Do or Die
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27-09-2016, 02:32 PM
RE: Do or Die
(27-09-2016 01:40 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 12:58 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  Huh

Why would they be expected to, (either there or here) if they're not the ones who made the mess?

Their silence gives tacit approval to the fundamentalists.

Even if the fundamentalists would kill them if they weren't silent? Maybe their silence is just evidence of their desire to stay alive. Dissent of any kind is not safe in some Islamic nations. Maybe they just want to get the hell out of there and start over somewhere where things aren't so crazy -- like here. I don't see that as tacit approval of anything. They're just escaping a bad situation.
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27-09-2016, 02:54 PM
RE: Do or Die
(27-09-2016 12:53 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 11:21 AM)tomilay Wrote:  How exactly is a person fleeing from assorted gangs of killers, not to mention Russian, US and allied bombs supposed to "clean his house"?

I don't expect them to - they've already failed.

Once refugees are settled in a new country, they can try again to clean house. How many do?

I guess you could say the Jews fleeing Germany in the 30s and 40s had failed to fix the mess in Germany. A technically correct if unusual way of looking at it.

I think once they have settled in a new country, they should try and get back on their feet in the new country. Open a new chapter in their lives.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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27-09-2016, 03:20 PM
RE: Do or Die
(27-09-2016 12:53 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 11:21 AM)tomilay Wrote:  How exactly is a person fleeing from assorted gangs of killers, not to mention Russian, US and allied bombs supposed to "clean his house"?

I don't expect them to - they've already failed.

Once refugees are settled in a new country, they can try again to clean house. How many do?

Go find a few and ask them personally.

Don't let those gnomes and their illusions get you down. They're just gnomes and illusions.

--Jake the Dog, Adventure Time

Alouette, je te plumerai.
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27-09-2016, 03:59 PM
RE: Do or Die
(24-09-2016 10:04 AM)The Dark One Wrote:  But
Whenever you have a "BUT" all the stuff preceding it becomes irrelevant.
(24-09-2016 10:04 AM)The Dark One Wrote:  I am finding that I walk on eggshells around here, I can't be myself, because every time I do you guys go after me like rabid dogs.
Yeah, I don't see the need to walk on eggshells. Just get involved, speak your mind, express your ideas even if they aren't the popular view.
Sometimes my views conform to others, sometimes they diverge. But I'm not afraid to present my ideas even if they are ridiculed or seen as crazy fringe stuff. I think you learn by getting out there and discussing ideas, and above all LISTENING to people's feedback.
Sure it can get frustrating when people jump on you, get all upity and start slinging mud at at you. Some people are like that. For me it is a challenge to try to not get stuck into these slinging matches, and also try to not get angry at these people, to not hold grudges. For me I think this is valuable learnings from internet forums. How to deal with this stuff. I'm still struggling in this area, but I am trying to learn too. I think I will come out the other end better than when I went in. So I think it is invaluable to get involved rather than be meek and to not say things so that you can avoid these situations and these people.
Try and observe how others handle it when they are attacked. Some people are good and not getting into the fights and being able to progress the conversation. Some people just fight back and some people retract and avoid. In the LSI world the avoidance are seen as Green, the attackers are seen as Red, those that are able to progress are seen as Blue. Blue is my goal. I think mostly we see Red because they are more vocal and the arguments go on and on where as the greens either avoid the conversation altogether or quickly jump out of the thread. Anyway, for me it is trying to be blue and trying to observe others whom I think are blue.
(24-09-2016 10:04 AM)The Dark One Wrote:  So here goes.

One of my many problems with the Liberal view is the massive programs to help people
I would consider myself "liberal", although I'm not entirely sure what that label means.
I am happy for people to make their own choices, to lead their own lives. I don't want government being big brother.
But what I think you are describing is not "liberal" but is instead "socialist", left wing stuff. I'm not a fan of socialist policies. I do think that giving out hand outs creates dependencies and implementing "affirmative action" also creates lazy people and dependencies and also resentment and racism etc.
I want equal opportunity rather than equality. I want people to be optimists where they are in control of their own destiny e.g. they put in the effort and they can then get rewards for that, rather than pessimists where it doesn't matter what they do, their destiny is not in their hands.
As a liberal, I want people to be in the drivers seat of their own destiny, I don't want them to expect handouts, to expect government enforced special privileges based on ethnicity or gender. I want them not to expect anything and instead realise that they need to make an effort. My "liberalness" is at odds with "socialism".
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27-09-2016, 04:29 PM
RE: Do or Die
Quote:But what I think you are describing is not "liberal" but is instead "socialist", left wing stuff. I'm not a fan of socialist policies. I do think that giving out hand outs creates dependencies and implementing "affirmative action" also creates lazy people and dependencies and also resentment and racism etc.
I want equal opportunity rather than equality. I want people to be optimists where they are in control of their own destiny e.g. they put in the effort and they can then get rewards for that, rather than pessimists where it doesn't matter what they do, their destiny is not in their hands.
As a liberal, I want people to be in the drivers seat of their own destiny, I don't want them to expect handouts, to expect government enforced special privileges based on ethnicity or gender. I want them not to expect anything and instead realise that they need to make an effort. My "liberalness" is at odds with "socialism".

