Do law courts favour bikers?
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08-05-2017, 02:01 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(07-05-2017 09:04 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Wait wait wait, let me get this straight (because I used to ride motorbikes). A bus came around a blind corner, it was obviously too big for the corner so had to cross the center line to make the corner, and you on a motorbike started going around that corner and hit the bus (because it was on the wrong side of the road) and it's your fault because, as a biker, you didn't "go onto the sidewalk"...

Like.. what the fuck... the bus crossed the centerline, instantly it's the bus's fault...
It's like reversing if you're reversing and you hit someone it's 99% of the time your fault.

earmuff,

Yes, even the police sketch plan had the bus well over the centre line to my side, right on the apex of the bend. I also had an independent witness (a retired engineer) to the bus position after the accident. He said it was definitely on my side of the road.

There is some good news. The police report had me as at fault, but this judge's ruling says "no fault" on me. A small crumb of comfort for future insurance premiums.

Appeal? I can't. The case was funded by motor insurance and I don't have the money for an appeal, or the guts for it, to be honest. Just too tired now. Confused

Thanks for the replies everyone.

D.
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08-05-2017, 03:32 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(07-05-2017 04:39 AM)adey67 Wrote:  In Britain the law favours the cyclist and you can be a complete asshat on the road and totally get away with it.
Don't get me wrong I'm fine with cyclists so long as they ride single file and stop with the superior attitude that many of them have, they should remember its the drivers of motorised vehicles that pay for the roads they ride on.

Citation please?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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08-05-2017, 03:37 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 03:32 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(07-05-2017 04:39 AM)adey67 Wrote:  In Britain the law favours the cyclist and you can be a complete asshat on the road and totally get away with it.
Don't get me wrong I'm fine with cyclists so long as they ride single file and stop with the superior attitude that many of them have, they should remember its the drivers of motorised vehicles that pay for the roads they ride on.

Citation please?

In Britain we have this thing called road tax an annual fee for all motorised vehicles except electric ones that pays for the upkeep of roads. Cyclists do not pay any such tax.
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08-05-2017, 05:31 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 03:37 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(08-05-2017 03:32 AM)morondog Wrote:  Citation please?

In Britain we have this thing called road tax an annual fee for all motorised vehicles except electric ones that pays for the upkeep of roads. Cyclists do not pay any such tax.
Technically no. While you're correct that cyclists don't pay car tax, the proceeds go into general taxation and is not ringfenced for roads. So, everyone who pays income tax (and/or council tax) pays in part for the roads.

My county have spent a great deal of money in recent years expanding footpaths into joint footpaths/cycleways due to the narrow country roads and relative high speeds - mostly nsl of 60, yet nearly all cyclists round here continue to use the roads. That pisses me off, since they are there for safety reasons, and the money could have been spent elsewhere.
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08-05-2017, 05:43 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 03:37 AM)adey67 Wrote:  In Britain we have this thing called road tax an annual fee for all motorised vehicles except electric ones that pays for the upkeep of roads. Cyclists do not pay any such tax.

Every consumer in the UK contributes to road upkeep whether or not they pay a specific road tax. Pretty much everything bought and sold spent part of its life cycle in the back of a lorry subject to a heavy use tax. I think you call these taxes HGV's over there. HGV's are ultimately paid by the end consumer.

Save a life. Adopt a greyhound.

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08-05-2017, 06:42 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 05:31 AM)ukatheist Wrote:  
(08-05-2017 03:37 AM)adey67 Wrote:  In Britain we have this thing called road tax an annual fee for all motorised vehicles except electric ones that pays for the upkeep of roads. Cyclists do not pay any such tax.
Technically no. While you're correct that cyclists don't pay car tax, the proceeds go into general taxation and is not ringfenced for roads. So, everyone who pays income tax (and/or council tax) pays in part for the roads.

My county have spent a great deal of money in recent years expanding footpaths into joint footpaths/cycleways due to the narrow country roads and relative high speeds - mostly nsl of 60, yet nearly all cyclists round here continue to use the roads. That pisses me off, since they are there for safety reasons, and the money could have been spent elsewhere.

