Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
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21-07-2017, 11:50 AM (This post was last modified: 21-07-2017 11:56 AM by Thumpalumpacus.)
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 11:13 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Name ONE person that was a member of the Russian government that met with the Trump campaign.

I didn't say there was a "member" present. I wrote "representative". You do realize there's a difference, right?

To answer your question anyway, the lawyer present has previously represented the FSB -- Russia's state security service. Source.

(21-07-2017 11:49 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Jeff Sessions...not a member of the Trump campaign.

Quote:Donald Trump’s senior policy adviser Stephen Miller is explaining the detailed role Sen. Jeff Sessions will play as chairman of Trump’s Foreign Policy Advisory Committee.
“The news that I’m here to tell you about tonight,” Miller said on The Kelly File, “is that Senator Sessions is the Chairman of his Foreign Policy Committee.

That story's from Breitbart, so you know it's not Fake News™. Drinking Beverage
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21-07-2017, 11:53 AM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 11:50 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 11:13 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Name ONE person that was a member of the Russian government that met with the Trump campaign.

I didn't say there was a "member" present. I wrote "representative". You do realize there's a difference, right?

To answer your question anyway, the lawyer present has previously represented the FSB -- Russia's state security service. Source: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-t...SKBN1A61LZ

And...Michael Steel WAS a British spy. So the DNC is guilty of the same thing. Which is NOTHING.

The DNC didn't directly meet with the British government to get dirt of Trump. Trump campaign didn't directly meet with the Russian government to get dirt on Hillary. The information PROBABLY came from those governments. I think we can all agree on that.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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21-07-2017, 11:58 AM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 11:50 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  That story's from Breitbart, so you know it's not Fake News™. Drinking Beverage

lol

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21-07-2017, 12:01 PM (This post was last modified: 21-07-2017 12:17 PM by SYZ.)
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 11:13 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Name ONE person that was a member of the Russian government that met with the Trump campaign.

Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya—who met Donald Trump Jr. after his father won the Republican nomination for the 2016 US presidential election—counted Russia's FSB security service among her clients for years, Russian court documents show. The Security Service of the Russian Federation is the principal security agency of the Russian government.

Next question please...

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21-07-2017, 12:07 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 11:53 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  And...Michael Steel WAS a British spy. So the DNC is guilty of the same thing. Which is NOTHING.

The DNC didn't directly meet with the British government to get dirt of Trump. Trump campaign didn't directly meet with the Russian government to get dirt on Hillary. The information PROBABLY came from those governments. I think we can all agree on that.

Wrong. First off, his name is Christopher Steel, not Michael. Secondly, Steel was retired -- meaning no longer in the employ of Her Majesty's government. Thirdly, Steel's efforts began with a commission from a Republican contender for the nomination. Fourthly, the DNC did nothing. Lastly, Steel got his information from his network of contacts, mostly Russian.

Don't let me stop you, though. You're obviously an expert on this matter.
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21-07-2017, 12:15 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 12:01 PM)SYZ Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 11:13 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Name ONE person that was a member of the Russian government that met with the Trump campaign.

Russian lawyer rNatalia Veselnitskaya—who met Donald Trump Jr. after his father won the Republican nomination for the 2016 US presidential election—counted Russia's FSB security service among her clients for years, Russian court documents show. The Security Service of the Russian Federation is the principal security agency of the Russian government.

Next question please...

Clients.

Say it again.

Clients.

The current nominee for FBI Director worked for a firm that represented an arm of the Russian government in a lawsuit or something.

Does that mean he is a "representative" of the Russian government as well?

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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21-07-2017, 12:22 PM (This post was last modified: 21-07-2017 12:26 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 12:01 PM)SYZ Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 11:13 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Name ONE person that was a member of the Russian government that met with the Trump campaign.

Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya—who met Donald Trump Jr. after his father won the Republican nomination for the 2016 US presidential election—counted Russia's FSB security service among her clients for years, Russian court documents show. The Security Service of the Russian Federation is the principal security agency of the Russian government.

Next question please...


