Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
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17-02-2015, 01:07 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 08:59 AM)Learner Wrote:  To me, it kinda seems like the National Autism Association is a little hoky or run by anti-vaxers.

Me too.

(17-02-2015 08:54 AM)Learner Wrote:  The National Autism Association believes:

--Vaccinations can trigger or exacerbate autism in some, if not many, children, especially those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions.
--Other environmental exposures may trigger, or exacerbate, autism in certain children, especially those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions."

They betray their bias in their wording. Why not phrase it as "Vaccinations may trigger or exacerbate autism in those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions." That seems reasonable. Why try to quantify it with "some, if not many" unless you got some ulterior motive? Why even single out vaccinations at all. "Environmental exposures may trigger, or exacerbate, autism in those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions." would seem to cover it. Tinfoil hats.

#sigh
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17-02-2015, 01:08 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:02 PM)JDog554 Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 01:00 PM)Learner Wrote:  What's your source that proves not only that vaccines don't cause autism, but that vaccines couldn't be a trigger for those with a genetic predisposition? I'm trying to obliterate these arguments from every possible angle. Point me to the study, and that's all I'm asking for.

CDC website has plenty of information on how vaccines work, what they are made of, how the body handles them ect.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/

Yes, the CDC website is a great resource. But this still doesn't provide any evidence addressing the main question of this post. I'm hoping someone on here who's heard this type of reasoning before can point me to a study that's been done or research to show that vaccines do not trigger/exacerbate autism in those with a genetic predisposition.
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17-02-2015, 01:11 PM (This post was last modified: 17-02-2015 01:14 PM by Learner.)
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:07 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 08:59 AM)Learner Wrote:  To me, it kinda seems like the National Autism Association is a little hoky or run by anti-vaxers.

Me too.

(17-02-2015 08:54 AM)Learner Wrote:  The National Autism Association believes:

--Vaccinations can trigger or exacerbate autism in some, if not many, children, especially those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions.
--Other environmental exposures may trigger, or exacerbate, autism in certain children, especially those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions."

They betray their bias in their wording. Why not phrase it as "Vaccinations may trigger or exacerbate autism in those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions." That seems reasonable. Why try to quantify it with "some, if not many" unless you got some ulterior motive? Why even single out vaccinations at all. "Environmental exposures may trigger, or exacerbate, autism in those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions." would seem to cover it. Tinfoil hats.

Thank you, GirlyMan! Those are some good observations about the seeming ulterior motive in that statement. I wonder who runs this organization. Just to make sure I understand your post, though, were you saying you think it's reasonable that vaccinations could potentially trigger/exacerbate autism in some who are genetically predisposed, just as environmental exposures could? OR were you just saying that with their understanding, that's how they should've worded things to less betray their bias?
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17-02-2015, 01:14 PM (This post was last modified: 17-02-2015 01:18 PM by JDog554.)
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:08 PM)Learner Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 01:02 PM)JDog554 Wrote:  CDC website has plenty of information on how vaccines work, what they are made of, how the body handles them ect.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/

Yes, the CDC website is a great resource. But this still doesn't provide any evidence addressing the main question of this post. I'm hoping someone on here who's heard this type of reasoning before can point me to a study that's been done or research to show that vaccines do not trigger/exacerbate autism in those with a genetic predisposition.

There hasn't been many studies because it's a false claim from the start. This claim only came to be because of a false report surfaced online in 2004. Before that fears of vaccines and autism were not a concern.

Here is a study though, done by the Institute of Medicine that shows that the MMR vaccine does not have an affect on Autism.

http://www.iom.edu/Reports/2004/Immuniza...utism.aspx


Edit: Also there is no triggers of Autism. You either have it or you don't. It's neurological, not psychological.

"If you keep trying to better yourself that's enough for me. We don't decide which hand we are dealt in life, but we make the decision to play it or fold it" - Nishi Karano Kaze
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17-02-2015, 01:20 PM (This post was last modified: 17-02-2015 01:27 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:08 PM)Learner Wrote:  I'm hoping someone on here who's heard this type of reasoning before can point me to a study that's been done or research to show that vaccines do not trigger/exacerbate autism in those with a genetic predisposition.

There is no means to conduct such a study. Science cannot rule out that some individuals particularly sensitive to one or more of the components of a vaccine may experience adverse effects. In fact, we know there are. What we can say is that statistically the likelihood of you displaying autism whether you received vaccines or not is insignificant.

