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25-04-2011, 11:40 AM
 
RE: Control.
Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you. Hope that helped.
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25-04-2011, 02:36 PM
RE: Control.
(24-04-2011 05:10 PM)Cetaceaphile Wrote:  Not really. Even things as simple as what really happened at Pearl Harbor gets me.

The Japanese surprised the US and bombed it, sinking a good chunk of the Pacific Fleet, killing just under 3,000 US servicemen (almost half on the Arizona alone) and drew the US, finally, into World War 2 where we proceeded to kick ass, take names and save most of humanity from enslavement and annihilation, only to find large numbers of humanity were a bunch of ingrates.

What's the mystery?

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
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25-04-2011, 03:32 PM
 
RE: Control.
(25-04-2011 02:36 PM)BnW Wrote:  
(24-04-2011 05:10 PM)Cetaceaphile Wrote:  Not really. Even things as simple as what really happened at Pearl Harbor gets me.

The Japanese surprised the US and bombed it, sinking a good chunk of the Pacific Fleet, killing just under 3,000 US servicemen (almost half on the Arizona alone) and drew the US, finally, into World War 2 where we proceeded to kick ass, take names and save most of humanity from enslavement and annihilation, only to find large numbers of humanity were a bunch of ingrates.

What's the mystery?

Not quite so simple. The US did not declare war on Italy and Germany until December 11, after Italy and Germany declared war on them first. I have no doubt that Roosevelt would have preferred to concentrate on Japan, but fortunately he was pushed into the wider conflict.

I know you probably learned your WWII history from Hollywood movies, but please try to remember there were other countries involved. Including Russia, without whom it would have gone on for much longer.

People tend to sound ungrateful when Americans claim to have done it all themselves.
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25-04-2011, 04:05 PM
RE: Control.
(25-04-2011 03:32 PM)riggbeck Wrote:  People tend to sound ungrateful when Americans claim to have done it all themselves.

You must be one o' them Commies. Mister President warned us about your types. Comin' into our good ol' American websites and sowin' dissension. Well, we ain't havin' none o' that!

O say can you see
By the dawn's early light
What so proudly we hailed
At the twilight's last gleaming...


[Image: statue_of_liberty_3.jpg]

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
- Terry Pratchett
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25-04-2011, 04:50 PM
 
RE: Control.
(25-04-2011 04:05 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(25-04-2011 03:32 PM)riggbeck Wrote:  People tend to sound ungrateful when Americans claim to have done it all themselves.

You must be one o' them Commies. Mister President warned us about your types. Comin' into our good ol' American websites and sowin' dissension. Well, we ain't havin' none o' that!

O say can you see
By the dawn's early light
What so proudly we hailed
At the twilight's last gleaming...


[Image: statue_of_liberty_3.jpg]

Dang! How did you guess?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGXOjm95WWo

Haven't worked out how to insert a video yet.
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25-04-2011, 05:48 PM
RE: Control.
I'm not listeniiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing!

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
- Terry Pratchett
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26-04-2011, 01:10 AM
RE: Control.
Now that you have mentioned our saviors The Americans, did you know that the ex-state of Yugoslavia was the only one that freed itself, neither Americans, nor Russians or English helped us, we did it just with our own partisans. Then came decades of communism...

Smile

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26-04-2011, 12:16 PM
RE: Control.
I read one of your other threads that lead me to this one.

I have to admit getting the same feeling but when you watch these shows or read these stories remember that they are intended to invoke an emotional response. When I look back at these shows/stories I always feel more at ease and I am able to reanalyze what I just saw/heard. For instance, the whole JFK conspiracy. Movies, documentaries and numerous other media outlets have left me baffled at "coincidences" surrounding his assassination and when I am emotionally and intellectually engaged in them it becomes hard to shake this feeling of....creepiness (I guess that is an adequate way of describing it). After I remove myself from it emotionally and allow myself time to think and analyze what I have just heard I typically come away thinking that sure it is possible but there is also evidence to the contrary and perceived coincidences are sometimes just not valid. The creepiness factor only exists in the moment while I am engaged in the programs and emotionally compromised. But that's just me.