In addition, the way SPYS and SPY networks/systems work, it not (obviously) going to be a "member of the government". It's all irrelevant. Trump is being played by the master-spys. Putin wants the sanctions off, and in return he'll keep quiet about all the corrupt loans Trump Inc. took from the Russians.

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21-07-2017, 12:34 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 10:56 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  There's a big difference between hiring a private citizen onto your payroll and meeting with representatives of a government that is trying to tamper with the election.

Yes, I agree there is a big different between those two things, but those are not the dynamics in play here.

Christopher Steel was not hired direct. He was hired via a company called Fusion-GPS. Incidentally, Fusion-GPS was also hired by Prevezon. If that name seems familiar to you, it should. Prevezon was the company represented by Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya, who met with Trump Jr., Kushner and Manafort. She was representing Prevezon in a money-laundering case and was allowed into the US by the Obama administration ostensibly to provide representation. Presumably, the Obama administration did not think she was a member of the Russian government at the time they granted her that visa. Fusion-GPS was hired to provide "ligation support" for Prevezon, although what they actually did is a mystery to at least me. And, just to make the whole thing weirder, after Trump took office his administration fired the AG who was running that case (Preet Bharara) and then settled the case very much to Prevezon's benefit. That's a part of this whole thing that gets overlooked.

But, I digress. Here's the point - it's not as simple as one hired a private citizen to do opposition research and one set up a meeting with a member of the Russian government. Fusion-GPS clearly has some ties to the Russians. What those ties are are not clear to me. But, Hillary's campaign can't just hire a firm like that and wash their hands of shady dealings and claim they didn't know. That's bullshit.

As a secondary point, it's not clear that Donnie Jr. knowingly took a meeting with representatives of the Russian government. He may be technically guilty of a crime here - I still think there are issues of law and fact to be settled before anyone can say that with any kind of certainty - but I think what he's really guilty of is being a spoiled little turd who is in his position solely due to accident of birth and if left to his own devices would be the night manager at a Wendy's. The phrase "you're out of your element, Donny!" spring to mind with Trump jr. even more so than with his old man. I think he's guilty of not being smart enough to spot the set up. And, it was a set up. All these Russians wanted was the repeal of the Magnitsky law. The whole adoption thing is directly correlated to that. And, what's really funny is that Trump reaffirmed the law recently whereas Clinton was never a fan (and during the campaign it didn't seem like Trump was either).

But, it's just not as clear cut as you are presenting it.

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21-07-2017, 12:41 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 12:15 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Clients.

Say it again.

Clients.

The current nominee for FBI Director worked for a firm that represented an arm of the Russian government in a lawsuit or something.

Does that mean he is a "representative" of the Russian government as well?

That's bullshit too. The allegation here is that the meeting was to provide opposition research on Clinton from representatives of the Russian government and in furtherance of their support of his dad's campaign. You can't take a meeting like that and claim "hey, they weren't actually government officials so I'm in the clear!". You're not.

That allegation is as of yet unproven, but given the ever changing narrative coming out of the Trump team on this, you can't reasonably take the position "no chance it's true". You want to say "it's not yet been proven" then I'm with you. But, there is a reason that the number of people in the conservative press willing to stick their necks out and completely deny this story is dwindling down to Sean Hannity, Alex Jones and that lunatic woman judge - basically the Three Stooges. No one who has any actual credibility, including the ultra conservative National Review - is willing to do that at this point. Because they have no idea what the truth is and they recognize that it's possible junior is really that stupid.

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21-07-2017, 12:42 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 12:15 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 12:01 PM)SYZ Wrote:  Russian lawyer rNatalia Veselnitskaya—who met Donald Trump Jr. after his father won the Republican nomination for the 2016 US presidential election—counted Russia's FSB security service among her clients for years, Russian court documents show. The Security Service of the Russian Federation is the principal security agency of the Russian government.

Next question please...

Clients.

Say it again.

Clients.

The current nominee for FBI Director worked for a firm that represented an arm of the Russian government in a lawsuit or something.

Does that mean he is a "representative" of the Russian government as well?

He could be. Depends on what he's up to, and why he's attending specific meetings. Did HE himself do any work for them ? Big law firms have hundreds of people doing thousands of things. But nice try there sporto, at yet another false analogy.

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