Christian vs. Humanist Morality
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11-02-2017, 07:08 AM (This post was last modified: 11-02-2017 07:13 AM by unfogged.)
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
(10-02-2017 11:30 PM)socialistview Wrote:  Read scriptures for answers.

To questions like "how far-fetched can we make things sound and still have people actually believe it?" and "what did primitive societies with no understanding of science make up about the world?".

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11-02-2017, 08:24 AM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
(11-02-2017 07:08 AM)unfogged Wrote:  
(10-02-2017 11:30 PM)socialistview Wrote:  Read scriptures for answers.

To questions like "how far-fetched can we make things sound and still have people actually believe it?" and "what did primitive societies with no understanding of science make up about the world?".

Yup.

Theology:

the·ol·o·gy
THēˈäləjē
noun
- the study of the history of ignorance.

Yes

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11-02-2017, 01:06 PM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
Thousand of years of bc time and you have this basis that they were primitive.
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11-02-2017, 02:51 PM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
(26-11-2016 11:43 PM)666wannabe Wrote:  On The Atheist Experience, Episode #452, 1:04-1:06”, Keryn Glasser offered a good, if somewhat over-simplified, explanation for the source of the different epistemological orientations of theistic believers and atheistic non-believers:

“There are two ways you can raise a kid. You can raise a kid so that when you set rules. You explain to them why they should follow those rules, like, you shouldn't leave the refrigerator open, because it costs so much money when the refrigerator keeps trying to cool itself and then we'll go broke; you shouldn't leave all the lights on because it will raise up the electric bill; you shouldn't leave the door open, because the house will get hot; you shouldn't do drugs, because you might get all these diseases and illness and, blah-blah-blah; you shouldn't have sex, because of this reason; blah-blah-blah-blah, or you can be the kind of parent who says, 'You shouldn't do this, that, or the other, because I SAID SO!'

“What's going to happen with the one is that, when they grow up, they're going to understand why all these things are bad. They're going to go out in the community, and they're going to follow all the rules. What's going to happen with the other is that they're going to go out into the community and they're going to think, 'At last, FREEDOM. I don't have to obey my parents, anymore, because I'm not living under their house.' (sic) They're going to do everything wrong until they figure out for themselves why those things are actually wrong.

“It's the same with Christianity. One big problem that Christians have with atheists is that they can't figure out why, if you weren't terrified by the wrath of God, why you wouldn't go out and rape and steal and pillage and kill. Because—I'm guessing—that's the first thing they'd do if they lost God.

“Not to that extreme, but I happen to know a doctor who asked me that question, and I said, 'You're a doctor. Don't you think that healing and taking care of...I mean, would you kill people if you lost God. And he said HELL. YEAH!'

This offers an explanation of why religious people and Christians, in particular, generally insist on legalistically adhering to a dogma (which is accepted on faith) instead of making the effort to think for themselves.

Apologetics, rather than just being the attempt to justify belief in a dogma, is the attempt to justify encroachments on that dogma, such as, in the case of some Christian denominations, “I am a sinner, but my sins are forgiven through the sacrifice of Jesus, so I am not under condemnation for my sin”. In other words, “The devil makes me do it!” This is nothing less than the abrogation of personal responsibility—a mindset that has always been and continues to be the source of much damage to world society.

What forgiveness for sins, while satisfying a narcissistic self-concern, fails to take into consideration is the harm done to others. It doesn't matter how many Christs die on a cross, the harm done to others cannot be undone and one's responsibility for causing that harm cannot be erased. Non-believers, at least, those with a humanistic morality, do take the interests of others, along with the self, as a primary consideration.

As Ghandi stated, “I do not seek redemption from the consequences of sin, I seek to be redeemed from sin, itself”.


I think your problem is that you are quoting someone who is not a Christian and is reciting a view of Christianity as being the same as Judaism.

Seriously...

I find this with Sam Harris as well. You get highly educated people like Sam Harris on a Youtube coming out with a comment that Christianity "seems to have a different kind of god". Same with Reza Aslam.

Here are people entering into a religious debate not having read the New Testament.

I am not a Christian apologist. However, I think it's incumbent on people like Mr. Glasser, who I presume from his name, is Jewish, and Harris, that they actually talk out of their mouths and do try to make some sense, instead of spewing untrue nonsense.

Christianity is Christianity...it's not what Jewish people say it is. It's not the religion of the Old Testament with a morality based on what Glasser percieves it to be:

“It's the same with Christianity. One big problem that Christians have with atheists is that they can't figure out why, if you weren't terrified by the wrath of God, why you wouldn't go out and rape and steal and pillage and kill. Because—I'm guessing—that's the first thing they'd do if they lost God."

I read this and I despair.

Read the NT if you are going to talk about Christianity. IT IS NOT THE SAME AS JUDAISM...

You have to develop an approach to reading the New Testament, IMO.

1. Who is the Christian God? It says what it is in John. Read it.
2. What is the central moral philosophy. It says what it is in Matthew. Read it.

One can easily see that the two central concepts of Christian "morality" in every day life are that "god" is "the word" or the logos, which is a fundamental departure from Judaism, and that the moral concept at its center is "the law and the prophets"..."do unto others as you would have others do unto you". Nowhere in the New Testament is it taught that if you don't "do what god says" you'll be punished and that this is why you should follow Christian morality.

If you look at Christianity this way, you can see it as a Hellenistic and "humanistic" religion which was actually "atheistic" in the sense that Christians did not believe in the god of the "Jews" and present a different notion of "divinity" as based on a rational principle of morality, as in humanism.
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11-02-2017, 07:04 PM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
(11-02-2017 02:51 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Nowhere in the New Testament is it taught that if you don't "do what god says" you'll be punished and that this is why you should follow Christian morality.

It's been obvious for a very long time that there's a profound disconnect between the contents of the NT and the colloquial interpretation of what it teaches. The whole "How can you be moral without God?" argument is a good example of this, as is the End Times/Rapture/Antichrist mythology that is so pervasive nowadays. It's almost as if Christianity has been co-opted by a mob of fan fiction writers who never bothered to read the whole series before they started writing derivative works. Shocking

I'm sorry, but your beliefs are much too silly to take seriously. Got anything else we can discuss?
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11-02-2017, 07:17 PM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
1st Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind ,

People often don't know what's in the babble because they've never read it. There are many such verses in the NT.

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11-02-2017, 11:58 PM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
God gives reason. To care for one another and jesus said hell explain everything in the thousand years.
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12-02-2017, 12:09 AM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
(11-02-2017 11:58 PM)socialistview Wrote:  God gives reason. To care for one another and jesus said hell explain everything in the thousand years.

Yep 'listen to me or else I'll kill you and/or torture you for eternity' is an excellent reason to listen to authority.

God is a Mob Boss. Congrats dipshit.

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12-02-2017, 12:48 AM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
(11-02-2017 11:58 PM)socialistview Wrote:  God gives reason. To care for one another and jesus said hell explain everything in the thousand years.

So, he's 1000 years late???

It's considered rude to keep people waiting.

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12-02-2017, 01:58 AM
RE: Christian vs. Humanist Morality
He'll explain the plan and then explode the earth, like a Bond villain.

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