Debates with a believer Boyfriend
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25-02-2013, 12:54 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
I'd say to ask, either him or yourself, how big a part of his life faith is. He believes in the power of prayer, but is this something he spends two hours a day on, or two minutes? He believes in a fusion of evolution and creationism, but is that just something in the back of his head that he produces when challenged, or is he going on rants about the evolutionary conspiracy and trying to rewrite the textbook? If he thinks you and your soon are going to hell, is that just "yeah, I'm told that's how the system works, it sucks", or is it "this is justice and the two of you deserve it"?

Basically, figure out how big a part of his day-to-day existence it is, and how much of a role it has in shaping his view of everyday life. This will help you mentally categorize it as either a "leaves towels on the bathroom floor" irritant or an "addicted to unhealthy substances" deal-breaker.

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25-02-2013, 01:07 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 11:56 AM)Chas Wrote:  People change, people grow. pEaNUT seems to have outgrown this fellow.
Peanut kind of agrees... But is still figuring out how she truly feels.

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
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25-02-2013, 01:29 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
I'm gonna take your child's position. I don't know his name so, I'll call him Peanut Butter.

As Peanut Butter gets older, he will invariably spend more time with Boyfriend. He's already capable of understanding contradictions and make no mistake, when he sees them, it affects his world view. I'm sure he believes you when you explain the world to him and since kids are innately rational beings, he won't have any trouble understanding the things you tell him about creation, evolution, etc. But once he gets older and has developed some trust in boyfriend, the contradictions are going to become harmful. For instance, when Boyfriend tells Peanut Butter about God and Hell and all that stuff, the red contradiction flag is going to wave in his head. He's going to figure out that Boyfriend thinks he and his mother are Hell bound. Not to mention there will be an infinite number of other contradictions, minor though they may seem, that Peanut Butter finds between what Mom says and what Boyfriend says. And those minor contradictions will culminate in a lot of confusion and resentment on Peanut Butter's part.

Peanut Butter will begin to resent Mom for being with a guy who thinks she and he are going to hell. He will lose respect for Mom's opinion because, after all, she's with this guy who completely disagrees with some of the most important, fundamental truths about life. And for what? Help paying the rent? A nice car? Someone for him to throw a ball to? Sexy time?

In the end, if you maintain this relationship with Boyfriend, you will invariably wind up turning Peanut Butter into Peanut Brittle. His mind will be fractured and his life will suffer as a consequence. Peanut Butter can be the happiest kid on the planet living in the back seat of Mom's car so long as there is love, respect and consistency in his life.

The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names. - Chinese Proverb
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25-02-2013, 01:52 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 01:29 PM)bbeljefe Wrote:  I'm gonna take your child's position. I don't know his name so, I'll call him Peanut Butter.

Awesome. That got my attention and made me lol... Smile

In the end, if you maintain this relationship with Boyfriend, you will invariably wind up turning Peanut Butter into Peanut Brittle. His mind will be fractured and his life will suffer as a consequence. Peanut Butter can be the happiest kid on the planet living in the back seat of Mom's car so long as there is love, respect and consistency in his life.
You make a very good point. My son is the most important thing in my life. As I've said before, I am still trying to figure out how I feel. I need time to plan. I couldn't foresee myself questioning this relationship three years ago. I gotta make sure all the pieces will fit together before I make any major decisions. I know I don't want to settle... To my BF's credit, he treats my son and I great and with respect. The only major difference is religion.

Again, my goal is to not turn into my mom. She had too many men in my life growing up. I don't want my son to grow to resent me.

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
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25-02-2013, 02:16 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 01:52 PM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  
(25-02-2013 01:29 PM)bbeljefe Wrote:  I'm gonna take your child's position. I don't know his name so, I'll call him Peanut Butter.

Awesome. That got my attention and made me lol... Smile

In the end, if you maintain this relationship with Boyfriend, you will invariably wind up turning Peanut Butter into Peanut Brittle. His mind will be fractured and his life will suffer as a consequence. Peanut Butter can be the happiest kid on the planet living in the back seat of Mom's car so long as there is love, respect and consistency in his life.
You make a very good point. My son is the most important thing in my life. As I've said before, I am still trying to figure out how I feel. I need time to plan. I couldn't foresee myself questioning this relationship three years ago. I gotta make sure all the pieces will fit together before I make any major decisions. I know I don't want to settle... To my BF's credit, he treats my son and I great and with respect. The only major difference is religion.

Again, my goal is to not turn into my mom. She had too many men in my life growing up. I don't want my son to grow to resent me.

Remember though that this is your life. Usually a good goal is to be yourself, find yourself and enjoy yourself. To attempt to make yourself the opposite of someone else, exactly like, or not like someone else means you're concentrating more on what others did or are doing instead of what you're doing.

I think it's great that you're mindful of how your son sees you. But at the same time you deserve to be happy as well. Also what would the repercussions be of someone with conflicting views for your children?

I also agree with others that a person shouldn't settle. I mean shit, if you're only getting one shot at life you may as well make yourself happy and ensure the happiness of your family. Religion in relationships can be a huge burden or not. Some people get along fine being religious and another not religious. Others are always at each other's throats over it and there's those who grow to resent each other over it.

