Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
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05-11-2017, 02:02 PM (This post was last modified: 05-11-2017 02:37 PM by JesseB.)
Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
I actually want the theists in the room to read this, so this post is going to work avoid insults and will be absent bad language (aka it's safe for you Christians to read! YAY)

There's some interesting cultural differences between t/heists and non theists, theists (particularly Christian theists- Thanks Aliza for pointing out the error here) think that some words are sinful to use. They think this despite their holy book never mentioning such a concept.

The Bible says... (cough) something about if you call your brother a fool you're in danger of the fires of hell (paraphrasing)

The Bible says.... to keep your speech pure, however the only examples of this are conceptual, and by that I mean the bible says that calling someone stupid, belittling them, making fun of them, ect are sinful and bad. This is a concept I could actually get behind despite my normal liberal use of insults (more on that later)

Christians on the other hand consistently demonstrate poor reading comprehension ability and run off making a list of "bad words" that must never be used or you'll go to hell....

Bible says don't be mean
Christians say be as mean as you want just avoid the dreaded "bad words".... Why do I get the feeling once again they missed the point?

And of course the non theist has no particular reason to be mean or not to be mean aside from the need to co exist within their environment (and as such the decision is left up to the individual and/or the group not some holy book or more accurately the churches leaders)

..... yea it makes literally that much sense..... My uncle who's a pastor agrees with me on this but his response was "Americans arne't really ready to know what the bible says" Not joking.... He's also not the only pastor I've known who's said that exact same thing.

This situation creates some problems
1. Christians often will avoid ever encountering the dreaded "bad words"
2. Christians will admonish and diminish anything said by a person who has ever been heard using a dreaded "bad word" (unless of course said person claims to be a Christian then the standard shifts to how "good" of a Christian said person appears to be)
3. Speech isn't just limited by the bad word principle. Speech limitations end up extending for many reasons to any/all thoughts and ideas and anything Christians deem too sacred to discuss.

This police state creates situations similar to the one I live in where in my real life I doubt I've ever said even one honest word with family and most of the people I'm around (my real friends number maybe 5 ish? and they I am overly honest with). It's not just that I would be treated as a social pariah if I ever shared what I think about ANYTHING with the people around me, it's that I literally have threats on my life even today.

See I can't simply see a difference between a Christian and a member of ISIS, I'm fully aware that not all Christians will indiscriminately kill, just like not all Muslims will. The problem however is that similar to the Sentinels in the Matrix movies every theist is "plugged into" the Matrix and can be taken over by the Sentinels and turned into murder machines. People say Christians don't blow up buildings, but wait who blows up planned parenthood buildings? Exactly....


That's not to say I am proposing that all religious folks would act in these ways, that's not the problem or the point, the problem is all of them carry with them the same risk factors which can be clearly defined and identified. AND this isn't limited to Christians, Muslims or theists in general. It applies to any Ideology that is strongly held. Subscribing to Ideologies is in itself fundamentally flawed as it tends to subservient humans to an idea and that can bring about ISIS, The Crusades, and even Stalin and Hitler. They all share common threads common factors which helped nurture the bloodshed and as long as people don't critically analyze their "belief" structures and Ideologies you simply can't trust that anyone won't become this way. However Christians are more um.... close to home for me as there's about 300 Christians with guns some of whom have threatened my life within the past 3 years, and most of whom say terrifying things that hint that they aren't safe to be around.

And yet when you try to talk to any Christian about this you get the "no true Christian fallacy" (It's like the no true Scotsmen fallacy except out of the tens of thousands of Christan denominations the true Christian is always the specificity 1 type you happen to be talking to at that moment, and their views never even line up with their own denomination which is an entirely different mess which Christians are incapable of addressing)

"No Christian I know would want to kill anyone.....(break).......Muslims are inherently evil because their religion is founded on Satan so we have to kill them all" (yes I heard within the last week someone make this exact argument)

These are all cultural differences which foster an environment which is similar to living inside of a prison for me, where at any given moment I'm terrified of ever opening my mouth in front of people. So I lie. And I lie. AND I LIE. And even then people figure things out, I'm never safe, the only way I could truly MAYBE be sorta safe would be if I never spoke to another human at all, and even then they might kill me for being "deaf and dumb" as horrible as it sounds, it happens. Abuse of people who can't hear and don't speak happen even today in America (My mom is deaf and I'm slowly going deaf myself so I see quite a bit of that world too)

And yet when I come here I'm expected to carry that prison with me? No. It's not up to me to follow your Christian rules in a non Christian space. If you come here you should expect to see things that offend your delicate flower sensitives after all theists have no problem abusing and oppressing and offending everyone else. They have no problem murdering or bombing people either, or invading their countries or committing genocide. Oh you might say your against it, but I'm sure if I talked to you long enough you'd find some justification for looking away. After all the Christian god authorized the rape and massacre of children more than once in the bible. Gonna call that out as a bad thing your god did? So yea I get annoyed when Christians act like someone saying a "bad word" here is a big deal, if you don't want to encounter it then don't come here ya? there's no rule here saying people can't use bad words. And I don't think anyone should encourage that kind of policing behavior.

Now I fully get that for meaningful communication to happen you can't run off those you wish to communicate with, however. I've seen enough bloodshed, I've lived in silence long enough. I'm simply not going to accept that I"m not allowed to have a space where I can speak freely.


These are just my thoughts.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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05-11-2017, 02:12 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
At work.

