Dear Islam(the religion)
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22-09-2012, 02:07 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 02:04 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 01:49 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  All stereotypes are disgusting.
See the irony there?

I know it's unlike me to be pedantic but

(... that's irony!)

You were generalising. Stereotyping is a form of generalisation but not all generalisations are form of stereotyping.

Pat Condell, as it happens, does both.

And the general population of Muslims do all that he says. It is almost as if you three, DLJ, Starcrash, and this depat guy know nothing of Shariah Law or the tenets of Islam.

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22-09-2012, 02:08 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 01:51 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 12:12 AM)depat Wrote:  Using stereotypes to get a point accross that a group of people are nasty, stupid, mean, and a waste of breth is irrational. The argument is as unsound as the statement, "and they will have to like it," so there!

(22-09-2012 01:31 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Loud-mouthed, out-spoken, hot-tempered, reactionary, competitive, forthright, recalcitrant and hubristic.


Earmuffs is correct in this sense. Any country with an Islamic country over 50% experience Islamic violence every year. Islamic-produced violence.

That was the point of my post on the first page of this thread.

Don't you think the second vid (in my post) makes your exact point whereas Pat's vid is only going to engender criticism for stereotyping / generalising?

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22-09-2012, 02:14 AM (This post was last modified: 22-09-2012 02:17 AM by Logica Humano.)
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 02:08 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 01:51 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  Earmuffs is correct in this sense. Any country with an Islamic country over 50% experience Islamic violence every year. Islamic-produced violence.

That was the point of my post on the first page of this thread.

Don't you think the second vid (in my post) makes your exact point whereas Pat's vid is only going to engender criticism for stereotyping / generalising?

I think the Pat Condel's video was a logical retaliation to this:









I think your video is a good response to Muslims who do not participate in it, aka, the minority.

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22-09-2012, 02:16 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 02:07 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 02:04 AM)DLJ Wrote:  I know it's unlike me to be pedantic but

(... that's irony!)

You were generalising. Stereotyping is a form of generalisation but not all generalisations are form of stereotyping.

Pat Condell, as it happens, does both.

And the general population of Muslims do all that he says. It is almost as if you three, DLJ, Starcrash, and this depat guy know nothing of Shariah Law or the tenets of Islam.

Look who is generalising now.

Don't forget, please, that I live and work in largely and very peaceful Muslim dominated societies. I debate the nonsense of the Quran almost every day with my muslim colleagues.

Dammit! I hate to sound like Ghost but the fanatics are a part of all societies (football supporters to christians to Trekkies). Highlighting their activities is a way of shaming the moderates into action... see very recent events in Libya as an example... but there is also the polarising factor.

That's all we're saying.

EDIT (after seeing you last post): I don't think Pat Condell's vid was the reason why the sane part of Libyan society took to the streets to root out the extremists.

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22-09-2012, 02:22 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 02:16 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 02:07 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  And the general population of Muslims do all that he says. It is almost as if you three, DLJ, Starcrash, and this depat guy know nothing of Shariah Law or the tenets of Islam.

Look who is generalising now.

Don't forget, please, that I live and work in largely and very peaceful Muslim dominated societies. I debate the nonsense of the Quran almost every day with my muslim colleagues.

Dammit! I hate to sound like Ghost but the fanatics are a part of all societies (football supporters to christians to Trekkies). Highlighting their activities is a way of shaming the moderates into action... see very recent events in Libya as an example... but there is also the polarising factor.

That's all we're saying.

EDIT (after seeing you last post): I don't think Pat Condell's vid was the reason why the sane part of Libyan society took to the streets to root out the extremists.

Now fly over to Indonesia, Lebanon, Pakistan, Nigeria, Iraq, Yemen, Syria, Iran, Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and any other Islamic countries and try your debates over there.

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22-09-2012, 02:37 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 02:22 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 02:16 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Look who is generalising now.

Don't forget, please, that I live and work in largely and very peaceful Muslim dominated societies. I debate the nonsense of the Quran almost every day with my muslim colleagues.

Dammit! I hate to sound like Ghost but the fanatics are a part of all societies (football supporters to christians to Trekkies). Highlighting their activities is a way of shaming the moderates into action... see very recent events in Libya as an example... but there is also the polarising factor.

That's all we're saying.

EDIT (after seeing you last post): I don't think Pat Condell's vid was the reason why the sane part of Libyan society took to the streets to root out the extremists.

Now fly over to Indonesia, Lebanon, Pakistan, Nigeria, Iraq, Yemen, Syria, Iran, Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and any other Islamic countries and try your debates over there.

Indonesia is one the countries where I do indeed have very civil discussions with normal human beings about this very subject.

I think you are not sensing the Zeitgeist.

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22-09-2012, 04:00 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 02:37 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 02:22 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  Now fly over to Indonesia, Lebanon, Pakistan, Nigeria, Iraq, Yemen, Syria, Iran, Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and any other Islamic countries and try your debates over there.

Indonesia is one the countries where I do indeed have very civil discussions with normal human beings about this very subject.

I think you are not sensing the Zeitgeist.

Less than 15% of Singapore's population is Muslim. I would hardly call that an Islamic state. Again, go to a country where Islam is the primary religion.

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22-09-2012, 07:05 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
I deliberately did not mention Singapore, for that reason. Religion here is about tradition not worship and is respected (by law) as such.
Meh!

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22-09-2012, 08:19 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
(22-09-2012 04:00 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 02:37 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Indonesia is one the countries where I do indeed have very civil discussions with normal human beings about this very subject.

I think you are not sensing the Zeitgeist.

Less than 15% of Singapore's population is Muslim. I would hardly call that an Islamic state. Again, go to a country where Islam is the primary religion.

Indonesia and Singapore are different countries bro.

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22-09-2012, 08:57 AM
RE: Dear Islam(the religion)
Maybe I was kinda slow to understand the point, but the bomb on Muhammad's turban in Denmark newspaper probably wasn't a suicide bomber parody, but a symbol of the hidden Muslim revolution being prepared in Denmark and rest of Europe.

So how does mocking Islam work? Does it shame moderates into action? Which is bad, in short term at least. But what if it's worth it? When making fun of Muslims, we must be careful to make fun of fundies, extremists and batwomen.

Which would hopefully polarize them, Muslim moderates from extremists. Making it harder for Muslims to infiltrate other countries unnoticed, when they're screaming, rioting and killing people over a few cartoons or a short crappy film. That would be good in long term. It would also give moderate Muslims a way to learn to be private about religion, the same subconscious caution that European Christians have about not saying in public that they believe in a talking snake and man walking on water. I hope it will not harm the moderates but show them that they too need a breathing space from the fundies in control.
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