Death and beyond
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12-05-2012, 10:31 AM
RE: Death and beyond
Oh, like I said, death is nothing to be afraid of. It's a natural recycling of matter is all.

If you consider suicide all the time (and I have considered it from time to time and will choose it should my life end up where it's not worth living anymore) then there is something wrong with what you are doing with your life.

If life is not worth living, change it. Change your habits or your beliefs or your location or whatever. Change is a catalyst for energy, and energy is a catalyst for making the best of life. Just saying.

Re fluff - no it's not fluff. Recycling is what nature does, and we are part of nature. Denying that it is possible that "that which powers us" gets recycled is just maintaining the status quo. And in this case, it is supporting religion since as long as the gap is there, gods will fill it. It needs to be explored and settled, one way or another, once and for all.

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Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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12-05-2012, 01:01 PM
RE: Death and beyond
Fluff, fluff, fluff... Big Grin

Life is like the whitecaps breathed upon the ocean by the restless wind and the yearning of Luna. It is chaos and complexity, desire and need. Yet the wind will tire and the sun shall rise, and all shall become still once more.

It's that dang Gwynnies. I ain't never gonna love nuttin like I love her. Heart

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12-05-2012, 04:32 PM (This post was last modified: 12-05-2012 04:59 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Death and beyond
(12-05-2012 07:05 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  But I cannot help but consider this stuff to be egotistical self-absorption. One of the reasons for my returning to the east was to hang with my family to see if I had gone too far in the other direction, but I feel even more suicidal and ready to end.

Me too, Brother, but it's cyclical and like every other feeling, it passes.

(12-05-2012 07:05 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  I expected that connections would ground me yet they only seem to bring me down. Everybody's like, gotta have this, gotta do that, and money, money, money...

Your expectations were unrealistic.

(12-05-2012 07:05 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  Of course my big problem is that I'm just too fucking in love with that dang Gwyneth. Big Grin

That ain't your problem, Brother, hell that's what's anchoring your belay line. Wink

(12-05-2012 10:31 AM)Dom Wrote:  Oh, like I said, death is nothing to be afraid of. It's a natural recycling of matter is all.

If you consider suicide all the time (and I have considered it from time to time and will choose it should my life end up where it's not worth living anymore) then there is something wrong with what you are doing with your life.

Not all the time, Dom. ... just as necessary, on an as needed basis. Wink

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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12-05-2012, 06:18 PM
RE: Death and beyond
I wuz trollin' with the fluff stuff. Blush

Neil deGrasse in the back of the mind going, unknown means stop talkin...


The problem with the Gwynnies, she's my one certainty (the other one wanting to be 100% dead); there ain't nothing left to do in this life alone.

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12-05-2012, 06:23 PM
RE: Death and beyond
(12-05-2012 06:18 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  I wuz trollin' with the fluff stuff. Blush

Neil deGrasse in the back of the mind going, unknown means stop talkin...

The problem with the Gwynnies, she's my one certainty (the other one wanting to be 100% dead); there ain't nothing left to do in this life alone.

Check your carabiners, Brother, looks to me like you're still tied safely in.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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12-05-2012, 06:39 PM
RE: Death and beyond
(12-05-2012 06:23 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(12-05-2012 06:18 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  I wuz trollin' with the fluff stuff. Blush

Neil deGrasse in the back of the mind going, unknown means stop talkin...

The problem with the Gwynnies, she's my one certainty (the other one wanting to be 100% dead); there ain't nothing left to do in this life alone.

Check your carabiners, Brother, looks to me like you're still tied safely in.

But it ain't god that makes me a prophet, so much as the numbers; whatever I think I'm doing, I have faith someone could do it better. :/

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13-05-2012, 12:18 PM
RE: Death and beyond
I have no answers....... only questions Huh

If you believe that our flesh is a vehicle...... that the "soul" can be considered the "energy/fuel" that gives it animation/life then is this limited to humans???

Surely everything else that is considered alive (as in it reproduces and will at some point cease to exist) should be considered as an equal and the only differences that could be used to term "seperation" would be the vehicles (bodies) that we use to observe.

In this flesh vehicle things seem real....... things are solid and you cannot push your hand through a solid brick wall...... you are limited to the very senses that you use to observe....... so when released from this flesh vehicle (death) then I wonder at how things could be percieved, when you are no longer "limited" to a nervous system nor this vibration we exist within???