I agree with all of this- and in the rest of the world, I would be much closer to liberal than conservative. But in the US, the line between socialism and liberalism has been blurred. I DESPISE socialists.
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27-09-2016, 06:44 PM
RE: Do or Die
Agreed SYZ i call bullshit

Because his posts sure as shit don't show he has any knowledge short of stereotypes and articles from bullshit Islamophobe sites like jihad watch. in fact most of his posts look like a standard" my war story tactics" used on Stormfront (i love trolling Nazi's).The tactic generally goes you take the group your hating on and invent a war story telling all about how evil and uncivilized they are. Because "i fought them" or "i fought along side them"it tends to very from Vietnamese or Koreans or African or Japanese s or even Eastern Europeans. And tends to be an attack of some kind a raised village or battleship or an armored convoy etc and can go from simple "my tank got blown up by those slant eyed .." to those Ni&&ers shot at our convoy" to elaborate like red cross nurses being raped etc.Then it tens to shift to victim blaming ,a call for isolationism and a anti immigrant message. This is also used occasional by homophobes to bash gays in the military .It generally comes with a horror story of rape or sexual molestation by one or more gay military personnel and then generally comes with a "gays are dangerous ploy". i have seen this used so many times my cynicism is high

Same goes for his "i have degrees tactic" this shit is often shoveled by creationists and woo merchants to give themselves an air authority that doesn't translate when you talk to them. i like to call this Hovid effect

Also goes for his "my experience "argument or as i like to call it the Lee Stroble effect it tends to sound like this"i know all about how atheists think they just want to sin see i know because i have experience etc"
so yeah tickle me Skeptical

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27-09-2016, 07:24 PM
RE: Do or Die
(27-09-2016 06:44 PM)OrdoSkeptica Wrote:  Agreed SYZ i call bullshit

Because his posts sure as shit don't show he has any knowledge short of stereotypes and articles from bullshit Islamophobe sites like jihad watch. in fact most of his posts look like a standard" my war story tactics" used on Stormfront (i love trolling Nazi's).The tactic generally goes you take the group your hating on and invent a war story telling all about how evil and uncivilized they are. Because "i fought them" or "i fought along side them"it tends to very from Vietnamese or Koreans or African or Japanese s or even Eastern Europeans. And tends to be an attack of some kind a raised village or battleship or an armored convoy etc and can go from simple "my tank got blown up by those slant eyed .." to those Ni&&ers shot at our convoy" to elaborate like red cross nurses being raped etc.Then it tens to shift to victim blaming ,a call for isolationism and a anti immigrant message. This is also used occasional by homophobes to bash gays in the military .It generally comes with a horror story of rape or sexual molestation by one or more gay military personnel and then generally comes with a "gays are dangerous ploy". i have seen this used so many times my cynicism is high

Same goes for his "i have degrees tactic" this shit is often shoveled by creationists and woo merchants to give themselves an air authority that doesn't translate when you talk to them. i like to call this Hovid effect

Also goes for his "my experience "argument or as i like to call it the Lee Stroble effect it tends to sound like this"i know all about how atheists think they just want to sin see i know because i have experience etc"
so yeah tickle me Skeptical

I have to admit I find it unusual for a well traveled person to harbor such tribal attitudes. Most of the time travel opens your eyes rather reinforce a prejudice or stereotype. The exact opposite of what happened to the Dark One. But there are always exceptions.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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27-09-2016, 11:34 PM
RE: Do or Die
Quote:Also goes for his "my experience "argument or as i like to call it the Lee Stroble effect it tends to sound like this"i know all about how atheists think they just want to sin see i know because i have experience etc"
so yeah tickle me Skeptical


You're just incapable of admitting you may not know everything, aren't you? The arrogance is obviously compensation for something, I'm curious what that might be. The way you refuse to accept that someone may simply have come to a different conclusion based on different life experience is also telling...as is the way you want to discredit me in some fashion. My guess is that life hasn't turned out quite the way you wanted it to, and that you use situations like this, where you can retain your anonymity and create and become a more appealing persona, to counter feelings of inadequacy.

The only people who don't recognize the value of life experience are people who don't have any. One day, perhaps you'll gain some perspective and pull your head out of your ass, although I rather doubt it.

Why you seem to believe I have some deep need to impress people who I don't know and who have no idea who I am is puzzling. What good would it do me to tell you I drive F1 cars for a living if you have no idea who I am...? What could a person gain from something like that?

This is the arrogance that I'm talking about- you, and to a lesser degree, tomilay, find it incomprehensible that I could have had experiences in my life that make me feel less than charitable towards a people who have not had peace in their culture, for any length of time, in millennia...Your own life experiences have been so limited or so sheltered that you are incredibly naive about these people, yet you chalk it up completely to my prejudice and bigotry- completely disregarding world events, the experiences in my life, the experiences of others who have spent time in the region, and even of members of this culture who frequently speak out against its harshness, its xenophobia, its religious fanaticism. Everyone has to be making all of this stuff up, because you know those lovely people are big hearted and kind, right? Because...Hillary told you so? I don't know where you get your information- I only know where you do NOT get it.