Evolve
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26-04-2011, 01:24 PM
RE: Control.
riggbeck - first, my response was somewhat sarcastic. And, as for history, I'm very well familiar with history in general and WWII in particular. For example, I happen to know that, President Roosevelt arguably violated several US laws of the era when he supplied the French and English with planes, ships and munitions with which to fight Hitler and without those armaments the British may not have been able to hang on; I know that contrary to popular belief that the attack on Pearl Harbor was the US' first military engagement with Japan in WWII we actually had been supplying the Chinese with arms, planes and even pilots and helping them out in southern China and as far as Burma to help them defend themselves against the Japanese while cutting off Japans supply of oil (which was the primary reason the Japanese finally attacked the US); and I know that had Hitler not broken his treaty with Stalin and attacked Russia he probably would have finished off the allies before the US could get a footing in Europe and if he had and attacked Russia AFTER he secured victory in the west he probably would have beaten Russia but splitting his forces pretty much cost him both fronts. So, yes, I'm well, well aware of the roles various countries played in the winning of World War II but I also know that without US reinforcements and industrial power (which was the single biggest factor), that war may very well have gone the other way.

BeardedDued - On the 40th anniversary of the JFK assassination there was an episode of "History's Mysteries" that tackled many of the legends on the shooting and was able to disprove most of them. They even recreated the "shot" and shot down the entire "magic bullet" theory. If you can find it anyway, I highly recommend watching it. I can't swear they are really right in their assessment (because I have on idea if any of what they show is staged or not) but they make a very, very convincing case proving that Oswald most likely acted alone.

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
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26-04-2011, 02:08 PM
RE: Control.
(26-04-2011 01:24 PM)BnW Wrote:  riggbeck - first, my response was somewhat sarcastic. And, as for history, I'm very well familiar with history in general and WWII in particular. For example, I happen to know that, President Roosevelt arguably violated several US laws of the era when he supplied the French and English with planes, ships and munitions with which to fight Hitler and without those armaments the British may not have been able to hang on; I know that contrary to popular belief that the attack on Pearl Harbor was the US' first military engagement with Japan in WWII we actually had been supplying the Chinese with arms, planes and even pilots and helping them out in southern China and as far as Burma to help them defend themselves against the Japanese while cutting off Japans supply of oil (which was the primary reason the Japanese finally attacked the US); and I know that had Hitler not broken his treaty with Stalin and attacked Russia he probably would have finished off the allies before the US could get a footing in Europe and if he had and attacked Russia AFTER he secured victory in the west he probably would have beaten Russia but splitting his forces pretty much cost him both fronts. So, yes, I'm well, well aware of the roles various countries played in the winning of World War II but I also know that without US reinforcements and industrial power (which was the single biggest factor), that war may very well have gone the other way.

BeardedDued - On the 40th anniversary of the JFK assassination there was an episode of "History's Mysteries" that tackled many of the legends on the shooting and was able to disprove most of them. They even recreated the "shot" and shot down the entire "magic bullet" theory. If you can find it anyway, I highly recommend watching it. I can't swear they are really right in their assessment (because I have on idea if any of what they show is staged or not) but they make a very, very convincing case proving that Oswald most likely acted alone.

I think I saw that. I was using that example because at one point in time I may have been more susceptible to buying into the conspiracy of "the grassy knoll." Mainly because these documentaries and movies use music and dialogue that invokes the audience to respond emotionally was the reason for choosing it as an example. There are intriguing circumstances surrounding his assassination that we may never resolve, since Lee Harvey was killed, but I cannot imagine that such a complicated conspiracy involving so many people would remain such a well kept secret for so long.

Evolve
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