Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
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05-10-2013, 04:12 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
There's just as many illogical non-theists. People who may have once been theistic, or never at all, that believe in equally ludicrous and/or dangerous beliefs.

Many people believe in things not for "logical" reasons. There are many reasons/causes for people to believe in certain things despite reason and evidence.
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05-10-2013, 04:57 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
(05-10-2013 02:44 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  Well I get that. But what I mean is, how do you leave a religion because you see the illogical bullshit in it, but can't see in in you're new one?

She dumped a religion not god.
The fact that one feels a need for a belief at all is very telling; it's a security issue. Change itself is a fearful, vulnerable situation. Just coming off the shock of one revelation that sent your head spinning, you're gonna look for comfort food to sooth your bruised brain. Another religion is another brand of mac & cheese - probably just as shitty for you but it's familiar, non-threatening, and tastes great. And it's acceptable - no one is gonna give you shit about it even if causes you a coronary.

(05-10-2013 02:44 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  But if one leaves based on simple logic like the "Jesus" "God" duality thing, then how could you possibly not see it everywhere else?

That's not even the difficult logic stuff. That's the surface level illogical stuff that is inherent in all religions without diving far in at all.

People are complex. It's difficult look to one's self to answer tough questions if one is unfamiliar with logic and/or reason. Religion is not complex - it's easy. You give everything to god - you don't have to do anything... just believe.

The woman you spoke of will need to learn more to see farther. Her logic and reason have taken her just so far but, she is still quite unable to see herself without a religion of some kind. She might see one religion as illogical but not the belief prospect which is what holds any religion together. It will take more experiences like that to get her to put her beliefs at arm's length and apply the same logic to god.

Religion is an organization, god is a belief.

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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05-10-2013, 05:51 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
I can understand this. I was a christian for almost 2 decades, so I needed to go through a period of testing the other religions of Abraham and then other religions of other gods before i finally realized that no gods appear to exist. Not sure if it was fear or just a desire to believe, but in the end, nothing held up.
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05-10-2013, 06:52 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
(05-10-2013 05:51 PM)Airyaman Wrote:  I can understand this. I was a christian for almost 2 decades, so I needed to go through a period of testing the other religions of Abraham and then other religions of other gods before i finally realized that no gods appear to exist. Not sure if it was fear or just a desire to believe, but in the end, nothing held up.

I can totally see exploring other religions to see if there's something out there that fits after leaving another. I guess I was just so sure of christianity that once my faith in it dissolved, I didn't figure anything else was going to really click. I went through a very short exploration of the "spiritual but not religious" schtick. But I soon realized that it was a hodge-podge of all sorts of woo woo and ridiculous vagueness and put me off pretty quickly. It didn't take long for reality to appeal to me and although I'm not sure if there is no god, I'm pretty sure there's no god out there clamoring for our attention or intent on reward/punishment. So if that's the case, what's the point? I choose to live my life as I see fit.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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05-10-2013, 07:11 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
(05-10-2013 05:51 PM)Airyaman Wrote:  I can understand this. I was a christian for almost 2 decades, so I needed to go through a period of testing the other religions of Abraham and then other religions of other gods before i finally realized that no gods appear to exist. Not sure if it was fear or just a desire to believe, but in the end, nothing held up.

This...I totally get this.

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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05-10-2013, 08:08 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
(05-10-2013 04:12 PM)PoolBoyG Wrote:  There's just as many illogical non-theists. People who may have once been theistic, or never at all, that believe in equally ludicrous and/or dangerous beliefs.

Many people believe in things not for "logical" reasons. There are many reasons/causes for people to believe in certain things despite reason and evidence.

Since theists outnumber atheists, you're statement can't possibly be true.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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05-10-2013, 08:36 PM
RE: Converting from one religion because it makes no sense, just to go to a new BS one?
(05-10-2013 08:08 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(05-10-2013 04:12 PM)PoolBoyG Wrote:  There's just as many illogical non-theists. People who may have once been theistic, or never at all, that believe in equally ludicrous and/or dangerous beliefs.

Many people believe in things not for "logical" reasons. There are many reasons/causes for people to believe in certain things despite reason and evidence.

Since theists outnumber atheists, you're statement can't possibly be true.

Don't think poolboy was speaking about religion specifically, just "beliefs". Everyone holds beliefs of some sort, some more logical than others.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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05-10-2013, 09:58 PM
RE: Converting from one religion...
(05-10-2013 02:13 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  I would love if it were as easy as simply pointing out to someone the "how could Jesus be "God" if he's talking to "God" thing and that's all it took. If so, we'd have this nonsense cleaned up in a day. But if someone is that logical, that that's all the reasoning it would take, how do they then jump to an equally illogical religion?

I think you are correct and that is an astute observation that would have escaped many. I don't think the question--which alludes to an apparent contradiction in the docrine of the Trinity--really had much to do with her conversion. The falsity of Christianity does not entail the truthfulness of Islam. If she was genuinely persuaded by the (apparent) contradiction then she would have just rejected Christianity and then subjected Islam to a search for contradiction and inconsistency.

I would propose that Christianity was not fulfilling some emotional need which found fulfillment in Islam. The issue of the Trinity is just an ex post facto justification which lends her narrative a seriousness which an appeal to emtional need would lack.
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