Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
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03-11-2014, 05:06 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
Like I said in the beginning: fluff piece.
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03-11-2014, 05:06 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
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03-11-2014, 05:07 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 04:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 04:38 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Does it require an action, or forgiveness to release one's burden? Does forgiveness have the power to remove the burden of a person's guilt?

An omnipotent deity would have the power to do anything it chose. Anything else implies that a deity is subject to some system or other in Reality. There is no Christian doctrine that says Jebus *had* to die to *release* anyone *from their guilt*.

You just really don't know shit about Christian doctrine do you?

A DISHONEST deity would use His powers to break His own laws... so sure if one is dishonest and has no integrity that may be the type of god they'd follow.

Man sold his dominion and his allegiance and gave over his independence to subject himself to ownership. You can see today where a world trying to stamp out God has gotten us to.

God wasn't about to "start all over" because WE fucked up. Nor was He about to break His own just laws. Satan now had ownership and we were broken off with no way back... God loved His children, and bought us back with His own blood. But you don't have to choose to accept that freedom to be able to return... youre free to go your own way Smile

NOW you know a little bit about Christian doctrine Smile
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03-11-2014, 05:07 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 05:06 AM)Fodder_From_The_Truth Wrote:  Like I said in the beginning: fluff piece.

So you'd let your children die in slavery?
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03-11-2014, 05:13 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 05:07 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 05:06 AM)Fodder_From_The_Truth Wrote:  Like I said in the beginning: fluff piece.

So you'd let your children die in slavery?

Do you think if you keep asking this irrelevant question over and over again that it's somehow going to make it relevant?

Respond to this and I'll answer your question: God is all powerful. He could have chosen any other means necessary to forgive mankind for their sins, as well as original sin, which he let Adam and Eve unwittingly stumble into, which he pre-ordained because this is all His plan.

You're trying to have your cake and eat it too, but you don't realize that the cake is actually just a cow pie.
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03-11-2014, 05:17 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 04:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  An omnipotent deity would have the power to do anything it chose. Anything else implies that a deity is subject to some system or other in Reality.

This is what gets me about these Christian ideas about Jesus dying for our sins, what's the physical mechanism behind it? Can we reproduce it in laboratory conditions?

And what is sin? Can we measure it? If it has an effect on reality then it must have energy, so can we harvest it and use it for powering our homes?

Considering how fundamentally important this is to the Christian faith, and also considering how physicists have learnt so much about the workings of the universe, why isn't there a single peer-reviewed scientific paper mentioning anything related to presence of sin and whatever mechanisms Jesus used when he died on the cross?

Honestly, it's like some bad sci-fi script where they just rely on poorly defined concepts.
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03-11-2014, 05:18 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 05:13 AM)Fodder_From_The_Truth Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 05:07 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  So you'd let your children die in slavery?

Do you think if you keep asking this irrelevant question over and over again that it's somehow going to make it relevant?

Respond to this and I'll answer your question: God is all powerful. He could have chosen any other means necessary to forgive mankind for their sins, as well as original sin, which he let Adam and Eve unwittingly stumble into, which he pre-ordained because this is all His plan.

SEE? Even with explanation, you have no idea what youre talking about. It wasn't about forgiveness. We had to be PURCHASED BACK from the party we sold ourselves to. He loved us enough to purchase us back with His own blood, taking OUR ultimate end on Himself, RELEASING us from our slavery. He ALREADY forgave us, but that did NOTHING to buy us back.

Now answer the question... would you buy your children back out of slavery? Would you pay with your own life?
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03-11-2014, 05:21 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
Mathilda, that's the part where they say "God works in mysterious ways" or "you can't understand Gods plan" and bla ba mother fucking blah.
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03-11-2014, 05:26 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 05:17 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 04:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  An omnipotent deity would have the power to do anything it chose. Anything else implies that a deity is subject to some system or other in Reality.

Can we reproduce it in laboratory conditions?

I guess you don't think we observe death LMAO...

Quote:And what is sin?

That's a very good question... do you even know? Define it in your own words

Quote: Can we measure it?

Can you measure slavery and rebellion?

Quote: If it has an effect on reality then it must have energy, so can we harvest it and use it for powering our homes?

You have energy and I don't see any general electric kitchen appliances plugged up your ass.

Quote: considering how physicists have learnt so much about the workings of the universe,

Now youre proving your absolute ignorance of the subject of cosmology... evidently amazingly ignorant of the suybject... youre really not done discrediting yourself yet?

Tell me about everything we've "learnt" about the workings of the universe... Tell me about the little bubble universes and why we should believe in them... do this in your next post Smile
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03-11-2014, 05:26 AM
RE: Did Jesus DIE for our sins?
(03-11-2014 05:07 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 04:57 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  An omnipotent deity would have the power to do anything it chose. Anything else implies that a deity is subject to some system or other in Reality. There is no Christian doctrine that says Jebus *had* to die to *release* anyone *from their guilt*.

You just really don't know shit about Christian doctrine do you?

A DISHONEST deity would use His powers to break His own laws... so sure if one is dishonest and has no integrity that may be the type of god they'd follow.

Man sold his dominion and his allegiance and gave over his independence to subject himself to ownership. You can see today where a world trying to stamp out God has gotten us to.

God wasn't about to "start all over" because WE fucked up. Nor was He about to break His own just laws. Satan now had ownership and we were broken off with no way back... God loved His children, and bought us back with His own blood. But you don't have to choose to accept that freedom to be able to return... youre free to go your own way Smile

NOW you know a little bit about Christian doctrine Smile

I know all about "Christian doctrine". You are STILL implying your powerless deity is SUBJECT to Reality, and not it's master. Whatever the reason he was was executed, it wasn't what Christians CLAIM it was.
Matthew 26:39 "Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, 'My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will.' " No ONE deity has more the ONE will.
"Substitutionary atonement" was cooked up to justify the death of a supposed messiah, who never got his job done. It implies the deity is SUBJECT to Reality, not it's master. An omnipotent, omniscient deity could have cooked up another way to do anything it wanted. Does anyone actually think in the year 10,014 humans will still give a shit about some human cult figure's death 10,000 years before.

Grow up.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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