Debates with a believer Boyfriend
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
25-02-2013, 10:32 AM
Debates with a believer Boyfriend
The other night, I was talking with the boyfriend about something. It ended up leading into stuff about science and stuff. I forget the actual topic, but I do remember looking at him and asking, "How do you talk so much about science when... Nevermind."

He responded by asking what I was going to say. I told him "never mind; I forget." He looked at me funny and came back, saying, "How can I "believe" in science when I also believe in God?" I said, "Yeah. That."

He rolled his eyes. I got uncomfortable. We knew where this was going. I can't say anything about my beliefs because I don't want to offend him. Why do I censor myself? It's not fair.

I've just been on this roller coaster lately. I find I WANT to talk about it. He tries to avoid it all together. I think that it's very difficult to have a relationship when one person believes and the other does not. I think it's been eating away at me because when we first started dating, I told him up front that I don't believe. Three years later, I find that it bugs me more than it used to.

It makes me wonder about all the unbelievable stuff he has believed in his whole life.

1) He believes in the Noah's ark story.
2) He believes that we were created and we grew to evolve.
3) He believes in the power of prayer.
4) He hasn't said it outright, but I think he believes my son and I will go to Hell because we are not baptized.

This has gotten me thinking of the stuff I think is bullshit that uninformed people from long ago and had no way of knowing what or how things worked, made up these fantastical stories.

1) I told him I think bible stories are on the same page as myths and how can so many people believe one set of stories, but "understand" the others are just "made up?" Why is one account so much easier to believe in than the other?
2) I think that praying is wishful thinking. It don't see any evidence that it legitimately helps people. I do believe that people believe in it and that's powerful enough to make them feel better about all the bad stuff that's going on.
3) I think it's wrong that religious people pick and choose what they want to believe. (My boyfriend is one of those people.) They have sex before marriage, say stuff like, "God, damn it," and many other things that are right in the bible saying it's wrong. If one believes in something that has a strict code of "dos and don'ts," then that person should obey them. If one TRULY believes, they wouldn't alter that faith to fit their way of life.

I called this post "Debating with the Boyfriend," but I really don't see it as a debate. I'm at a loss for words to describe what this ongoing battle is we are having. Censored

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
25-02-2013, 10:45 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 10:32 AM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  The other night, I was talking with the boyfriend about something. It ended up leading into stuff about science and stuff. I forget the actual topic, but I do remember looking at him and asking, "How do you talk so much about science when... Nevermind."

He responded by asking what I was going to say. I told him "never mind; I forget." He looked at me funny and came back, saying, "How can I "believe" in science when I also believe in God?" I said, "Yeah. That."

He rolled his eyes. I got uncomfortable. We knew where this was going. I can't say anything about my beliefs because I don't want to offend him. Why do I censor myself? It's not fair.

I've just been on this roller coaster lately. I find I WANT to talk about it. He tries to avoid it all together. I think that it's very difficult to have a relationship when one person believes and the other does not. I think it's been eating away at me because when we first started dating, I told him up front that I don't believe. Three years later, I find that it bugs me more than it used to.

It makes me wonder about all the unbelievable stuff he has believed in his whole life.

1) He believes in the Noah's ark story.
2) He believes that we were created and we grew to evolve.
3) He believes in the power of prayer.
4) He hasn't said it outright, but I think he believes my son and I will go to Hell because we are not baptized.

This has gotten me thinking of the stuff I think is bullshit that uninformed people from long ago and had no way of knowing what or how things worked, made up these fantastical stories.

1) I told him I think bible stories are on the same page as myths and how can so many people believe one set of stories, but "understand" the others are just "made up?" Why is one account so much easier to believe in than the other?
2) I think that praying is wishful thinking. It don't see any evidence that it legitimately helps people. I do believe that people believe in it and that's powerful enough to make them feel better about all the bad stuff that's going on.
3) I think it's wrong that religious people pick and choose what they want to believe. (My boyfriend is one of those people.) They have sex before marriage, say stuff like, "God, damn it," and many other things that are right in the bible saying it's wrong. If one believes in something that has a strict code of "dos and don'ts," then that person should obey them. If one TRULY believes, they wouldn't alter that faith to fit their way of life.

I called this post "Debating with the Boyfriend," but I really don't see it as a debate. I'm at a loss for words to describe what this ongoing battle is we are having. Censored


And you haven't ended this relationship because ... ? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Chas's post
25-02-2013, 11:19 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 10:45 AM)Chas Wrote:  And you haven't ended this relationship because ... ? Consider
I've invested so much into it. I strive to make sure I don't go from boyfriend to boyfriend for the sake of my son. Sad
Three years of time getting to know somebody seems like a lot to throw away just because we don't see eye to eye on religion. Trust me, I have been worrying myself about what I want and what's best.

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
25-02-2013, 11:21 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 11:19 AM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  
(25-02-2013 10:45 AM)Chas Wrote:  And you haven't ended this relationship because ... ? Consider
I've invested so much into it. I strive to make sure I don't go from boyfriend to boyfriend for the sake of my son. Sad
Three years of time getting to know somebody seems like a lot to throw away just because we don't see eye to eye on religion. Trust me, I have been worrying myself about what I want and what's best.


