Do any lives matter?
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09-09-2015, 05:24 PM
RE: Do any lives matter?
(09-09-2015 02:06 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  I think BLM serves a useful purpose in reminding whites that we have crated a system which seriously and at times violently oppresses minorities.

I'm not familiar with the BLM group, but I would suppose this is the point: to raise awareness among whites about how differently minorities are treated.

(09-09-2015 02:06 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  You know, I've never been pulled over for having a broken tail light. I did, a year or so ago, have a cop pull up next to me and wave. When I rolled my window down he said, pleasantly: "Both of your brake lights are out." I thanked him. This was accomplished without gun play.

Several times since I have had occasion to wonder how that would have played out were I black or, since I'm in Arizona, Mexican?

I have a similar story:

A couple of decades ago, when I lived in North Dakota, I was involved in nonviolent civil disobedience, protesting nuclear weapons, which are the principal face of militarism in that state with (at that time) 300 minuteman III missiles and two nuclear bomber wings. On various occasions I was arrested. I was always treated politely and courteously by the police, never handcuffed behind my back, and sometimes not handcuffed at all when being arrested. Only when arrested by the Air Force was I ever cuffed behind my back.

At the time I was working at a homeless shelter. The shelter had a rule that nobody could come in drunk. A homeless man who was American Indian and an alcoholic, who was never threatening or violent in the least, and who was well known to the police as a frequent inmate at detox and for being always peaceful and gentle, came to the shelter. Knowing he could not come in drunk, he just asked for a ride to detox. I was the only staff at the shelter so I could not leave to give him a ride, so he asked me to call the cops, who will take people to detox if asked. When the cop arrived I looked outside and saw the cop handcuff this guy behind his back, which, for those who do not know, is painful. I went outside and said to the cop, "You know [name], you know he's completely peaceful. He's caused no trouble, he just asked for a ride to detox. You really don't need to handcuff him, and certainly not behind his back." Especially since in the back seat of the cop car he'd be separated from the cop. The cop replied that he knew the fellow was no threat, but said that their rules require that he be cuffed, behind his back, before being placed in the car.

Note that the same rule existed for me, but I'm white, so they overlooked it. But for an Indian they can fall back on their "rule."

Different treatment for different races.

Do lives matter? It depends on what you mean by "matter." To the inanimate universe, nothing matters. But my life matters to me. The lives of the people I love matter to me. The life of my cat mattered to me. I could go on and say that all lives matter to me, but the truth is that I would (if I could get away with it) sacrifice the lives of ten people I don't know to save the life of someone close to me.

But in a just and humane society, we should base our laws, our justice system, our institutions, on the principle that all lives matter. Because even though the lives of people I don't know don't really matter to me as much as the lives of the people close to me, a society that treats all people with respect and values the lives of all its members will be a better place to live than one that does not.

It's in that context that all lives matter, even though we'll all be dead in 100 years, and forgotten soon after, and once the sun goes nova and the Earth is sterilized or incinerated, nothing that happened on it, including our lives, will matter.

"El mar se mide por olas,
el cielo por alas,
nosotros por lágrimas."
-- Jaime Sabines
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09-09-2015, 06:09 PM
RE: Do any lives matter?
(09-09-2015 05:24 PM)daniel1948 Wrote:  ... once the sun goes nova and the Earth is sterilized or incinerated, nothing that happened on it, including our lives, will matter ...

Except that we've already sent every episode of "I Love Lucy" reverberating throughout the universe so that it will endure eons past the minor life of our own sun, and, who knows, perhaps some intelligence elsewhere in time and space might find it amusing or even base a civilization on it. The matter of "not mattering" matters in ways we haven't imagined.

Tongue
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09-09-2015, 06:20 PM (This post was last modified: 09-09-2015 06:25 PM by cactus.)
RE: Do any lives matter?
To me personally, all lives matter

...except cockroaches. Fuck cockroaches. and spiders. Fuck them, too.
and human fetuses.; abort all the fetuses. ALL of them.... wait, what were we talking about again?

If we came from dust, then why is there still dust?
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09-09-2015, 06:28 PM
RE: Do any lives matter?
[Image: pRghoNU.jpg]

Excuse me, I'm making perfect sense. You're just not keeping up.

"Let me give you some advice, bastard: never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you." - Tyrion Lannister
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09-09-2015, 07:49 PM
RE: Do any lives matter?
The way I see it, no lives have meaning, but the only way that society can make sense is to agree that life is somewhat sacred (if I'm allowed to use that word). Well, at least human life that is. I often wonder how to reconcile the fact that humans are overdeveloped apes(basically animals), and yet we don't treat animals with the same respect for life as humans. Raising animals for slaughter, for example.

On the topic of BLM, I can see why they protest. Hopefully our justice system will convict cops if they're in the wrong. Education is the key to ending racism I think. Better education for inner city kids, and educating white people not to be so freaking prejudiced. Is racism such a problem in other western democracies?

A man should not believe in an ism, he should believe in himself. -Ferris Bueller

That's what a ship is, you know. It's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs but what a ship is... what the Black Pearl really is... is freedom. -Jack Sparrow
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10-09-2015, 01:09 AM
RE: Do any lives matter?
Our life may matter to family and/or those who are close to us. Other than that I doubt anyone cares and I see no problem with it.

As for purpose I try to expand my knowledge and live a good life; I need nothing more. I'm not brainwashed into thinking that this life is some prelude to heavenly existence so I try to get best of it.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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10-09-2015, 05:47 AM
RE: Do any lives matter?
The problem with a group demanding "equality" -- is that by recognizing the division and differences between any groups (real or imagined) you only give more ammo to the people who like the idea of division and wish to keep such divisions.

It's a Catch 22 situation.

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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10-09-2015, 08:35 AM
RE: Do any lives matter?
(09-09-2015 06:09 PM)Airportkid Wrote:  
(09-09-2015 05:24 PM)daniel1948 Wrote:  ... once the sun goes nova and the Earth is sterilized or incinerated, nothing that happened on it, including our lives, will matter ...

Except that we've already sent every episode of "I Love Lucy" reverberating throughout the universe so that it will endure eons past the minor life of our own sun, and, who knows, perhaps some intelligence elsewhere in time and space might find it amusing or even base a civilization on it. The matter of "not mattering" matters in ways we haven't imagined.

Tongue

One of the greatest sci-fi movies ever: Galaxy Quest.

But with luck, the inverse square law will prevent anybody out there from ever noticing our TV transmissions.

(09-09-2015 07:49 PM)Imathinker Wrote:  I often wonder how to reconcile the fact that humans are overdeveloped apes(basically animals), and yet we don't treat animals with the same respect for life as humans. Raising animals for slaughter, for example.

We ARE animals. You can leave out the word "basically."

But the fact is that we do treat each other as badly as we treat all the other animals. We kill animals for food and leather after raising them in the most cruel conditions imaginable. We drop fire bombs and fragmentation bombs on the cities and villages of countries with whom we have disagreements. And we walk right by homeless people on the streets of our own cities as if they were stray dogs.

"El mar se mide por olas,
el cielo por alas,
nosotros por lágrimas."
-- Jaime Sabines
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10-09-2015, 08:55 AM
RE: Do any lives matter?
I absolutely think lives matter.

Life is such a rare and precious thing. Something we are very lucky to experience.
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10-09-2015, 11:22 AM
RE: Do any lives matter?
(10-09-2015 05:47 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  The problem with a group demanding "equality" -- is that by recognizing the division and differences between any groups (real or imagined) you only give more ammo to the people who like the idea of division and wish to keep such divisions.

It's a Catch 22 situation.

Great fucking point!
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