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17-02-2015, 01:21 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:14 PM)JDog554 Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 01:08 PM)Learner Wrote:  Yes, the CDC website is a great resource. But this still doesn't provide any evidence addressing the main question of this post. I'm hoping someone on here who's heard this type of reasoning before can point me to a study that's been done or research to show that vaccines do not trigger/exacerbate autism in those with a genetic predisposition.

There hasn't been many studies because it's a false claim from the start. This claim only came to be because of a false report surfaced online in 2004. Before that fears of vaccines and autism were not a concern.

Here is a study though, done by the Institute of Medicine that shows that the MMR vaccine does not have an affect on Autism.

http://www.iom.edu/Reports/2004/Immuniza...utism.aspx


Edit: Also there is no triggers of Autism. You either have it or you don't. It's neurological, not psychological.

Great point, JDog544:
"Also there is no triggers of Autism. You either have it or you don't. It's neurological, not psychological."

And thanks for the study.
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17-02-2015, 01:22 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:21 PM)Learner Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 01:14 PM)JDog554 Wrote:  There hasn't been many studies because it's a false claim from the start. This claim only came to be because of a false report surfaced online in 2004. Before that fears of vaccines and autism were not a concern.

Here is a study though, done by the Institute of Medicine that shows that the MMR vaccine does not have an affect on Autism.

http://www.iom.edu/Reports/2004/Immuniza...utism.aspx


Edit: Also there is no triggers of Autism. You either have it or you don't. It's neurological, not psychological.

Great point, JDog544:
"Also there is no triggers of Autism. You either have it or you don't. It's neurological, not psychological."

And thanks for the study.

Glad I could help.

"If you keep trying to better yourself that's enough for me. We don't decide which hand we are dealt in life, but we make the decision to play it or fold it" - Nishi Karano Kaze
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17-02-2015, 01:24 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
The NAS was a very useful resource for us (parents). They really helped to move the agenda forward when no one (politicians, eduction system, NHS) was taking any of it seriously.

Reading your NAA link, Learner, I'd say they're a bit more hokier than the Brits ... but that goes without saying, doesn't it?

Big Grin

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17-02-2015, 01:26 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 01:20 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 01:08 PM)Learner Wrote:  I'm hoping someone on here who's heard this type of reasoning before can point me to a study that's been done or research to show that vaccines do not trigger/exacerbate autism in those with a genetic predisposition.

There is no means to conduct such a study. Science cannot rule out that some individuals particularly sensitive to one or more of the components of a vaccine will experience adverse effects. In fact, we know there are. What we can say is that statistically the likelihood of you displaying autism whether you received vaccines or not is insignificant.

Right, that's a good point. To state that vaccines could trigger or exacerbate autism for those with a genetic predisposition...well, that's not really a testable statement. It's merely a belief or an assertion.

Thanks, everyone, for helping me think through these issues.
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17-02-2015, 03:11 PM
RE: Claim: vaccines can "trigger or exacerbate autism in some...genetically predisposed"
(17-02-2015 12:45 PM)Learner Wrote:  
(17-02-2015 12:17 PM)WeAreTheCosmos Wrote:  One guy I work with claims his son was normal until he got the MMR vaccine. Another guy I know claims his son was fine until he got measles...

If you want to keep your family from freezing to death in the winter, you keep a roof over their head... And then complain that they'd have been better off without a house after you lose them in a fire...

(17-02-2015 12:20 PM)JDog554 Wrote:  Do you trust Harvard?


http://www.health.harvard.edu/vaccinatio...vs-reality

I agree with you both, but you missed my main question in my post above. (The issue of talking about various aspects of vaccines needs everyone to slow down and clearly communicate.) We all agree vaccines do not cause autism, and numerous studies have proven this. Since you clearly missed the question above, let me reiterate it: is it a true statement that "vaccinations can trigger or exacerbate autism in some, if not many, children, especially those who are genetically predisposed to immune, autoimmune or inflammatory conditions?"

I suppose it could be possible. However, if it has triggered any errors in the immune response (autoimmune), I would be willing to bet that its been in an incredibly small percentage of the cases (of those claiming such).

I suffer from an autoimmune disorder that was definitely triggered when I got a certain sinus infection years ago.

Of course, if autism was actually proven to BE an autoimmune disorder... That might give the theory a little more credibility. If they can show any the viruses used in the vaccine to be similar to the molecules/proteins that are under attack by autism?(as an autoimmune), then errors in the immune system COULD be from the vaccine... But that's a lot of ifs, mights, and coulds.
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