Do you feel that the wrong relationship s better than no relationship?
The longer you hang on to this one, the longer you will be blocked from finding a good one.

Your choice. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like Chas's post
25-02-2013, 11:30 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 11:21 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(25-02-2013 11:19 AM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  I've invested so much into it. I strive to make sure I don't go from boyfriend to boyfriend for the sake of my son. Sad
Three years of time getting to know somebody seems like a lot to throw away just because we don't see eye to eye on religion. Trust me, I have been worrying myself about what I want and what's best.


Do you feel that the wrong relationship s better than no relationship?
The longer you hang on to this one, the longer you will be blocked from finding a good one.

Your choice. Drinking Beverage
I'd like to try being single. But I've come to realize it's hard to imagine being on my own after being accustomed to a certain way of life financially. I see your point, but I've only just begun to question this relationship. Maybe in the next few months I'll have been able to take stock of my assets and make a plan. Right now, though, I gotta do what I know will keep my son in a home.
*If that came off as my relying on a boyfriend to support me, it isn't what I meant. I'm sure if I were without a child, I would be able to come to terms of what's best for me much easier. I like to think of myself as a respectable mother.

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
25-02-2013, 11:34 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 10:32 AM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  The other night, I was talking with the boyfriend about something. It ended up leading into stuff about science and stuff. I forget the actual topic, but I do remember looking at him and asking, "How do you talk so much about science when... Nevermind."

He responded by asking what I was going to say. I told him "never mind; I forget." He looked at me funny and came back, saying, "How can I "believe" in science when I also believe in God?" I said, "Yeah. That."

He rolled his eyes. I got uncomfortable. We knew where this was going. I can't say anything about my beliefs because I don't want to offend him. Why do I censor myself? It's not fair.

I've just been on this roller coaster lately. I find I WANT to talk about it. He tries to avoid it all together. I think that it's very difficult to have a relationship when one person believes and the other does not. I think it's been eating away at me because when we first started dating, I told him up front that I don't believe. Three years later, I find that it bugs me more than it used to.

It makes me wonder about all the unbelievable stuff he has believed in his whole life.

1) He believes in the Noah's ark story.
2) He believes that we were created and we grew to evolve.
3) He believes in the power of prayer.
4) He hasn't said it outright, but I think he believes my son and I will go to Hell because we are not baptized.

This has gotten me thinking of the stuff I think is bullshit that uninformed people from long ago and had no way of knowing what or how things worked, made up these fantastical stories.

1) I told him I think bible stories are on the same page as myths and how can so many people believe one set of stories, but "understand" the others are just "made up?" Why is one account so much easier to believe in than the other?
2) I think that praying is wishful thinking. It don't see any evidence that it legitimately helps people. I do believe that people believe in it and that's powerful enough to make them feel better about all the bad stuff that's going on.
3) I think it's wrong that religious people pick and choose what they want to believe. (My boyfriend is one of those people.) They have sex before marriage, say stuff like, "God, damn it," and many other things that are right in the bible saying it's wrong. If one believes in something that has a strict code of "dos and don'ts," then that person should obey them. If one TRULY believes, they wouldn't alter that faith to fit their way of life.

I called this post "Debating with the Boyfriend," but I really don't see it as a debate. I'm at a loss for words to describe what this ongoing battle is we are having. Censored

I am one of those people who would usually advocate the "Don't talk about religion" when you're in a relationship, but if you want to fuck that rule, all the power to ya.

How about you approach it from a science angle, talk to him about the Arc story and ask him how all of those animals got into such a small boat. If you try to hit the religion, it's not going to work, but if you try to hit the discrepancies, you might get him to change his mind on some of theory ridiculous shit.

[Image: 0013382F-E507-48AE-906B-53008666631C-757...cc3639.jpg]
Credit goes to UndercoverAtheist.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
25-02-2013, 11:47 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
When people talk about converting others to atheism, my line is typically "there's no atheist heaven". There's nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree -- people have a right to be wrong.

You could clearly shrug it off, because it's what you've been doing all along. If he doesn't want to discuss it, it's unlikely that you're going to force him to do it, and even less likely that you'll convince him through argument (except perhaps over time, but it doesn't appear that he'll give you that option).

Or you could leave him as Chas suggested, though I think it's rather irrational to leave him over something that you clearly recognized and ok'ed up to this point.

I'm an atheist with a believing girlfriend, although she doesn't take it too seriously by attending church or praying publicly. I don't feel that I have to win her over to the truth, any more than she feels the need to convert me. My advice is just to let it go, and use communities like this to discuss the topics that you can't discuss with him.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
25-02-2013, 11:56 AM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 11:47 AM)Starcrash Wrote:  When people talk about converting others to atheism, my line is typically "there's no atheist heaven". There's nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree -- people have a right to be wrong.

