Community Policy
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30-08-2012, 10:24 AM
RE: Community Policy
I don't think changes need to be made either. N00bs can stick to the intro forums as a safe place and venture out as they feel ready.

Last night, I took the opportunity to go back to my own very first posts. I did in fact, stay in the introduction forums for my first ten or so posts. When I felt ready, my first post was, as I said previously in an S T Ranger thread. I recall feeling pretty good when I received encouragement from veteran posters. Had I not thrown myself out there that first time... I don't think I would have stuck around ... or at least become as active.

I think in the end, I just feel like I'm a secular person who has a skeptical eye toward any extraordinary claim, carefully examining any extraordinary evidence before jumping to conclusions. ~ Eric ~ My friend ... who figured it out.
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30-08-2012, 10:26 AM
RE: Community Policy
Just because I love restating the same thing I'll repeat what I said when people were complaining about Egor.

An adequate solution would be for people to stop replying to people who you feel are trolling, being abusive or being an asshole in any other way. Instead, just place them on ignore. If everyone started doing this then problem people would essentially cease to exist on the forum. Their posts would be left unread and conversations would just carry on around them completely uninterrupted, it also doesn't take much willpower to not enter a thread by someone who you know you don't like.

One person doesn't derail a thread, whenever a troll is accused of derailing a thread then we've actually played as big a part as the troll. If they make one comment then it hardly derails a thread, what derails a thread is when ten people then reply to said troll causing him to then reply to all of those posts.

Best and worst of Ferdinand .....
Best
Ferdinand: We don't really say 'theist' in Alabama. Here, you're either a Christian, or you're from Afghanistan and we fucking hate you.
Worst
Ferdinand: Everyone from British is so, like, fucking retarded.
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30-08-2012, 10:34 AM
RE: Community Policy
Lucradis: Problem with me disagreing? I am all for freedom, freedome of everything, not only speech.. but you know what. Your freedom stops at the point where you get in the way of other people's freedom. That goes for everything including speech. Therfore weak argument to say a rule for it can not be made because it would get in the way of freedom of speech. It is not cencoring stuff, it is getting rid of pure trolls, because that is what I am saying. Not talking about users that do both, post normally and troll a bit.

Erxomai: I conveniently deleted the second part because it was not part of the point I made plus it was so long that it would have been snipped which I did not want to happen.

Vosur: Good thing you bring up the ignore button. Yes it does exist, but you don't get rid of such people by using it, you just save your own sanity, while the person in question gets a wild card to continue. And the trolls are not all of a sudden a problem, they are a problem. The bigger the community grows the more of them will come. And we saw now and in the past how one troll alone can get the forum upside down, imagine if we have a few more at the same time... Not cool, and not as easy as you think. ignore button is only good when enough people use it, so the trolls don't get fed. But that's never happening, so they stay.




Now I just want to make something clear. I know that the mods and admins here are not lazy and over all I feel really well in this forum. I like it for many reasons and I stated that in that other thread in this section. I did not lie. Even with trolls this is by far the most sane place that I have found on the internet so far. I don't feel trolled and haven't felt so here ever.
But trolls will become a real problem in the future as this forum grows and I would not like to see this forum go down the hills just because nothing was done in time. Right now we don't have a lot of them here, so it is now the time to think about it properly and find solutions for the few we have every now and then and for the future when more come.
You see, as far as I have seen it here, everytime we have one of those complete trolls (not jerks!) a thread has been opened and the topic discussed. Why is nothing happening? Is it really so difficult to deal with this topic? If you seriously want to change something and would like to know a few different models of how to deal with it in a satisfactory way, I am willing to share what I know from experience but if that turns out, like last time, in me investing time and typing it all down, just to have it ignored, I won't.

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30-08-2012, 10:44 AM
RE: Community Policy
Again with the ignore. Have you tried it? It screws up the entire board, threads make no sense anymore and threads started by the ignored still appear. Dunno why I have to keep repeating that and it gets ignored. (hmmm, that's funny!)

I never suggested a ban. I suggested a "free for all" forum where insults can be hurdled with gusto.

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30-08-2012, 10:45 AM (This post was last modified: 30-08-2012 10:50 AM by lucradis.)
RE: Community Policy
Maybe one thing that could be looked at would be improving the ignore function?

As per a bigger solution, put it this way, this forum is not big. A more wide reaching solution is more than likely inevitable. It will change the forum. Completely.

What I think we are looking for here as a community is a temporary solution and maybe an idea for the future as a more permanent solution.

As it stands now I, just me, don't see the need. That's just me. I think the problem is being inflated because of personal issues and in reality I, just me, believe this problem is tiny and not worth the trouble.

However I also believe there is no harm in discussing options.

The thing is, this whole debate is completely subjective. It's a "well I think" vs, "well I think" debate. People will say that a forum they once belonged to did something differently so therefor it should work here just fine, but that argument is invalid basically because those same people were drawn here and are currently here. It is further invalidated by the very size of the internet and mass amount of forums in existence. There is a place for everyone and every place is a little bit different. Otherwise we'd all be in one massive forum.