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05-11-2017, 02:20 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
Fuck didn't even exist as a word until the 16th century. So why do people get upset about something that's not even mentioned in the bible? Laugh out load

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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05-11-2017, 02:21 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
(05-11-2017 02:02 PM)JesseB Wrote:  I actually want the theists in the room to read this, so this post is going to work avoid insults and will be absent bad language (aka it's safe for you Christians to read! YAY)

Okay, I'm going to read your post, but you do realize that theist is not synonymous with Christian, right?

And I hope you also realize that when theists express their unfiltered views, there will invariably be one or more posters who can't avoid insults and bad language due to deep internal flaws within their psyche.

Okay, with that said, I'm reading.... right... now!
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05-11-2017, 02:29 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
(05-11-2017 02:21 PM)Aliza Wrote:  
(05-11-2017 02:02 PM)JesseB Wrote:  I actually want the theists in the room to read this, so this post is going to work avoid insults and will be absent bad language (aka it's safe for you Christians to read! YAY)

Okay, I'm going to read your post, but you do realize that theist is not synonymous with Christian, right?

And I hope you also realize that when theists express their unfiltered views, there will invariably be one or more posters who can't avoid insults and bad language due to deep internal flaws within their psyche.

Okay, with that said, I'm reading.... right... now!

Fully understand that Theism and Christianity are not synonymous. I address both in my post and try to define when I'm speaking about one vs the other. I also address that Christians are my main concern largely because of the preponderance of Christians with guns in my immediate vicinity.

Thank you for reading Smile

as for deep internal flaws on one's psyche, I think I'm reasonably well put together as a person for being a debauched evil freak of nature Smile

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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05-11-2017, 02:33 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
(05-11-2017 02:20 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Fuck didn't even exist as a word until the 16th century. So why do people get upset about something that's not even mentioned in the bible? Laugh out load

That's just it. What Christians like to define as bad words were a 16th century form of class warfare that was misappropriated by the Catholic Church.

It started out that only "peasants" used such foul language (as a way of saying that nobility are better than everyone else)

and became only dirty uncivilized people use such foul language (so that Christians could claim to be better than anyone)

And the biblical tie simply does not exist. AT ALL. They try and twist about 2-3 verses that say something completely different to justify the random rule they made up like a thousand years after their religion was founded.

It's bullshit for US to let them enforce this asinine holier than though standard on us.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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05-11-2017, 02:50 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
I was always taught" Thou shalt not take the Lord's name in vain". Yet all these Christians run around yelling: OMG, OMG, OMG! The old nuns would break their rulers hitting so many fingers.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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05-11-2017, 02:57 PM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
(05-11-2017 02:50 PM)Dom Wrote:  I was always taught" Thou shalt not take the Lord's name in vain". Yet all these Christians run around yelling: OMG, OMG, OMG! The old nuns would break their rulers hitting so many fingers.

I have never once used a "bad word" in front of my mother, won't even use shit in front of her or the "lesser bad words" I won't mention anything even mildly crass in front of her.

Forget rulers my dad has guns, knives, and baseball bats. Tell you what when we were out in public everyone told my parents they had the best behaved kids (because the bruises under our clothes reminded us how bad it would be if we misbehaved)

Gotta love what Cristian think is acceptable behavior.... This is why I look at their rules of civility as superficial. And one of many reasons why I reject those rules.

Meanwhile my Christian neighbors leave an old lady to die of exposure up here on this mountain cause she's clearly a bit crazy and I go out of my way to get her fucking help because I don't want people dying up here. But I'm an uncivilized monster ya? Or so most of the theists here seem to insinuate

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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06-11-2017, 12:36 AM (This post was last modified: 06-11-2017 12:44 AM by epronovost.)
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
(05-11-2017 02:50 PM)Dom Wrote:  I was always taught" Thou shalt not take the Lord's name in vain". Yet all these Christians run around yelling: OMG, OMG, OMG! The old nuns would break their rulers hitting so many fingers.

I have heard from historian Winwood Reade that the rule against "taking the name of the Lord in vain" doesn't really refer to cussing or using a vulgar language but to a practice common in the justice system of the time which was of swearring a oath of honesty before presenting a requisitory before the court. One was to usually swear on his king or his elders as a sign these would back his word and honesty and chastise him should he be found lying. That's what "taking a name" is supposed to mean. It would have been "wrong" to swear upon God since it would place the Lord in the position of chastising you should you lie and, more importantly, it shows a great arrogance to claim to have the Lord support. Gods cannot be ordered by mortals; thus calling upon him to back you up or chastise is attempting to control the action of God or at least making a claim to his thoughts and knowledge. That isn't something a simple man can do, only prophets can. Ironically, under such a theory, the practice of swearring on the Bible or God, a still common pratice, would actually be a grave sin. That commandment would go in hand with the prosription in making false testimony. What it would basically mean is that you cannot lie during a trial, bear false accusation and you can't call people to back your words unless they are willing to and ready to face the concequences. I find that interpretation very interesting if only because it makes a common religious practice a pretty big "sin".

PS: one should also remember that this rule came about in time when people believed in the magical power and propriety of words (AKA words of power) and that names could be used to make powerful spells. In some version of the myth, Lilith escaped the Garden of Eden after her falling out with Adam and escaped God's punishment by casting a spell that granted her wings and threaten to use God's true name to cast a curse against him.

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06-11-2017, 11:56 AM
RE: Cultural Conflict Between Theism and Atheism
That must have taken a long time to write.
Personally I'd suggest there are better uses.
Like licking the carpet.
IMO that would have as much effect on the world.

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