Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
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11-11-2014, 04:31 PM (This post was last modified: 11-11-2014 04:40 PM by TheInquisition.)
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
(10-11-2014 09:48 PM)Nintentacle Wrote:  People have already said why these kind of test are stupid for years already: You need faith in God (Luke 17:6, Romans 1:20)

Of course, they have excuses a mile long as to why, but they have nothing but excuses and will never produce tangible results and that's why faith and your god fails the most trivial of tests.

Doesn't say much to your god's power does it? My simple test mocks and humiliates the most boastful of any theist's assertions and cuts out all of the BS. Just move the little cardboard disk almighty god(s), prove your power! Laugh out load

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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11-11-2014, 05:20 PM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
(11-11-2014 04:31 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Just move the little cardboard disk almighty god(s), prove your power! Laugh out load

It would certainly be worth one's while, if it worked...

... this is my signature!
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12-11-2014, 04:34 PM (This post was last modified: 12-11-2014 07:39 PM by TheInquisition.)
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
I read about many of the stories of people trying to win his prize, that was a fun read.
They invariably have excuses, this is the hallmark of the fraudulent and I recognize it because I experienced it first-hand.

When I had a back problem in my teens, I; my family and the entire church, prayed for a miraculous healing, it didn't happen. i underwent back surgery and resolved it with medical science.

When I returned to church months later after recovering from surgery a woman in the youth group tried to suggest that I thank god for this. I retorted that I still had to get the surgery, I wasn't miraculously healed. She said "Well, you came through it ok." She immediately moved the goal posts, everyone prayed for a healing so I didn't have to undergo surgery. I knew that was a BS excuse and everyone in that room knew it too.

That was when I realized this was all a bunch of BS, there wasn't really anything to this stuff, it was based on how you look at things (perception) and not on actual miracles that yield physical differences in the real world.

When you take their excuses away and propose a test that takes individual perceptions out of the mix, then their fraud is exposed.

This is why trolls like Nintentacle declare it to be stupid, how dare I test god! How can I be so arrogant to propose a test that's not dependent on faith and would produce actual, tangible, verifiable results that cannot be waived away by interpretation of scripture or perception?

You have to accept the fraudulent conditions for it to work -you have to have faith!

So I will channel James Randi and simply say -turn the cardboard disk!

I know what kind of game you're playing and you know what kind of game you're playing, your little tricks of perception don't fool me. Turn the cardboard disk!

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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12-11-2014, 04:46 PM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
Did you ever hear him tell the story about the guy who claimed to be able to love without food? They caught him late one night with a bag of Burger King cheeseburgers Laughat

"What, I just like the smell, honest!!" Was his response I believe.

I hope that the world turns, and things get better. But what I hope most of all is that you understand what I mean when I tell you that, even though I do not know you, and even though I may never meet you, laugh with you, cry with you, or kiss you, I love you. With all my heart, I love you. - V for Vendetta
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12-11-2014, 05:06 PM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
(12-11-2014 04:46 PM)Smercury44 Wrote:  Did you ever hear him tell the story about the guy who claimed to be able to love without food? They caught him late one night with a bag of Burger King cheeseburgers Laughat

"What, I just like the smell, honest!!" Was his response I believe.

Who wants to "love without food" Big Grin

[Image: whipcreamfreud-copy.jpg]

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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15-11-2014, 11:56 AM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
(12-11-2014 04:34 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  I read about many of the stories of people trying to win his prize, that was a fun read.
They invariably have excuses, this is the hallmark of the fraudulent and I recognize it because I experienced it first-hand.

When I had a back problem in my teens, I; my family and the entire church, prayed for a miraculous healing, it didn't happen. i underwent back surgery and resolved it with medical science.

When I returned to church months later after recovering from surgery a woman in the youth group tried to suggest that I thank god for this. I retorted that I still had to get the surgery, I wasn't miraculously healed. She said "Well, you came through it ok." She immediately moved the goal posts, everyone prayed for a healing so I didn't have to undergo surgery. I knew that was a BS excuse and everyone in that room knew it too.

