cannot seem to let go regardless of what their logical mind tells them.

This is not really a problem or anything wrong with the scientist per se. UNLESS they are an astrologist, biologist, geologist or so on. Then their faith becomes completely incomparable with their science work and there are very sad tales of extremely BRILLIANT and near prodigy level scientifically minded people who were so indoctrinated with their parents beliefs that they dropped out of college because it was teaching them contrary evidence against what they were brainwashed into thinking.

This not only drastically harms the economy, but education, scientific research but the entire human race as well. There are however, a few people here and there that do not let their religious views intercept any part of their science research. These individuals have found some sort of way of balancing their beliefs and making sure the two never clash or get in the way of each other and that is fine for them. The real problem is those who do let that happen and that is when faith becomes a detriment to them and society.


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29-01-2015, 07:04 AM
RE: Christian Scientists
(22-01-2015 10:03 AM)Typho2k Wrote:  How is it possible to be a christian and also a scientist at the same time?

Me no understand

My oldest sister is a medicinal chemist. She's also still catholic. She believes in god, but doesn't literally believe in a lot of it. She hates how women are treated, doesn't believe you go to hell for nonbelief, goes to church irregularly, and certainly doesn't believe the molecules in bread/wine change literally into body/blood of Christ.

So it's possible.

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29-01-2015, 01:01 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
(28-01-2015 12:30 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  As Gould said of science and religion, they are non-overlapping magisteria.

Some scientists are also christian because science doesn't require an opinion one way or another on religion. So as long as their religious beliefs don't become entangled in the research they are doing, then there is no issue with the science they produce.

It is the same way if you asked how someone could be an accountant and a christian. The process itself, and the knowledge necessary to do it, don't hinge upon any opinion on religion.

And as we all know, neither you nor I nor Stephen Gould has had a dog in this fight. As if he might have even used the term magisteria with a straight face. I can see Wayne Barlowe's artwork in my mind's eye now. I think Gould meant to say--"alien-steria".

You wrote in part, "So as long as their religious beliefs don't become entangled in the research they are doing, then there is no issue with the science they produce." What does that even mean? That science, as well, a science, is supposed to be unbiased so scientists must suspend their beliefs and faith to become more unbiased as people? That if a scientist encounters something God or numinous during the course of their research, they should hide or eliminate it from their reporting of data so that they don't "entangle" their work?

I don't mind hearing the same ideas brought out once again by atheists, I don't. But have you thought through all the implications of what you're saying? It sounds like--it sounds like--censorship.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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29-01-2015, 01:04 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
(28-01-2015 04:29 PM)Chas Wrote:  How about we stick with scientists working post-1859. Drinking Beverage

I've said (on this thread recently? another?) up through the "Enlightenment".

But if enlightenment = a secular, relativistic society with rampant abortion, venereal disease, hurt, confusion, pain, drug abuse (legal and illegal)... then the en/lighten/ment comes from... wait for it... a bringer of light... wait for it... Satan. I didn't want to go there, but there it is.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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29-01-2015, 01:08 PM
RE: Christian Scientists
(29-01-2015 01:01 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  You wrote in part, "So as long as their religious beliefs don't become entangled in the research they are doing, then there is no issue with the science they produce." What does that even mean?

I thought it was pretty straightforward. Science will lead where science leads and, if it happens to lead to a god (though doubtful), then so be it. The point is for a belief in god not to lead the science.

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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