Christians wanting to hijack Easter
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19-01-2016, 06:20 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(19-01-2016 01:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  They already are dictated by them,
Yes as it turns out
Quote:but I can see that you are struggling to understand that.
You are a fuckwit aren't you

Quote:That they change the way it is computed is in no way 'hijacking' it, but I can see that you are struggling to understand that.
nd is a secular country. There are many people in nz who celebrate Easter holidays and tradition of chocolate without any Christian underpinnings. For me easter has nothing to do with Christianity. If a christian church wants to change the way they calculate when easter is I see this as irrelevant to the nz government. Our govt don't tell the churches when they are to perform their magical rituals and I don't expect the churches to dictate to my government when I am to have a national holiday. I don't think that our govt needs to align easter holidays with what the Christians want. From my perspective easter has nothing to do with christianity. It takes its name and symbols from the fertility goddess. If govt change the rule around the date then they ignore the fact that nz is a secular country. I'm am happy with the equinox calculation. I don't care what the churches think about it. I don't think it should change at the christian say so why should they have that power? They don't own easter.
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20-01-2016, 04:33 AM (This post was last modified: 20-01-2016 04:53 AM by Chas.)
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(19-01-2016 06:20 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(19-01-2016 01:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  They already are dictated by them,
Yes as it turns out
Quote:but I can see that you are struggling to understand that.
You are a fuckwit aren't you

Quote:That they change the way it is computed is in no way 'hijacking' it, but I can see that you are struggling to understand that.
nd is a secular country. There are many people in nz who celebrate Easter holidays and tradition of chocolate without any Christian underpinnings. For me easter has nothing to do with Christianity. If a christian church wants to change the way they calculate when easter is I see this as irrelevant to the nz government. Our govt don't tell the churches when they are to perform their magical rituals and I don't expect the churches to dictate to my government when I am to have a national holiday. I don't think that our govt needs to align easter holidays with what the Christians want. From my perspective easter has nothing to do with christianity. It takes its name and symbols from the fertility goddess. If govt change the rule around the date then they ignore the fact that nz is a secular country. I'm am happy with the equinox calculation. I don't care what the churches think about it. I don't think it should change at the christian say so why should they have that power? They don't own easter.

So, you fail see why your rant about 'hijacking' is just wrong.
The failure of your government to see things your way is not Christians hijacking Easter, fuckwit.

The origin of your country's celebration of an Easter holiday is undoubtedly due to its historically Christian society.
So if there is any 'hijacking' being done, it is by you, not the Christians.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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20-01-2016, 01:01 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 04:33 AM)Chas Wrote:  The origin of your country's celebration of an Easter holiday is undoubtedly due to its historically Christian society.
So if there is any 'hijacking' being done, it is by you, not the Christians.
Fact 1 - The origin of Easter is the celebration of the fertility goddess Estre
Fact 2 - Easter eggs and bunnies are symbols of fertility.
Fact 3 - NZ is a secular country
Fact 4 - NZ has a current way of calculating when Easter is to be celebrated.
Fact 5 - Many Christian organisations want to change how the date is to be calculated.
Fact 6 - I celebrate Easter each year
Fact 7 - NZ annual leave days apply to me.
Fact 8 - I have never celebrated the death and resurrection of the mythical Jesus.
Fact 9 - I don't care if the Christians want to celebrate Easter within their churches on a different date.
Fact 10 - I don't accept that my secular country ought to refer to the Catholic church on when to recognise this holiday in our secular country. The origin after all is the fertility goddess, Christianity has nothing to do with Easter and NZ isn't a Christian country.

If YOU personally think Easter IS owned by the Christian faith and that secular countries that officially celebrate Easter (by supporting laws of annual holidays and trade restrictions) OUGHT TO refer to Christian leaders as to when to set the dates, then that is your personal prerogative.

I am happy for you to disagree with me, I am happy for you to express your conflicting opinion.

But what I constantly find when attempting to have a conversation with Chas is that in your always arrogant, and derogatory way, your posts are dripping with filth and slime (when you disagree with someone). Which is probably an accurate reflection of your personality.

It's never a pleasure talking to you. If I met you in real life, I'd quickly learn that you are a person to avoid talking to or associating with.
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20-01-2016, 01:07 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 01:01 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(20-01-2016 04:33 AM)Chas Wrote:  The origin of your country's celebration of an Easter holiday is undoubtedly due to its historically Christian society.
So if there is any 'hijacking' being done, it is by you, not the Christians.
Fact 1 - The origin of Easter is the celebration of the fertility goddess Estre
Fact 2 - Easter eggs and bunnies are symbols of fertility.
Fact 3 - NZ is a secular country
Fact 4 - NZ has a current way of calculating when Easter is to be celebrated.
Fact 5 - Many Christian organisations want to change how the date is to be calculated.
Fact 6 - I celebrate Easter each year
Fact 7 - NZ annual leave days apply to me.
Fact 8 - I have never celebrated the death and resurrection of the mythical Jesus.
Fact 9 - I don't care if the Christians want to celebrate Easter within their churches on a different date.
Fact 10 - I don't accept that my secular country ought to refer to the Catholic church on when to recognise this holiday in our secular country. The origin after all is the fertility goddess, Christianity has nothing to do with Easter and NZ isn't a Christian country.

If YOU personally think Easter IS owned by the Christian faith and that secular countries that officially celebrate Easter (by supporting laws of annual holidays and trade restrictions) OUGHT TO refer to Christian leaders as to when to set the dates, then that is your personal prerogative.

I am happy for you to disagree with me, I am happy for you to express your conflicting opinion.

But what I constantly find when attempting to have a conversation with Chas is that in your always arrogant, and derogatory way, your posts are dripping with filth and slime (when you disagree with someone). Which is probably an accurate reflection of your personality.

It's never a pleasure talking to you. If I met you in real life, I'd quickly learn that you are a person to avoid talking to or associating with.

You missed the critical fact ignoring the process point... that Easter began being celebrated in New Zealand because of Christians. It's not ever been separate from them... they hijacked it in the first few hundred years C.E. Not anytime recently or currently. It's been their holiday for around 1500 years.

If New Zealanders began celebrating Easter because of it's Pagan holiday origin and NOT Because of Christianity, you're argumentative view here would be right. You'r historical account is just dismissing the fact that it is entirely because of Christianity.

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20-01-2016, 03:51 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 01:07 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  You missed the critical fact ignoring the process point... that Easter began being celebrated in New Zealand because of Christians.
that point is unimportant. Nz is a secular country now.

Many non christians celebrate easter for non christian reasons. The easter holidays are not owned by christians.

Easter harks back to non christian beliefs it did not originate from christianity. They have no claim to it in a secular country.


Quote: You'r historical account is just dismissing the fact that it is entirely because of Christianity.
I have addressed this false claim already. The most important point is that my country is secular. Why on earth are we referring to christian churches?
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20-01-2016, 04:38 PM (This post was last modified: 20-01-2016 04:44 PM by ClydeLee.)
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 03:51 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(20-01-2016 01:07 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  You missed the critical fact ignoring the process point... that Easter began being celebrated in New Zealand because of Christians.
that point is unimportant. Nz is a secular country now.

Many non christians celebrate easter for non christian reasons. The easter holidays are not owned by christians.

Easter harks back to non christian beliefs it did not originate from christianity. They have no claim to it in a secular country.


Quote: You'r historical account is just dismissing the fact that it is entirely because of Christianity.
I have addressed this false claim already. The most important point is that my country is secular. Why on earth are we referring to christian churches?

If the point of it coming from Christianities influence is "unimportant" as is the case that Easter is pre-Christian... they both are on the same grounds and relevance in the topic. They're both appealing to the concept of the pasts and origins.

You are choosing and picking what you think are the important and not important elements of the view. On your own, others don't agree with you. Because you're using inconsistent modes of logic.

You're saying, we're secular! So they don't matter... but you'r saying the fact it's a pagan holiday makes it not christian. It's a Secular nation though! That means the point of it being "pagan" is irrelevant too. If it's not deemed a national holiday it isn't one, it's a religious holiday. That's entirely what it is.

