Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
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09-07-2016, 08:48 PM (This post was last modified: 09-07-2016 09:03 PM by GoingUp.)
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(09-07-2016 07:33 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(09-07-2016 06:10 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  The author(s)/ediitors of Matthew were obsessed with the new fad at the time, .... "prophecy fulfillment". He placed Yushua there, as it suited his purpose ... prophecy fulfillment.

"And he came and dwelt in a city
called Nazareth: that it might be
fulfilled which was spoken by the
prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene."

It's not only "wrong", it's SO wrong it's laughable.

Thanks for reminding me of this.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is no record of any prophet even saying this, right?

PS "city?" Haha.

No record we are aware of.

But why invent a town that didn't exist, only to put a person (Jesus) into it who also didn't exist, and then have absolutely nobody in ancient history saying anything to the effect of, "Nazareth? No such place exists, so what are they talking about?" or, "Jesus? Oh yes, he was an invention of the Christians."

Thia argument from silence is validated, because it is perfectly reasonable to expect some evidence of somebody in antiquity to be saying something about either Nazareth of Jesus not existing.

Since we have plenty of evidence of anti-Christian rhetoric dating all the way back to nearly the 1st century- with much of that anti-Christian literature speaking out against far more important things than Nazareth- the fact that no one mentions a fake story regarding a non-existent town called Nazareth- home town of Jesus- speaks loudly from its complete silence.
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09-07-2016, 10:37 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
This is interesting...

"Never heard of the place' – Josephus

In his histories, Josephus has a lot to say about Galilee (an area of barely 900 square miles). During the first Jewish war, in the 60s AD, Josephus led a military campaign back and forth across the tiny province. Josephus mentions 45 cities and villages of Galilee – yet Nazareth not at all.

Josephus does, however, have something to say about Japha (Yafa, Japhia), a village just one mile to the southwest of Nazareth where he himself lived for a time (Life 52).

A glance at a topographical map of the region shows that Nazareth is located at one end of a valley, bounded on three sides by hills. Natural access to this valley is from the southwest.

Before the first Jewish war, Japha was of a reasonable size. We know it had an early synagogue, destroyed by the Romans in 67 AD (Revue Biblique 1921, 434f). In that war, it's inhabitants were massacred (Wars 3, 7.31). Josephus reports that 15,000 were killed by Trajan's troops. The survivors – 2,130 woman and children – were carried away into captivity. A one-time active city was completely and decisively wiped out.

Now where on earth did the 1st century inhabitants of Japha bury their dead? In the tombs further up the valley!

With Japha's complete destruction, tomb use at the Nazareth site would have ended. The unnamed necropolis today lies under the modern city of Nazareth.

At a later time – as pottery and other finds indicate(see below) – the Nazareth site was re-occupied. This was after the Bar Kochba revolt of 135 AD and the general Jewish exodus from Judea to Galilee. The new hamlet was based on subsistence farming and was quite unrelated to the previous tomb usage by the people of Japha."

From Ken Humphrey's website
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09-07-2016, 11:13 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(09-07-2016 08:48 PM)GoingUp Wrote:  
(09-07-2016 07:33 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Thanks for reminding me of this.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is no record of any prophet even saying this, right?

PS "city?" Haha.

No record we are aware of.

But why invent a town that didn't exist, only to put a person (Jesus) into it who also didn't exist, and then have absolutely nobody in ancient history saying anything to the effect of, "Nazareth? No such place exists, so what are they talking about?" or, "Jesus? Oh yes, he was an invention of the Christians."

Thia argument from silence is validated, because it is perfectly reasonable to expect some evidence of somebody in antiquity to be saying something about either Nazareth of Jesus not existing.

Since we have plenty of evidence of anti-Christian rhetoric dating all the way back to nearly the 1st century- with much of that anti-Christian literature speaking out against far more important things than Nazareth- the fact that no one mentions a fake story regarding a non-existent town called Nazareth- home town of Jesus- speaks loudly from its complete silence.

As far as I'm aware, we don't know when the 'Nazareth" bit was added. It could have been early 4th century. By then, N probably existed.
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10-07-2016, 09:52 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(09-07-2016 10:37 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  From Ken Humphrey's website

Ok!

Laugh out load
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11-07-2016, 08:27 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
Thanks for your input, asswipe.

I love it when superstitious twits have their superstitions exposed!

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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11-07-2016, 09:33 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(11-07-2016 08:27 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  Thanks for your input, asswipe.

I love it when superstitious twits have their superstitions exposed!

That's odd, Mark never came across to me as being superstitious.

Big Grin
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11-07-2016, 10:03 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(11-07-2016 09:33 PM)GoingUp Wrote:  
(11-07-2016 08:27 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  Thanks for your input, asswipe.

I love it when superstitious twits have their superstitions exposed!

That's odd, Mark never came across to me as being superstitious.

Big Grin

If at first you don't succeed, act like a cunt. You can go now kiddo.

It is held that valour is the chiefest virtue and most dignifies the haver.
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11-07-2016, 10:43 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(11-07-2016 09:33 PM)GoingUp Wrote:  
(11-07-2016 08:27 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  Thanks for your input, asswipe.

I love it when superstitious twits have their superstitions exposed!

That's odd, Mark never came across to me as being superstitious.

Big Grin

I guess that probably is the best you can do.

Perhaps I shall take pity on you.







Then again.................

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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11-07-2016, 11:24 PM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
I thought it was pretty funny, actually. Just my $0.02 on it.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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12-07-2016, 09:43 AM
RE: Contemporary Accounts of Jesus
(11-07-2016 10:03 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  
(11-07-2016 09:33 PM)GoingUp Wrote:  That's odd, Mark never came across to me as being superstitious.

Big Grin

If at first you don't succeed, act like a cunt. You can go now kiddo.

I don't know how you can conclude that I am being a cunt by defending against an accusation against Mark as one who is superstitious.

Big Grin
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