Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
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23-06-2016, 09:09 AM
Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 08:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(23-06-2016 08:46 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  That would be a good idea, if we could agree to just ignore each other.

Fat chance.
It would be convenient for bullshit spewing theists, not unlike yourself, who in no way have any support for the crap they spout if I did. You STILL have not addressed ONE of Carrier's or Price's arguments. You just demonstrated you know nothing about what Paul claimed in the NT.

Prove that Jesus existed. Do it now. Or STFU.


I don't do absolutes, I don't do proofs, or deal in selling 100% certainty.

I deal in likelihoods, such as a person whose cited on numerous occasions as having a brother named James, which we have first a hand account of individual meeting both his brother and his disciples, historians like Josephus writing of his brother's death, indicating that he was his brother. Is more likely to have existed than not.


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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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23-06-2016, 09:10 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 09:09 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-06-2016 08:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Fat chance.
It would be convenient for bullshit spewing theists, not unlike yourself, who in no way have any support for the crap they spout if I did. You STILL have not addressed ONE of Carrier's or Price's arguments. You just demonstrated you know nothing about what Paul claimed in the NT.

Prove that Jesus existed. Do it now. Or STFU.


I don't do absolutes, I don't do proofs, or deal in selling 100% certainty.

I deal in likelihoods, such as a person whose cited on numerous occasions as having a brother named James, which we have first a hand account of individual meeting both his brother and his disciples, historians like Josephus writing of his brother's death, indicating that he was his brother. Is more likely to have existed than not.


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"I don't do absolutes, I don't do proofs, or deal in selling 100% certainty."

All 3 of these statements are given in absolute terms Laugh out load

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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23-06-2016, 09:12 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 08:57 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  If you enjoy my company so much, I'm not too sure why you seem so eager to show me the door?

If you're constantly trying to kick me out, it can't be that fun then can it?

I honestly don't care what you do. However if you post things here which I know are untrue, I will point that out. (With links, usually...)

If you want to remain unchallenged, I suggest a private blog.

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Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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23-06-2016, 09:14 AM
Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 09:12 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
(23-06-2016 08:57 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  If you enjoy my company so much, I'm not too sure why you seem so eager to show me the door?

If you're constantly trying to kick me out, it can't be that fun then can it?

I honestly don't care what you do. However if you post things here which I know are untrue, I will point that out. (With links, usually...)

If you want to remain unchallenged, I suggest a private blog.

Yes, and I'll do the same, such as when people claim Philo was in Jerusalem around the time of Jesus's death, and I'll put their feet to the fire to force them to acknowledge their untruth.






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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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23-06-2016, 09:17 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 09:09 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-06-2016 08:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Fat chance.
It would be convenient for bullshit spewing theists, not unlike yourself, who in no way have any support for the crap they spout if I did. You STILL have not addressed ONE of Carrier's or Price's arguments. You just demonstrated you know nothing about what Paul claimed in the NT.

Prove that Jesus existed. Do it now. Or STFU.


I don't do absolutes, I don't do proofs, or deal in selling 100% certainty.

I deal in likelihoods, such as a person whose cited on numerous occasions as having a brother named James, which we have first a hand account of individual meeting both his brother and his disciples, historians like Josephus writing of his brother's death, indicating that he was his brother. Is more likely to have existed than not.

You don't do anything. You can't deal with Price's or Carrier's or anyone's objections. All you can do is repeat this same old opinion, which is questionable. You can't demonstrate that Josephus is reliable. You just FAILED to support your own claim about sources for the NT. You failed again. You are not even conversant enough with the facts or the culture to even begin to talk about Carrier's and Price's points.

Quote:Who is (not "whose") cited on numerous occasions as having a brother named James, which we have first a hand account of individual meeting both his brother and his disciples

You have a CLAIM by a person you can't even prove existed (Paul). It's worth nothing. Zeus was reported on numerous occasions to have a wife, and children. Am I to believe they all existed ?

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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23-06-2016, 09:24 AM
Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 09:17 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(23-06-2016 09:09 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  I don't do absolutes, I don't do proofs, or deal in selling 100% certainty.

I deal in likelihoods, such as a person whose cited on numerous occasions as having a brother named James, which we have first a hand account of individual meeting both his brother and his disciples, historians like Josephus writing of his brother's death, indicating that he was his brother. Is more likely to have existed than not.