Omfg its not ring-fenced? Angry that totally sucks I always thought it was, no wonder our roads are so shitty, bastard politicians!!!!
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08-05-2017, 07:09 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 06:42 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Omfg its not ring-fenced? Angry that totally sucks I always thought it was, no wonder our roads are so shitty, bastard politicians!!!!

I thought the road tax was more of an effort to get people not to own their own vehicles (and thus reduce emissions and all those good things) than a way of paying for the roads... Anyway apart from that your roads are ridiculously narrow, otherwise you've got a very decent road infrastructure. Which belongs to everyone, cyclists and motorists alike Smile Isn't democracy fun Tongue

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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08-05-2017, 07:24 AM (This post was last modified: 08-05-2017 07:27 AM by adey67.)
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 07:09 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(08-05-2017 06:42 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Omfg its not ring-fenced? Angry that totally sucks I always thought it was, no wonder our roads are so shitty, bastard politicians!!!!

I thought the road tax was more of an effort to get people not to own their own vehicles (and thus reduce emissions and all those good things) than a way of paying for the roads... Anyway apart from that your roads are ridiculously narrow, otherwise you've got a very decent road infrastructure. Which belongs to everyone, cyclists and motorists alike Smile Isn't democracy fun Tongue

Road tax has been around for about 80+ years so way before environment issues reared their head, but you do get huge discounts for small engine size and exemption for some eco friendly vehicles which are recent innovations. I'm really pissed off now, I've got to find another excuse for hating on cyclists. Tongue
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08-05-2017, 07:32 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 03:37 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(08-05-2017 03:32 AM)morondog Wrote:  Citation please?

In Britain we have this thing called road tax an annual fee for all motorised vehicles except electric ones that pays for the upkeep of roads. Cyclists do not pay any such tax.

I've encountered that same argument here in the US, but it's wrong for at least two reasons:

1. At least here in the US, there is no such thing as a "road use" tax. There are vehicle registration and gasoline taxes, and some of that money is used for road maintenance, but taxes in general are not earmarked for any specific use. In any event, the roads are public, and any legal vehicle (including a bicycle) is allowed to use them, independent of any taxes paid. Note that property taxes here are used primarily to fund public schools, and I pay property tax (indirectly, as part of my rent) just like everyone else, even though I don't go to school and don't have any children. And I don't have a problem with that.

2. The majority of bicyclists here also own and drive cars, so they pay those taxes anyway. But even in a case like mine (I do not own a car -- the bike is my only vehicle), the question of which taxes I do and don't pay is really a red herring. The roads are public. See the property tax example in #1.
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08-05-2017, 08:09 AM
RE: Do law courts favour bikers?
(08-05-2017 07:24 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(08-05-2017 07:09 AM)morondog Wrote:  I thought the road tax was more of an effort to get people not to own their own vehicles (and thus reduce emissions and all those good things) than a way of paying for the roads... Anyway apart from that your roads are ridiculously narrow, otherwise you've got a very decent road infrastructure. Which belongs to everyone, cyclists and motorists alike Smile Isn't democracy fun Tongue

Road tax has been around for about 80+ years so way before environment issues reared their head, but you do get huge discounts for small engine size and exemption for some eco friendly vehicles which are recent innovations. I'm really pissed off now, I've got to find another excuse for hating on cyclists. Tongue

Here's another tidbit that may or may not be relevant in the UK, but it certainly is here in the US: Bicycling was popular here long before driving was, and roads in the US were originally paved due to lobbying by the League of American Wheelmen (an organization of cyclists). And military needs were a primary impetus for the development of our interstate freeway system. Automobile drivers like to think that everything exists for them, but it just ain't so.

Also, if every cyclist drove a car instead, the roads would be more congested, not less. Cars take up a lot more room on the road than bicycles do. I am actually doing the drivers a favor by cycle-commuting.

Big Grin
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