My largest issue would be how it would affect my kid. I'm no parent yet, but me and my wife have constantly discussed views, ideas, religion and what we would do if our kid was subjected to it, how we would handle it, what age a kid is old enough to make their own choices on that stuff, etc. I was indoctrinated up to my eyeballs as a child, I didn't get a decent education about the world until I went to college for a brief period of time and actually bothered to think for myself. I was furious that I didn't get the chance to learn about the big bang or evolution because I was taught to think that crap was all a lie and go "la la la" and put my fingers in my ears when I heard it.

Now I look back and years of my education were robbed from me over that bullshit. I'd never want that for my kids. A parent is an authority figure in a child's life. So when the big questions come up and one parent has one idea and the other parent believes something else, what is the child to take from it? What will they learn? What will they think? How will it affect them in their daily life? Their education? Later in life? How will it shape them? Even the smallest things to a kid from their parent is enough to drastically change their views on things.

I can think of all sorts of things that would run through my mind:

- Do I want these views pushed on my kid?
- Should they be talked about with them?
- If they believe this, what else do they believe?
- Is this a deal breaker for my relationship? Can I deal with it?
- Do I WANT to deal with it? Is it worth dealing with at all?

Obviously it's a difficult situation to be in, and I do tend to ramble. Anyway...
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25-02-2013, 02:27 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
"Awesome. That got my attention and made me lol... Smile"

Mission accomplished! Thanks. And look, you've got time to make plans and prepare in such a way that you and Peanut Butter have a minimum of transitional stress. I think your decision was made before you made the OP.... you were just unclear about how to go about it and, perhaps, exactly why.


"My son is the most important thing in my life."

Those are the smartest, most compassionate words I've read on this site to date. Peanut Butter is a very lucky kid!

The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names. - Chinese Proverb
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25-02-2013, 02:58 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 02:27 PM)bbeljefe Wrote:  "My son is the most important thing in my life."

Those are the smartest, most compassionate words I've read on this site to date. Peanut Butter is a very lucky kid!
Thanks, online buddy Smile

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
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25-02-2013, 03:25 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 10:32 AM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  The other night, I was talking with the boyfriend about something. It ended up leading into stuff about science and stuff. I forget the actual topic, but I do remember looking at him and asking, "How do you talk so much about science when... Nevermind."

He responded by asking what I was going to say. I told him "never mind; I forget." He looked at me funny and came back, saying, "How can I "believe" in science when I also believe in God?" I said, "Yeah. That."

He rolled his eyes. I got uncomfortable. We knew where this was going. I can't say anything about my beliefs because I don't want to offend him. Why do I censor myself? It's not fair.

I've just been on this roller coaster lately. I find I WANT to talk about it. He tries to avoid it all together. I think that it's very difficult to have a relationship when one person believes and the other does not. I think it's been eating away at me because when we first started dating, I told him up front that I don't believe. Three years later, I find that it bugs me more than it used to.

It makes me wonder about all the unbelievable stuff he has believed in his whole life.

1) He believes in the Noah's ark story.
2) He believes that we were created and we grew to evolve.
3) He believes in the power of prayer.
4) He hasn't said it outright, but I think he believes my son and I will go to Hell because we are not baptized.

This has gotten me thinking of the stuff I think is bullshit that uninformed people from long ago and had no way of knowing what or how things worked, made up these fantastical stories.

1) I told him I think bible stories are on the same page as myths and how can so many people believe one set of stories, but "understand" the others are just "made up?" Why is one account so much easier to believe in than the other?
2) I think that praying is wishful thinking. It don't see any evidence that it legitimately helps people. I do believe that people believe in it and that's powerful enough to make them feel better about all the bad stuff that's going on.
3) I think it's wrong that religious people pick and choose what they want to believe. (My boyfriend is one of those people.) They have sex before marriage, say stuff like, "God, damn it," and many other things that are right in the bible saying it's wrong. If one believes in something that has a strict code of "dos and don'ts," then that person should obey them. If one TRULY believes, they wouldn't alter that faith to fit their way of life.

I called this post "Debating with the Boyfriend," but I really don't see it as a debate. I'm at a loss for words to describe what this ongoing battle is we are having. Censored
Ya know what would be a real twist... if a guy had wrote this post...

Obama promised you change. Reach in your pocket, feel those coins? There's your change...
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25-02-2013, 03:30 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 03:25 PM)DeathsNotoriousAngel Wrote:  Ya know what would be a real twist... if a guy had wrote this post...
What do you mean?

"It was life, often unsatisfying, frequently cruel, usually boring, sometimes beautiful, once in awhile exhilarating." -Stephen King
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25-02-2013, 04:01 PM
RE: Debates with a believer Boyfriend
(25-02-2013 03:30 PM)59pEaNUt89 Wrote:  
(25-02-2013 03:25 PM)DeathsNotoriousAngel Wrote:  Ya know what would be a real twist... if a guy had wrote this post...
What do you mean?
I'm just saying hypothetically if a guy wrote exactly what you wrote... it would make me take pause at the situation, that's all.

Obama promised you change. Reach in your pocket, feel those coins? There's your change...
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