You could clearly shrug it off, because it's what you've been doing all along. If he doesn't want to discuss it, it's unlikely that you're going to force him to do it, and even less likely that you'll convince him through argument (except perhaps over time, but it doesn't appear that he'll give you that option).

Or you could leave him as Chas suggested, though I think it's rather irrational to leave him over something that you clearly recognized and ok'ed up to this point.

I'm an atheist with a believing girlfriend, although she doesn't take it too seriously by attending church or praying publicly. I don't feel that I have to win her over to the truth, any more than she feels the need to convert me. My advice is just to let it go, and use communities like this to discuss the topics that you can't discuss with him.


Well, it's not irrational because it appears to be no longer OK, it has become an issue.
59pEaNUt89 Wrote:I've just been on this roller coaster lately. I find I WANT to talk about it. He tries to avoid it all together. I think that it's very difficult to have a relationship when one person believes and the other does not. I think it's been eating away at me because when we first started dating, I told him up front that I don't believe. Three years later, I find that it bugs me more than it used to.

People change, people grow. pEaNUT seems to have outgrown this fellow.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Chas's post
25-02-2013, 12:11 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
hmmm. Clearly you don't see eye to eye with the guy on some fundamental beliefs. I also understand your desire to create a stable home environment for your son. While that is and should be a big concern to you, so is your happiness and the prospects for long term fulfillment.

My wife and I have an understanding that we don't forge too deep into the topic of religion. She is a non-practicing believer, barely who simply doesn't want to completely shatter her long term beliefs. I think that one day, she'll join us on the dark side but I will let her get there at her own pace. I bring my situation up because it contrasts with yours in that my wife and I aren't too far apart and it still causes some friction. Your boyfriend believes in the some of the more fantastical parts of religion: creation myth & noah's ark. That is a much much greater divide.

IMO it would be hard for me to consider it a relationship with long term potential if at the basic level you have such opposed views on religion. Just my two cents which due to our economy is really worth nothing.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes devilsadvoc8's post
25-02-2013, 12:20 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 10:32 AM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  The other night, I was talking with the boyfriend about something. It ended up leading into stuff about science and stuff. I forget the actual topic, but I do remember looking at him and asking, "How do you talk so much about science when... Nevermind."

He responded by asking what I was going to say. I told him "never mind; I forget." He looked at me funny and came back, saying, "How can I "believe" in science when I also believe in God?" I said, "Yeah. That."

He rolled his eyes. I got uncomfortable. We knew where this was going. I can't say anything about my beliefs because I don't want to offend him. Why do I censor myself? It's not fair.

I've just been on this roller coaster lately. I find I WANT to talk about it. He tries to avoid it all together. I think that it's very difficult to have a relationship when one person believes and the other does not. I think it's been eating away at me because when we first started dating, I told him up front that I don't believe. Three years later, I find that it bugs me more than it used to.

It makes me wonder about all the unbelievable stuff he has believed in his whole life.

1) He believes in the Noah's ark story.
2) He believes that we were created and we grew to evolve.
3) He believes in the power of prayer.
4) He hasn't said it outright, but I think he believes my son and I will go to Hell because we are not baptized.

This has gotten me thinking of the stuff I think is bullshit that uninformed people from long ago and had no way of knowing what or how things worked, made up these fantastical stories.

1) I told him I think bible stories are on the same page as myths and how can so many people believe one set of stories, but "understand" the others are just "made up?" Why is one account so much easier to believe in than the other?
2) I think that praying is wishful thinking. It don't see any evidence that it legitimately helps people. I do believe that people believe in it and that's powerful enough to make them feel better about all the bad stuff that's going on.
3) I think it's wrong that religious people pick and choose what they want to believe. (My boyfriend is one of those people.) They have sex before marriage, say stuff like, "God, damn it," and many other things that are right in the bible saying it's wrong. If one believes in something that has a strict code of "dos and don'ts," then that person should obey them. If one TRULY believes, they wouldn't alter that faith to fit their way of life.

I called this post "Debating with the Boyfriend," but I really don't see it as a debate. I'm at a loss for words to describe what this ongoing battle is we are having. Censored
In my opinion, you should talk about your lack of belief freely without fear of offending your boyfriend. Just make sure you do so politely. Then you can see where that takes you and you will find out if the religion differences really matter. I think this must be done if you seriously want to stay in the relationship with him. Even if he is thinking nothing negative, the fact that it's eating you will eventually come out in one way or another. It's best to discuss it, get it out in the open, and deal with it before it comes out in a more destructive way. You may find discussing it solidifies your relationship. Or you may find your differences on the subject are a real problem. If it is a real problem, that will come out sooner or later too and sooner is probably better than later. Regardless of how irritated or emotional your boyfriend may become during the discussion, it's very important that you at least maintain a position of politeness throughout. That way, if you have a serious disagreement you will clearly know it was about religion and not your disposition.

"Religion has caused more misery to all of mankind in every stage of human history than any other single idea." --Madalyn Murray O'Hair
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Impulse's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: