Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
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21-07-2017, 08:11 PM (This post was last modified: 21-07-2017 08:18 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 07:56 PM)BnW Wrote:  First, like him or not, Trump is a legally elected President. There is something wrong when the intelligence community can start releasing bits and pieces of classified information to undermine a presidency.

You presume to know their motives? Let me restate. You presume to know their motives. They are privy to far more sensitive information than you and if they are willing to risk treason and imprisonment and complete and total ruin to release it, I think I might want to pay attention to it. They seem to feel strongly I should.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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21-07-2017, 08:27 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 07:56 PM)BnW Wrote:  There is something wrong when the intelligence community can start releasing bits and pieces of classified information to undermine a presidency.

You automatically assume the leaks are from US persons.

That may not be the case at all. Many other intelligence services in the world don't fancy Trump or the Russians.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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21-07-2017, 08:35 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 08:11 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  You presume to know their motives? Let me restate. You presume to know their motives. They are privy to far more sensitive information than you and if they are willing to risk treason and imprisonment and complete and total ruin to release it, I think I might want to pay attention to it. They seem to feel strongly I should.

I don't presume to know their motives. I'm telling you what makes sense to me. I think it's far more likely they are preserving their position than for love of country. But, you are correct that I don't actually know. Neither do you, though, and your "patriots" comment also assumes a motive.

And, Dom is correct that we don't know exactly who is leaking. It's possible it's not US intelligence, although I'd be shocked if it wasn't.

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21-07-2017, 08:47 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
Has anyone read Nancy MacLean's new book Democracy in Chains The Deep History of the Radical Right's Stealth Plan for America yet? I'm curious to know if MacLean really had access to James Buchanan's private papers as source material.

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21-07-2017, 09:33 PM (This post was last modified: 21-07-2017 10:01 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 08:35 PM)BnW Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 08:11 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  You presume to know their motives? Let me restate. You presume to know their motives. They are privy to far more sensitive information than you and if they are willing to risk treason and imprisonment and complete and total ruin to release it, I think I might want to pay attention to it. They seem to feel strongly I should.

I don't presume to know their motives. I'm telling you what makes sense to me. I think it's far more likely they are preserving their position than for love of country. But, you are correct that I don't actually know. Neither do you, though, and your "patriots" comment also assumes a motive.

True, but as a 35 year civil servant, with 35 years of mandatory annual OPSEC training and full cognizance of the seriousness of the consequences of their actions, I would contend that my opinion is better informed than yours. ... And you did presume to know their motives.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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21-07-2017, 09:49 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 10:36 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 10:34 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  The hell we won't. The Trump team are the "sources".

Fake sources. Fake stories. Fake news.

They can't name sources because they don't exist.

Do you know anything about journalism? Were you even born when Watergate broke. Do you know how sources work in journalism?

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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21-07-2017, 09:57 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
Not that this is pertinent to the discussion at hand (perhaps it is), but is it not ironic that the biggest "leaker" (Snowden) in recent history found the safest refuge in what country? Consider

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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21-07-2017, 10:03 PM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 08:35 PM)BnW Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 08:11 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  You presume to know their motives? Let me restate. You presume to know their motives. They are privy to far more sensitive information than you and if they are willing to risk treason and imprisonment and complete and total ruin to release it, I think I might want to pay attention to it. They seem to feel strongly I should.

I don't presume to know their motives. I'm telling you what makes sense to me. I think it's far more likely they are preserving their position than for love of country. But, you are correct that I don't actually know. Neither do you, though, and your "patriots" comment also assumes a motive.

And, Dom is correct that we don't know exactly who is leaking. It's possible it's not US intelligence, although I'd be shocked if it wasn't.

There's far too much coming from someone who knows exactly what is going on in the White House, on a daily basis to be the Intelligence services. Why would the intelligence services have operatives in the White House ? Far more probable that is a Republican "never trump" person who wants him brought down, and out of the party he hijacked.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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22-07-2017, 05:14 AM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 10:03 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 08:35 PM)BnW Wrote:  I don't presume to know their motives. I'm telling you what makes sense to me. I think it's far more likely they are preserving their position than for love of country. But, you are correct that I don't actually know. Neither do you, though, and your "patriots" comment also assumes a motive.

And, Dom is correct that we don't know exactly who is leaking. It's possible it's not US intelligence, although I'd be shocked if it wasn't.

There's far too much coming from someone who knows exactly what is going on in the White House, on a daily basis to be the Intelligence services. Why would the intelligence services have operatives in the White House ? Far more probable that is a Republican "never trump" person who wants him brought down, and out of the party he hijacked.

There's a hypothesis out there this morning that says Trump himself is responsible for this new Sessions leak. According to the theory, Trump leaked it himself so he'd have an excuse to fire Sessions. That would let him install a new properly compliant AG who would then fire Mueller before he can dig up the important stuff on Trump.

I can't help but think that even if true it wouldn't bother our Lord Dark Toilet one bit...

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22-07-2017, 06:46 AM
RE: Did the Trump family commit Treason?!?!
(21-07-2017 08:27 PM)Dom Wrote:  
(21-07-2017 07:56 PM)BnW Wrote:  There is something wrong when the intelligence community can start releasing bits and pieces of classified information to undermine a presidency.

You automatically assume the leaks are from US persons.

That may not be the case at all. Many other intelligence services in the world don't fancy Trump or the Russians.

The thought occurs to me that the Russians may well be doing the leaking because they're unhappy with Trump's policy re: Syria.
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