Dear you immoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
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27-01-2012, 10:29 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
I don't hate God, because he doesn't exit.
However, if he did exist I would hate him.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
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28-01-2012, 12:12 AM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
I find this kinda weird. Many Christians I have met have been uncomfortable around me but... I've asked them before, is it wrong to question? And the answer is NO, but it's wrong to come to any other answer than the right one Tongue But never once was there a suggestion that someone who disagrees on theology is not entitled to exactly the same treatment as any other member of the church.

Love to know how the mediation's gonna work? Are you both gonna bring your Bibles and quote verses at each other or are you gonna shake hands and say "fuck it" and forget about it? My guess is that you guys don't wanna say fuck Angel
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28-01-2012, 12:40 AM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
Nah nah moron here's how it's gonna go. King won't mind saying fuck and he'll pressure the other guy because he won't =p

It's most likely going to be the preacher deciding the answer for them and then trying to mete out why he decided it. That's how most church mediations end up going. Biblical contradictions run rampant so it's common that the preacher just makes the sheep listen, and hey if one member of the mediation isn't such a sheep he'll just find a compromise that one will live with cause the other one will go right along.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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28-01-2012, 06:01 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(27-01-2012 12:32 PM)kineo Wrote:  
(27-01-2012 12:22 PM)Godless Wrote:  I guess I'm the only one here who honestly thinks KC is nuts. That's why i don't have much dialog with him.

You're wrong on that count, he's nuts but I was at one time also. Your refusal to have dialogue with him is your own.

Nuts or not, he's the most logical of Christians I've come across in a long time. When you follow through on the idea of an all-knowing, all-powerful, omnipresent god you will eventually come to the conclusion that everything must be known and determined ahead of time. In conjunction with scripture then it becomes pretty hard to argue against. Christians just don't like the idea because it's non-traditional. I'm curious how this mediation will turn out.

My guess is that you will be expected to ether keep your mouth shut about your beliefs, or be presented with the ultimatum of stepping in line with their beliefs with the threat of being asked not to come back otherwise. Is it possible that they just don't care? Sure, but it seems unlikely to me. The pastor has to protect his flock, even if reason is the enemy.

First I said I didn't have much dialog not that I refuse to do so.

I just think he's barking nuts when it comes to religion. KC comes across a LOT like I did 5 years ago when I was still drinking the cool-aid.

From the small amount of discussion I've had he believes in a lack of free will and a literal hell and understands logically what that implies.

As a Christian my answer to that had a lot of theological back bending behind it and hinged on the idea of personal accountability over God's accountability. I have not pushed KC on a full explanation because I highly suspect based on his answers to other questions that a fair amount of biblical theology would be a core aspect of his answer. Seeing as how one of the first steps I took coming out of my faith was to examine why I thought the bible to be a good authority and ultimately a rejection of the bible as a sole authority I don't suspect his answer would get the discussion anywhere.

I also have not the time nor the effort to sit down and ask KC to define "God" "supernatural" or any of the million terms I would have to for us to have a fair discussion.

I would do these things if I suspected that KC didn't understand and respect the idea of separation of church and state or started telling people he though they were going to hell. Instead he's proven to be far more highly respective and accepting of Atheists then most Christians.

I just think he's crazy when talking about religion. I also think it's a waste of time to engage in a large theological debate with someone who for the most part is on our side in terms of freedoms of religion, speech and assembly.

If KC wanted me to go into greater detail as to what I meant when I said to read the bible he would have asked. Just thought I should clarify before I get accused of being unwilling to discuss. Tongue
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28-01-2012, 09:44 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
Nearly anyone gets upset when confronted - theist and atheist alike - and especially when told that a belief they hold may be wrong. Back when I was a Christian, I was married for a very short time. My wife accused me of assaulting her and filed for divorce. Our pastor lectured me (without evidence - I didn't assault her) and told me that he had backed her on this. I showed him the new testament passages that condemn divorce, and he said they didn't matter.

I confronted him in front of a fellow member of the church, and he still wouldn't back down from his position. I then threatened to bring it up publicly in church (an atheist reading this may find it irrational, but this is all prescribed by the bible). That's when the pastor told me never to darken the doorstep of his church again. And I didn't.

Why would any Christian get upset when, in an argument, you support your position with scripture? I seriously don't know. I was never like that, but even as a Christian I was open-minded and hard to offend. It sucks that your brethren didn't support you, KC, but I'm glad you can find support here.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
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28-01-2012, 11:46 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
I may not agree with your views or beliefs but I hope it all works out for you.
I don’t know how it all works, is it like changing doctors? Cause that can be an issue too…

Good luck.

A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything. Friedrich Nietzsche
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09-02-2012, 05:07 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
Update:

The pastor has agreed to meet with us (as I said), but he's never gotten back with us. I'm thinking he's wise enough to let it die.

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09-02-2012, 05:34 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(09-02-2012 05:07 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Update:

The pastor has agreed to meet with us (as I said), but he's never gotten back with us. I'm thinking he's wise enough to let it die.

Wise?
Afraid is probably a more accurate word. Dodgy

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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09-02-2012, 05:36 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
(09-02-2012 05:34 PM)kim Wrote:  
(09-02-2012 05:07 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Update:

The pastor has agreed to meet with us (as I said), but he's never gotten back with us. I'm thinking he's wise enough to let it die.

Wise?
Afraid is probably a more accurate word. Dodgy

That too. It makes no sense to even do this.

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09-02-2012, 07:21 PM
RE: Dear you amoral heathens, sinners, hellbound god-haters
A wise pastor, KC and god having a "discussion"? It's like three blind mice.
What is there to discuss if it's all planned out anyway right?
You know if you "donate" he might be a little more helpful.

Oh the fun it would have been to be a fly in the delusion zone.

It's all in your head, because there is no other place it could be.
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