That was when I realized this was all a bunch of BS, there wasn't really anything to this stuff, it was based on how you look at things (perception) and not on actual miracles that yield physical differences in the real world.

When you take their excuses away and propose a test that takes individual perceptions out of the mix, then their fraud is exposed.

This is why trolls like Nintentacle declare it to be stupid, how dare I test god! How can I be so arrogant to propose a test that's not dependent on faith and would produce actual, tangible, verifiable results that cannot be waived away by interpretation of scripture or perception?

You have to accept the fraudulent conditions for it to work -you have to have faith!

So I will channel James Randi and simply say -turn the cardboard disk!

I know what kind of game you're playing and you know what kind of game you're playing, your little tricks of perception don't fool me. Turn the cardboard disk!

This is the most succinct and poignant argument I have heard against a personal god. Awesome thread man. I get a laugh every time I visit it.
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07-12-2014, 10:27 AM (This post was last modified: 07-12-2014 10:35 AM by TheInquisition.)
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
I put this response to a theist in another thread, but I think this explanation in this thread as to why a deity can't perform a simple task would be useful here, it applies to any deity:

Your god won't turn a little cardboard disk (a childishly trivial task) because:

1. It can't
2. It won't

You will assert it won't, I will assert it can't simply because it doesn't exist. (Okham's Razor already favors my assertion)

Since your god can't or won't, what would be some reasonable explanations as to why? I will list them in descending probability:

1. Your deity doesn't exist
2. Some deity exists, but you have the wrong one
3. Your deity exists, but you don't have a very good understanding of the parameters in which it operates.
4. Your deity exists, and your understanding of it is correct.

I am going to give you a VERY generous benefit of a doubt here and give you an EQUAL weighting to all of these propositions, you have a 1-in-4 chance of being correct, the odds are already stacked against you. You are down to a 25% chance of being correct right out of the gate.

We CAN evaluate many propositions that a "holy" text asserts if they are falsifiable, such as the Genesis myth, Noahtic flood myth, Tower of Babel myth, etc.

Science can't really disprove your god that you assert, but it can reduce the likelihood of it being real to an ever-receding pocket of ignorance that flees from the light of TRUE scientific understanding of the universe.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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07-12-2014, 10:41 AM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
Addendum:

Substitute the statement: Your god won't always answer prayer because-
Then evaluate the probability of a god within this framework.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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07-12-2014, 11:37 AM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
(04-11-2014 08:24 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  I made a deity tester to determine if a god or gods exist, I found a thin piece of plastic packing material that has the shape of Devil’s Tower in Wyoming, drilled a hole in the top so a marble would sit in it without rolling off of the top. It only takes a little nudge to get the marble to roll off the top of the tower into the base. If it receives enough of a nudge, the effect will be unmistakable as the marble will roll a bit to reach the bottom.

[Image: Deitytester_zps245fb612.jpg]

Now all you have to do is pray to a god or any supernatural entity to see if the marble moves. If you ask a deity to cure a cold or cancer, it would have to annihilate numerous infected cells throughout the body to achieve this effect in the real world. The amount of energy and scope of complexity of this task will far exceed the simple act of nudging a one gram marble off of a little indention. The same can be said of finding you a parking space or finding your keys that you misplaced, moving a marble is a trivial task compared to such “answered” prayers.
Just about any answered prayer depends on skewed perceptions to infer that a god acted in a manner according to a prayer. I can drive by an accident in the road and see nothing supernatural, someone that seeks out delusion will drive by that same accident and thank god that they were saved by their deity from being in that accident. They create a miracle by skewed perception, we see this process at work with people claiming supernatural healings, finding parking spots, etc.
This test virtually eliminates perception-based miracle claims, the marble cannot move unless a very strong gust of wind blows it off of its divot, but such a gust will not happen in an indoor space unless deliberately orchestrated. If nothing natural moves the marble, then you have proof of a deity-simple!