I don't care why they're referring to the churches nor do I care why they celebrate Easter or care to celebrate it. It's not secular holiday and never was. Even if you secularly celebrate it... it's not nor never was removed from a religious connotation.

If you wanted to "show these churches we are a secular nation" You could easily start by not celebrating Easter... Proclaim these equinox-based celebration events based on the agricultural relevance they spawned from. You know in a non-religious way but a human communal way.

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20-01-2016, 04:58 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 03:51 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(20-01-2016 01:07 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  You missed the critical fact ignoring the process point... that Easter began being celebrated in New Zealand because of Christians.
that point is unimportant. Nz is a secular country now.

Many non christians celebrate easter for non christian reasons. The easter holidays are not owned by christians.

Easter harks back to non christian beliefs it did not originate from christianity. They have no claim to it in a secular country.


Quote: You'r historical account is just dismissing the fact that it is entirely because of Christianity.
I have addressed this false claim already. The most important point is that my country is secular. Why on earth are we referring to christian churches?

You entirely miss the fact that your accusation of hijacking because they want to change the way they set the date is simply incorrect.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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20-01-2016, 05:00 PM (This post was last modified: 20-01-2016 05:26 PM by Chas.)
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 01:01 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(20-01-2016 04:33 AM)Chas Wrote:  The origin of your country's celebration of an Easter holiday is undoubtedly due to its historically Christian society.
So if there is any 'hijacking' being done, it is by you, not the Christians.
Fact 1 - The origin of Easter is the celebration of the fertility goddess Estre
Fact 2 - Easter eggs and bunnies are symbols of fertility.
Fact 3 - NZ is a secular country
Fact 4 - NZ has a current way of calculating when Easter is to be celebrated.
Fact 5 - Many Christian organisations want to change how the date is to be calculated.
Fact 6 - I celebrate Easter each year
Fact 7 - NZ annual leave days apply to me.
Fact 8 - I have never celebrated the death and resurrection of the mythical Jesus.
Fact 9 - I don't care if the Christians want to celebrate Easter within their churches on a different date.
Fact 10 - I don't accept that my secular country ought to refer to the Catholic church on when to recognise this holiday in our secular country. The origin after all is the fertility goddess, Christianity has nothing to do with Easter and NZ isn't a Christian country.

If YOU personally think Easter IS owned by the Christian faith and that secular countries that officially celebrate Easter (by supporting laws of annual holidays and trade restrictions) OUGHT TO refer to Christian leaders as to when to set the dates, then that is your personal prerogative.

I am happy for you to disagree with me, I am happy for you to express your conflicting opinion.

But what I constantly find when attempting to have a conversation with Chas is that in your always arrogant, and derogatory way, your posts are dripping with filth and slime (when you disagree with someone). Which is probably an accurate reflection of your personality.

It's never a pleasure talking to you. If I met you in real life, I'd quickly learn that you are a person to avoid talking to or associating with.

Filth and slime? You're hilarious. Drinking Beverage

And it was you who made this personal and started with personal insult and name-calling.

Grow up.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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20-01-2016, 05:08 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
Who cares. I mean does it really effect us as Atheists if they make it on a fixed date?
I think it's a good thing and they should do it. It will make planning a lot easier if we know that on X date it's Easter. Sorta like Christmas. Good for schools and businesses.

And after all it is their holiday. Yea it's got its roots in pagan shit but comon, 1,000 years ago... It's very much a Christian holiday now celebrating the execution of a fictional character and the zombie rising of that same fictional character.

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20-01-2016, 08:42 PM
RE: Christians wanting to hijack Easter
(20-01-2016 05:08 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Who cares. I mean does it really effect us as Atheists if they make it on a fixed date?
Depends if it falls on a week-end or mid week, or something. We used to missout on waitangi and ANZAC day when if fell on the week-end.


(20-01-2016 05:08 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  And after all it is their holiday. Yea it's got its roots in pagan shit but comon, 1,000 years ago... It's very much a Christian holiday now celebrating the execution of a fictional character and the zombie rising of that same fictional character.
I disagree. I celebrate Easter, it has nothing to do with Christianity for me. My country is secular.
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