Your flesh vehicle is made up of billions of cells that renew within certain timespans....... they are in there own right unique but they make up the "whole" which is you....... If I push the boundaries on my viewpoint further beyond myself I get to consider that this planet is a cell and that it makes up the "whole" universe.

I dont believe in time........ so I dont actually believe in death Blush

For no matter how much I use these symbols, to describe symptoms of my existence.
You are your own emphasis.
So I say nothing.

-Bemore.
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13-05-2012, 01:28 PM
RE: Death and beyond
(13-05-2012 12:18 PM)bemore Wrote:  I have no answers....... only questions Huh

If you believe that our flesh is a vehicle...... that the "soul" can be considered the "energy/fuel" that gives it animation/life then is this limited to humans???

Surely everything else that is considered alive (as in it reproduces and will at some point cease to exist) should be considered as an equal and the only differences that could be used to term "seperation" would be the vehicles (bodies) that we use to observe.

In this flesh vehicle things seem real....... things are solid and you cannot push your hand through a solid brick wall...... you are limited to the very senses that you use to observe....... so when released from this flesh vehicle (death) then I wonder at how things could be percieved, when you are no longer "limited" to a nervous system nor this vibration we exist within???

Your flesh vehicle is made up of billions of cells that renew within certain timespans....... they are in there own right unique but they make up the "whole" which is you....... If I push the boundaries on my viewpoint further beyond myself I get to consider that this planet is a cell and that it makes up the "whole" universe.

I dont believe in time........ so I dont actually believe in death Blush



In my thinking it would apply to all life. Plants and animals alike (and we are animals after all). And I don't really think anything is perceived after death. But who knows. I really don't think that "that which powers us" necessarily stays one unit, it may disperse and power several newly born life forms. Or it may form a "pool" that new life forms can draw from.

I think of it more like electricity, which moves along and has no idea what it will power. Basically, IF there is something there, it stands to reason that it is being recycled like everything else in nature.

And the thought that this planet is one of the "cells" making up the universe has crossed my mind too. Or even that the universe is just one cell in something much bigger. Who says that what we have been able to explore is all there is? Maybe we are nothing but tiny microbes in a large system. But we digress.

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Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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06-02-2013, 05:26 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2013 05:30 PM by Luminon.)
RE: Death and beyond
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06-02-2013, 05:52 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2013 06:27 PM by amyb.)
RE: Death and beyond
I tend to see it the way HoC said, the flashlight going out while left on the desk. What creates the body's energy? The body's systems, using the lungs, heart, blood, glucose, oxygen, etc. When the body shuts down, it ceases to manufacture (convert) energy from the raw materials (like when you shut off the car, it stops using the gasoline). When the systems fail, there is no more energy to be had because it's not making/converting any more. So the limbs stop moving, the heart stops beating, breathing slows and eventually the brain has no more fuel and it dies. By this time, I just don't think there is really any more "energy" to talk about, except maybe the last bit of heat that leaves the body as it gets cold. There may be food in your stomach but you're no longer converting that into muscle-energy. In fact,I see that as the whole definition of death: the body isn't working as an efficient machine anymore, its' not making or using energy right, so it sputters for a while and then stops working.

Anyway, I've seen lots of people and animals die, and I still don't see anything awfully mysterious about the way the body shuts down.

Additionally, the things we refer to as stored energy,we usually only think of them as energy to the extent we can use them ourselves. Like glucose in the blood. A normal body will use it for energy. Fat is a kind of stored energy, and a functional metabolism can convert it when the need to do so arises. However, a dying body doesn't have this functional metabolism, making the fat stores useless. Can it be converted to energy? Yes. If you were part of the Donner Party, and the others ate your dead body, that fat would be converted to energy for them. So no energy was lost. It's like a car that is completely fucking broken, but still has a full tank of gas. You don't ask, where did the car's energy go? because it's still all there, it just isn't able to be used by the car. Same with the body. Stomach is full of food, but the body is in no condition to convert that into energy for the body to use, or the body is otherwise unable to use that potential energy. There is no problem with energy being created or destroyed, there is a problem with converting and using energy.
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