Here is the test setup:

The Deity Tester 1.0 is placed in plain view of a security cam with the marble in position on the tower.
A control of no prayer to any deity is ran to begin the test.
A prayer is made to the deity being tested including time limitations, and conditions (no person, squirrel or natural thing can move the marble, it must move with no visible force or perhaps a grey-bearded man appearing out of thin air)
Results from the test are recorded on the security cam and logged.

Another parameter of the test is that a believer cannot be left alone with the deity tester, a skeptic MUST be the one to monitor it during the test. This eliminates biased/forged results.

Initially, I ran the test to verify every deity, I specified Jesus/God/YHWH in the first test, the second test I verified Satan/Lucifer/Iblis, the 3rd test was a general prayer to every conceivable deity, the final test was a control, I told all deities to not move the marble or they would be considered a fucktard incapable of listening to simple instructions, the results were as follows:

YHWH/Jesus/God 3 days No movement
Satan/Lucifer/Iblis 1 day No movement
All gods 1 day No movement
No god (control) 1 day No movement

After this test, I ran another with a ten second time limit under constant visual observation, this yielded the same result, no movement of the marble under any offered prayers to any entity.
So in conclusion, there was no movement of the marble under any invocation of the supernatural, does this prove there is no supernatural? Not necessarily, however if there is any deity out there that wants to answer prayers under test condition three (all gods invoked), this test has probably ruled out those deities.
I think that condition number two can also bring under question the existence of Satan, this entity would certainly want to show his power in some way. If he wanted to be deceptive, just nudge the marble under condition three or four.
That leaves the Judeo-Christian god, I’m good with declaring this god non-existent based on these results alone. (Even though there are many other reasons to not believe this particular deity)
This god is unwilling or unable to nudge a marble, an utterly trivial task. The only way a believer can get out of these simple test results is to assert that their god is unwilling because of various bible-based reasons. The bible is an interpretive text, it says whatever you want it to say, so when you make excuses for why this god is incapable of doing the most trivial demonstration of its supposed power, all you have is your interpretation of your book to continue believing, but keep in mind that there are tens of thousands of alternate interpretations for any version of Christianity that you believe.
So if your god can’t move the marble, do you have the right interpretation? Does your god really exist? Why can my simple science experiment yield hard data against his existence, whereas a lifetime of devotion and faith will never yield hard/demonstrable evidence?
Why can’t your god move the marble?

Do not put the lord your god to the test........ For he is very likely to fail.
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08-12-2014, 09:42 PM
RE: Deity Tester 1.0-God fails the test
The Deity Tester is clever but has a problem: would you believe it if it worked as expected?

You find it with the marble at the bottom and your first thought very likely WOULDN'T be, "God exists!" Your first thought would be what upset the marble and screwed up the test. So you thread back the video monitor and sure enough, right there at 3:28:34.009 the marble unseats and rolls down to the bottom, with no apparent help from a finger or other agent. Convinced?

Of course not. You'd commence a research campaign to determine what would have happened at that moment that would unseat the marble. And since it is so easily unseated, someone blowing on it, a blast of air through an open door, a subtle tipping of the table itself so slight it doesn't show on the monitor, you'd never be satisfied you'd exhausted every possible means of ruining the test.

So let's say you found your tester in THIS state, the marble suspended on the side of the central riser instead of at the bottom, defying gravity right before your eyes:

[Image: 2vhta9w.jpg]

Would THAT convince you god exists?

Again, I doubt it. Confronted with an apparent miracle, something that really does appear supernatural, I'd guess you'd take serious steps to document the phenomenon, and get to the truth of what's causing it.

There's nothing like a right in your face miracle that steels the resolve to find the natural explanation for it - because there HAS to be a natural explanation - the evidence is right there that it can happen. All that's left is figuring out the how - and all the roads to how lead AWAY from "goddidit", not the other way.
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