It's great that your old forum worked with more rules and regulations in place. This isn`t that place. It`s another place filled with other people.

Does the forum staff here value freedom of expression quite highly? Yes.

Not sure why the argument for freedom of expression is weak. I have yet to read a reasoning behind that argument, just blanket statements. But if that's your opinion that's perfectly fine. It's my opinion that it isn't weak at all, but instead is the cornerstone of what makes this forum special. Without it, this isn't TTA at all. At least not the one I recognize.
It comes with good and bad. There is NO denying that. So what the argument comes down to is whether the good outweighs the bad and vice versa.

Personally at this time I think the good of the freedoms this place has, out weigh the bad. But that's one sexy mans opinion. I don't agree with everyone, or like everyone but I don't think I have to to enjoy myself here. If I did I may have abused my power as admin back in the day and banned everyone who neg repped me just for kicks.

As it was I got flak for not banning several people and got flak when I banned another one. It's a tightrope because like I said before this argument is subjective.

What is over the top is subjective, so like Erxy said it might be best to continue the debate after definitions have been made.

Fuck me and my rambling lately.

Edit: Took too long to reply and everyone else posting while I was typing.

Leela: I have no problem with you disagreeing. Go right ahead. I absolutely disagree with you.
Saying that someones freedom stops when their freedom over rides yours is not my opinion. It stops when it steps on the majorities freedoms. That is my opinion. Which is why the rules are set up to deal with the majority. I still don't see much of an argument against the argument for freedom of expression in what you are saying, but again, that's just my opinion. Just to clarify as well I am in no bad temper here, not sure if anyone was getting that vibe from me. I'm coo.

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30-08-2012, 10:56 AM
RE: Community Policy
Firstly, I have no idea what all the fuss is about. Installing a "free for all" forum takes a few minutes. I'll be happy to do it for you.

Fixing the ignore is likely impossible, it would take rewriting the software and is complicated. I don't even see how it could be done - chunks of threads will be missing if posters are ignored. Nothing to be done about that.

I have no personal issues with this, it just pisses me off when people who came to learn to embrace atheism get chased off. It's counter productive for all of us. We want to spread it, not kill it.

As for Bishad - I never read any of his threads until now when they turned into a passive/aggressive playground. Which is kind of enjoyable I admit.

Again, what on earth is the fuss about installing a forum where insults can be hurdled to everyone's heart's content?

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30-08-2012, 11:01 AM
RE: Community Policy
Yeah, ignore the ignore on the ignore. Big Grin

The problem I got with Leela's "freedom that doesn't impinge on other's freedom" bit is that it's a predictive model. One has to predict where these borders lie, and they're fractal. Depend on mood, poster, tones, atmospheric pressure...

It's like "trying not to offend people," doesn't work. Some people look for any excuse to take offense. We're social animals like that, always looking for attention and validation. Both sides of the suffering issue are continuously exploited - because it's fucking easy - and most people are lazy thinkers.

I don't use no "ignore" button, and when a thread sprouts trolls that I find disagreeable-know what? I do something else. No matter what you wanna call it, it is censorship, and once it starts, it tends to continue until there's a dictatorship.

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30-08-2012, 11:06 AM
RE: Community Policy
(30-08-2012 11:01 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  I don't use no "ignore" button, and when a thread sprouts trolls that I find disagreeable-know what? I do something else. No matter what you wanna call it, it is censorship, and once it starts, it tends to continue until there's a dictatorship.
If your Gwynnie was the leader of said dictatorship, you wouldn't complain, now would you? Wink

(30-08-2012 10:44 AM)Dom Wrote:  Again with the ignore. Have you tried it? It screws up the entire board, threads make no sense anymore and threads started by the ignored still appear. Dunno why I have to keep repeating that and it gets ignored. (hmmm, that's funny!)
Yeah, I have. You'll have to accept these consequences if the posts of trolls bother you that much.

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30-08-2012, 11:07 AM
RE: Community Policy
I like the "Ignore" list... I used it quite a lot in conjunction with AbdelZ. I had him on it, and if I needed to see what was being referred to in something he posted, there is an option to momentarily see what this post says - it works like the "spoiler" button within the "ignore" option.
All I know is - I had AbdelZ on ignore, was able to follow a thread, but did it with a lot less stress. That was important for me at the time - the creepy asshole had previously PM'd me and really pissed me off. The ignore function made me feel like I wasn't missing anything but also made me feel like I was in control - not the asshole. Thumbsup

I think in the end, I just feel like I'm a secular person who has a skeptical eye toward any extraordinary claim, carefully examining any extraordinary evidence before jumping to conclusions. ~ Eric ~ My friend ... who figured it out.
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30-08-2012, 11:11 AM
RE: Community Policy
Dom I don't think the issue about the free for all section is so cut and dry.

We already have a free for all section. Fight club thread. But with a genuinely dedicated section you'd have to start policing the rest of the forum or it would lose it's purpose.

And I also don't think anyone is disregarding your statements about the ignore button. I might be wrong.

I think it's just that some people think it works just fine.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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