You don't do anything. You can't deal with Price's or Carrier's of anyone's objections. All you can do is repeat this same old opinion, which is questionable. You can't demonstrate that Josephus is reliable. You just FAILED to support your own claim about sources for the NT. You failed again. You are not even conversant enough with the facts or the culture to even begin to talk about Carrier's and Price's points.

Quote:Who is (not "whose") cited on numerous occasions as having a brother named James, which we have first a hand account of individual meeting both his brother and his disciples

You have a CLAIM by a person you can't even prove existed (Paul). It's worth nothing. Zeus was reported on numerous occasions to have a wife, and children. Am I to believe they all existed ?


So what's your counter argument here, that given these multiple attestations of the James/Jesus connection not just by Paul, but even Josephus that this makes its more likely that Jesus did not exist? lol.

Do these attestations serve the case for non-existence or existence better. Do you acknowledge they're a bit of an inconvenience for those who want to argue for non-existence?

In your view is it reasonable to conclude that there was a historical Jesus based on factors like this?

Do you believe the conclusions regarding a historical Jesus drawn by folks like Ehrman are reasonable?


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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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23-06-2016, 10:02 AM
Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 08:58 AM)Chas Wrote:  No one is corroborating it. You can't use the Bible to prove the Bible.

The Bible is a collection of writings,by various authors concerned with a variety of purposes. NT text, didn't become canonized into the bible, until few hundred years after they were written.

So what you seem to be suggesting here is not that we can't use the bible as evidence for historical events, and persons, but we can't use the writings of believers as evidence for historical events and persons.

In fact you seem to be suggesting that only non-Christian sources can serve as evidence.

Is that it?

Of course historians and scholars are not likely to agree with you, but you're entitled to your own personal beliefs here.







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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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23-06-2016, 10:10 AM
Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 09:00 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  I'm constantly trying to get you to be honest about why you're here.

I'm here to preach. Isn't that the honest response you were looking for anyways?


Quote:And your continued dishonesty as well as you wanting those of us who call you on your bullshit to ignore you so you can preach without distraction, makes it all the more clear what your intentions seem to be (even if you aren't fully aware of your own intentions).

And my intentions are to preach, and find ways to get rid of obstacles and impediments to this.

Quote:If you want people to ignore you instead of holding your feet to the fire, you're on the wrong fucking forum. So either stop bitching and moaning and address the points being raised to you, or fuck off Drinking Beverage

I'm not the one telling you to leave, you are lol. All you do is bitch and moan about me preaching, if it bothers you so much you're on the wrong forum, and need to join one that prohibits this.





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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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23-06-2016, 10:13 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
I find it quite amazing that people still cling to Josephus as some sort of proof.
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23-06-2016, 10:14 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(23-06-2016 10:10 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-06-2016 09:00 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  I'm constantly trying to get you to be honest about why you're here.

I'm here to preach. Isn't that the honest response you were looking for anyways?


Quote:And your continued dishonesty as well as you wanting those of us who call you on your bullshit to ignore you so you can preach without distraction, makes it all the more clear what your intentions seem to be (even if you aren't fully aware of your own intentions).

And my intentions are to preach, and find ways to get rid of obstacles and impediments to this.

Quote:If you want people to ignore you instead of holding your feet to the fire, you're on the wrong fucking forum. So either stop bitching and moaning and address the points being raised to you, or fuck off Drinking Beverage

I'm not the one telling you to leave, you are lol. All you do is bitch and moan about me preaching, if it bothers you so much you're on the wrong forum, and need to join one that prohibits this.





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"I'm here to preach. Isn't that the honest response you were looking for anyways? "

It's what you actually do. Are you honestly admitting that this is the reason you're here, or do you think you're being cleverly sarcastic?

"And my intentions are to preach, and find ways to get rid of obstacles and impediments to this. "

Are you honestly admitting that this is the reason you're here, or do you think you're being cleverly sarcastic?

"I'm not the one telling you to leave, you are lol. All you do is bitch and moan about me preaching, if it bothers you so much you're on the wrong forum, and need to join one that prohibits this."

You're the one bitching and moaning about people giving you a hard time about your preaching. If you want to preach and not be called out on it, you're on the wrong fucking forum.



But if you are actually now admitting to just being here to preach, that makes you a....(wait for it)....liar. Because YOU have explicitly given different reasons for being here that were not only to not preach, but you vehemently denied your preaching intentions.

This wouldn't be atypical for you (to accuse others of your failings)

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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