Climate Change - General Discussion
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19-03-2017, 10:46 AM (This post was last modified: 19-03-2017 11:30 AM by Kaneda.)
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
This is not a joke here, but does anyone think there's a good chance we could see an engineered pandemic happen in the next few years, on the scale of what happened in Dawn of the Planet of the Apes?

I mean, the possibility is already being alluded to by the wonderful Bill Gates. Who else has seen this piece in some form in the last couple weeks?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washing...l-with-it/

For all we know, he could be setting up a false flag to draw attention away from (I'm brandishing my tinfoil hat here) a global plan to cleanse most of the population from the Earth and quickly shut down this ecocidal civilization before it brings everything down with it. This would go a long way in preventing resource wars and leave a lot of room to restore ecosystems that were previously cleared to make room for cities and agriculture (the relentless pace of automation might put this within the means of just a few million people). Not to sound morbid, but a great culling might even be more merciful than the alternative of leaving billions to their own devices and drawing a futile conflict out a few more horrible years.

In short, what better way to deal with the ramifications of 7 billion people on a dying planet than to not have 7 billion people in the first place? Entertain that possibility for a bit.

"Men willingly believe what they wish." -Julius Caesar
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19-03-2017, 11:08 AM (This post was last modified: 19-03-2017 11:24 AM by Thoreauvian.)
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
(19-03-2017 10:46 AM)Kaneda Wrote:  In short, what better way to deal with the ramifications of 7 billion people on a dying planet than to not have 7 billion people in the first place? Entertain that possibility for a bit.

I've entertained the idea of a bio-engineered plague with some of the movies I've watched, but never more seriously. The logic is "burn down the village to save it", which makes no sense to me. Some theists may be comfortable playing God, but I don't see why any atheists should be. I would much rather face the survival lottery that nature itself will throw at us on an over-populated planet which is running low on basic resources. If that involved a worldwide plague, it would likely be our own fault anyway.

Sad
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19-03-2017, 12:25 PM (This post was last modified: 19-03-2017 01:15 PM by Kaneda.)
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
(19-03-2017 11:08 AM)Jay Vogelsong Wrote:  The logic is "burn down the village to save it", which makes no sense to me. Some theists may be comfortable playing God, but I don't see why any atheists should be.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I'd say it's within the purview of the secular community to try and burn down the village to save it. The pro-life crowd, in my experience, seems like it would be more privy to drawing things out if things get really bad, every life being precious and all.

"Men willingly believe what they wish." -Julius Caesar
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19-03-2017, 01:32 PM
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
In some ways it's similar to a large asteroid that's going to 100% hit for sure in 100 years.

You're still going to live your life and companies are still going to do what they do.

Sometimes I feel like climate change and its effects are similar to this.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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19-03-2017, 01:54 PM
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
(19-03-2017 01:32 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  In some ways it's similar to a large asteroid that's going to 100% hit for sure in 100 years.

Yeah, but what about that whole transitory period where we witness a full-scale collapse of food supply chains, everything that relies on cheap transportation and nations fight amongst themselves for remaining resources? There's already a sizeable chunk of the population preparing for the crackup of civilization, as shown in articles like this one. More and more people are already waking up, and I'm convinced we are going to see a cultural tipping point in the next few years. What happens in the meantime, as our current consumer society falls apart along those lines, and what will the bottleneck look like during that turbulent transition?

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19-03-2017, 01:57 PM
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
(19-03-2017 11:08 AM)Jay Vogelsong Wrote:  
(19-03-2017 10:46 AM)Kaneda Wrote:  In short, what better way to deal with the ramifications of 7 billion people on a dying planet than to not have 7 billion people in the first place? Entertain that possibility for a bit.

I've entertained the idea of a bio-engineered plague with some of the movies I've watched, but never more seriously. The logic is "burn down the village to save it", which makes no sense to me. Some theists may be comfortable playing God, but I don't see why any atheists should be. I would much rather face the survival lottery that nature itself will throw at us on an over-populated planet which is running low on basic resources. If that involved a worldwide plague, it would likely be our own fault anyway.

Sad

The thing is, with a targeted attack like a plague, that you're not "burning down the village to save it", you're killing the villagers to save a few of them, during a drought or siege (or similar resource scarcity).

I do not wish to see any solution which requires the death (or harm) of anyone, but I can understand where some megalomaniacal billionaire would start seeing it as a solution. [Edit to Add: I strongly doubt it would be Bill Gates, given the work he and Melinda do to alleviate human suffering in poverty-stricken areas.]

Ecosystem collapse, which leads to the extinction of thousands of species and the slow death by starvation of billions, would be just as bad as a virus... and because of its drawn-out, fighting-over-dwindling-resources nature, could lead to a war in which nuclear weapons fly.

Once we involve large scale nuclear warfare, it's over. Fallout on that scale is pretty much unsurvivable, in the long term.

Given the risk of exterminating the entire planet and rendering it uninhabitable by anything for the next several thousand years, and our unwillingness to do anything to stop the course we're on as a species, I can understand why some would see a targeted elimination of most of the human species as a solution.

Again, that's not to say I agree in any way with this solution (or any other form of genocide), only that I can see why some would contemplate it, and why we should fear them.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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19-03-2017, 02:02 PM
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
Look up a YouTube Red movie called "The Thinning"

They install population controls through testing for the brightest kids. If you don't do well on test, you are killed.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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19-03-2017, 02:06 PM (This post was last modified: 19-03-2017 02:09 PM by Kaneda.)
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
Yeah, I'm just going to leave this here, to lighten the mood a bit:




"Men willingly believe what they wish." -Julius Caesar
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19-03-2017, 02:33 PM
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
(19-03-2017 01:57 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  Ecosystem collapse, which leads to the extinction of thousands of species and the slow death by starvation of billions, would be just as bad as a virus... and because of its drawn-out, fighting-over-dwindling-resources nature, could lead to a war in which nuclear weapons fly.

I read one science fiction book on the future of climate change which imagined that India and Pakistan might come to nuclear blows over dwindling water supplies caused by glaciers disappearing in the Himalayas. That doesn't seem too far-fetched.
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19-03-2017, 03:29 PM
RE: Climate Change - General Discussion
(19-03-2017 02:33 PM)Jay Vogelsong Wrote:  
(19-03-2017 01:57 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  Ecosystem collapse, which leads to the extinction of thousands of species and the slow death by starvation of billions, would be just as bad as a virus... and because of its drawn-out, fighting-over-dwindling-resources nature, could lead to a war in which nuclear weapons fly.

I read one science fiction book on the future of climate change which imagined that India and Pakistan might come to nuclear blows over dwindling water supplies caused by glaciers disappearing in the Himalayas. That doesn't seem too far-fetched.

I saw a TED talk about that.
That's probably going to be the canary in the coal mine.

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