Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
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06-08-2012, 01:46 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
Looking for more rep, is all... Dodgy

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06-08-2012, 01:50 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(06-08-2012 01:46 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  Looking for more rep, is all... Dodgy

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06-08-2012, 01:51 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
Worship Slaves

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06-08-2012, 01:52 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(06-08-2012 01:50 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(06-08-2012 01:46 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  Looking for more rep, is all... Dodgy

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Lol. That'll keep Johhny happy for a while Big Grin
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06-08-2012, 01:55 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(06-08-2012 01:52 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(06-08-2012 01:50 PM)Vosur Wrote:  [Image: hyEJT.jpg?4922]

Lol. That'll keep Johhny happy for a while Big Grin

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06-08-2012, 02:57 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(26-01-2012 08:39 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  I go to a traditional Southern Baptist church (Arminian-YEC-dispensationalist). Over the past couple of years, it has come to the attention of some of my peers that I do not subscribe to their deep traditionally rooted beliefs. Naturally, people become curious and begin to ask me questions. By now, I’m sure you understand my inability to shy away or sugarcoat answers; so, I answer them. The response to my answering is typical (they get really, really angry), and it turns into them getting mad at me and telling me I’m wrong and not to talk to them again.

Ok lets go through the story point by point and see what actually happened. With out bias. Not trying to make you look like the bad guy, but try to point out your role in what happened.

Quote:It happened again earlier this week. This is the third or fourth time this has happened at this church. Now, keep in mind, I was APPROACHED; I was ASKED. I don’t go throwing my theological beliefs around a Southern Baptist church arbitrarily because I know the dissension it can cause.

Here unknowingly you committed self serving bias, by trying to make your self the receiver of the negative emotions, not the giver. It's like making your self the victim and the other person the attacker.

Quote:A member asked me about election. I showed this member what the Bible said. This person got mad at me for showing them scripture. The person said that I’m wrong because this person doesn’t believe that God would do that. I told this person it doesn’t matter what you believe because scripture says what it says. The person then asserted that we should do mediation with the pastor. I refused. I told this person that mediation is not needed since mediation is only commanded in the Bible when you have an issue with another member.

Here the person asserts that you are wrong. At which point you state that they are wrong. They probably feel condescended to hearing the scripture parts.

Quote:I then told this person that it wasn’t me that was the problem; it was a system of belief and that this person should seek council from the pastor about this system of belief. I also told this person that the pastor believes as you believe and that you are only looking for validation for your belief and dissolution for mine. The person called me closed-minded and told me to never speak to them again

Then you reassert that they are wrong. You assert that they are trying to get you not to believe something, they are instead trying to get people to believe the way he does. Then you say the preacher also thinks they way you do, when the other person thinks the opposite.

It's pretty apparent that you said the pastor and you are on the same side and this guy isn't. Probably hurting their feelings. They probably didn't think they were trying to persuade you, they probably felt condescended to, and teamed up against.

A much better approach would've been to say this is how you see it, and that works for you. You could also say that you think the preacher seems to follows the same ideas.

This way you leave the person feeling more open to explain their side, and their case, with out the alienation, or the feelings of being condescended to.

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06-08-2012, 03:42 PM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(06-08-2012 02:57 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  Here unknowingly you committed self serving bias, by trying to make your self the receiver of the negative emotions, not the giver. It's like making your self the victim and the other person the attacker.

So, if someone comes up to you and asks you about your atheism and then says you're wrong and gets mad at what you told them, then you are the attacker? Seriously?

Quote:Here the person asserts that you are wrong. At which point you state that they are wrong. They probably feel condescended to hearing the scripture parts.

So... how am I wrong here? I just showed scripture. Someone surely doesn't have the right to get mad if you show them contradictory scientific evidence that disproves their own scientific hypothesis.

Quote:Then you reassert that they are wrong. You assert that they are trying to get you not to believe something, they are instead trying to get people to believe the way he does. Then you say the preacher also thinks they way you do, when the other person thinks the opposite.

It's pretty apparent that you said the pastor and you are on the same side and this guy isn't. Probably hurting their feelings. They probably didn't think they were trying to persuade you, they probably felt condescended to, and teamed up against.

A much better approach would've been to say this is how you see it, and that works for you. You could also say that you think the preacher seems to follows the same ideas.

Actually... reread. I said that the pastor agrees with them; not me. So, now your whole point is moot.

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06-08-2012, 08:35 PM (This post was last modified: 06-08-2012 10:00 PM by fstratzero.)
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(06-08-2012 03:42 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(06-08-2012 02:57 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  Here unknowingly you committed self serving bias, by trying to make your self the receiver of the negative emotions, not the giver. It's like making your self the victim and the other person the attacker.

So, if someone comes up to you and asks you about your atheism and then says you're wrong and gets mad at what you told them, then you are the attacker? Seriously?

Quote:Here the person asserts that you are wrong. At which point you state that they are wrong. They probably feel condescended to hearing the scripture parts.

So... how am I wrong here? I just showed scripture. Someone surely doesn't have the right to get mad if you show them contradictory scientific evidence that disproves their own scientific hypothesis.

Quote:Then you reassert that they are wrong. You assert that they are trying to get you not to believe something, they are instead trying to get people to believe the way he does. Then you say the preacher also thinks they way you do, when the other person thinks the opposite.

It's pretty apparent that you said the pastor and you are on the same side and this guy isn't. Probably hurting their feelings. They probably didn't think they were trying to persuade you, they probably felt condescended to, and teamed up against.

A much better approach would've been to say this is how you see it, and that works for you. You could also say that you think the preacher seems to follows the same ideas.

Actually... reread. I said that the pastor agrees with them; not me. So, now your whole point is moot.

At any rate the idea is simply to point out that when you get a response like that you should see if you had a role to play in it. With out bias, and with out eyes clouded by emotions.

By choosing a better way to respond one can avoid confrontations like this.

At least that's my stance on this.

NOTE: I was wrong on the preacher part.

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07-08-2012, 12:30 AM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(06-08-2012 08:35 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  By choosing a better way to respond one can avoid confrontations like this.

... OTOH sometimes people just spark off each other the wrong way. I don't see that if the other guy has no interest in kissing and making nice KC has any obligation to either.
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07-08-2012, 11:01 AM
RE: Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(07-08-2012 12:30 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(06-08-2012 08:35 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  By choosing a better way to respond one can avoid confrontations like this.

... OTOH sometimes people just spark off each other the wrong way. I don't see that if the other guy has no interest in kissing and making nice KC has any obligation to either.

I will say I was far too analytical, but pushing the idea that by rephrasing things he'd have a more constructive conversation.

Although I have to admit I think arguing over the imaginary nature of religion to me is silly.

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