I have traveled extensively all of my life. From growing up in a military family, to my own military career and my own civilian career, to a pure love of travel, for travel's sake. I love other cultures, I speak 3 languages fluently, and a half dozen more to various degrees. I immerse myself in other cultures, I don't stay in the hotel or at the secluded resort and pretend I have visited a foreign land by collecting postcards from the airport gift shop. Everyone in my life knows this about me- they also know that I am extremely fair in my opinions about others, and even though I have held positions of authority, I have never abused those positions.

I had a reputation all through school for defending the underdog- I was in dozens of fights in elementary school thru high school- I only remember one that had to do with me, the rest were in defense of someone I felt was being mistreated. That's just my nature, and always has been- I'm sure it's why I gravitated towards the military and law enforcement.

My kids are all grown, but they'll tell you this as well...I once spent a night in jail while my wife and 3 kids and I were on vacation in Florida at Disney world. I saw a man punch his wife in a restaurant, and I beat him unconscious. I sat in jail until it was all sorted out- I was vindicated in the end. I would do it again. I can't NOT do it.

When you accuse me of hating a race or group of people unfairly, without cause, it's ludicrous. I have to have a great deal of evidence before I can hate anyone- it goes against everything I believe in to condemn a person or people unjustly.

But you can't seem to believe that I have seen and experienced anything that would make me unwilling to risk innocent lives blindly, when it comes to this segment of a society that has not managed to maintain peace in its own backyard...well, in a very, very, very long time. Why haven't they had peace? Do you remember the answer to that question? It isn't a matter of opinion...it isn't a vague notion...it is not a conservative trick. The middle east has been almost constantly at war because of religious intolerance. Period. My God is better than your God, essentially.

Yes, they seem like an enlightened people, what was I thinking? They not only fanatically believe in nonexistent omnipotent beings, but they believe those beings want them to hate and destroy their neighbors whose omnipotent imaginary beings told them to hate the other guys! Oh, I take it all back, these people are brilliant, loving, caring folks who only want to raise their children in peace and play shuffleboard down at the rec center on Wednesday afternoons. Obviously! How could I have been so blind?

Oh, and I guess there is a secondary cause of war and revolution in the middle east...horrific human rights violations by various evil dictators. Only a coincidence, I'm certain.

Do you dispute any of this, by any chance? I'm only curious.

Quote:Casualties breakdown

Unification of Saudi Arabia (combined casualties 7,989–8,989+)

Battle of Riyadh (1902) – 37 killed.
Battle of Dilam (1903) – 410 killed.
Saudi–Rashidi War (1903–1907) – 2,300+ killed.
Annexation of Al-Hasa and Qatif (1913) – unknown.
Battle of Jarrab (1915) – unknown.
Battle of Kanzaan (1915) – unknown.
First Nejd-Hejaz War 1918–1919 – 1,392 killed[12]
Kuwait-Najd Border War (1921) – 200[12]–800 killed.
1921 Ikhwan raid on Iraq – 700 killed.
Conquest of Ha'il – unknown.
Ikhwan raids on Transjordan 1922–1924 – 500[73]-1,500 killed.
Second Nejd-Hejaz War (1924–1925) – 450 killed.[12]
Ikhwan Revolt (1927–1930) – 2,000 killed.[12]

Turkish War of Independence (combined figure 170,500–873,000+):

Greco-Turkish War – 70,000[citation needed]–400,000 casualties[36][verification needed]
Franco-Turkish War – 40,000 casualties.[citation needed]
Turkish–Armenian War – 60,000–432,500 casualties.[74]
Koçkiri Rebellion – 500 killed.[citation needed]
Revolt of Ahmet Anzavur – unknown.
Kuva-i Inzibatiye revolt – unknown.

Iraqi–Kurdish conflict (combined casualty figure 138,800-320,100) of:

Mahmud Barzanji revolts – unknown.
Ahmad Barzanji revolt (1931) – unknown.
1943 Iraqi Kurdish revolt (1943) – unknown.
First Kurdish-Iraqi War (1961–1970) – 75,000–105,000 killed.[28][36]
Second Kurdish-Iraqi War (1974–1975) – 9,000 killed.[75]
PUK insurgency (1976–1978) – 800 killed.
Iraqi Kurdish uprising (1982–1988) – 50,000–198,000 killed.
1991 Uprising in As Sulaymaniyah – 700–2,000 killed.
Iraqi Kurdish Civil War (1994–1997) – 3,000[76]–5,000 killed.
2003 invasion of Iraq – several hundred killed (~300) on the Kurdish front, at least 24 Peshmerga killed.

World War II (combined casualty figure 12,338-14,898+) of:

Anglo-Iraqi War – at least 560 killed.[77][78]
Farhud 175–780 killed.
Syria–Lebanon Campaign 10,404–12,964 killed.
Anglo-Soviet invasion of Iran 100[12] – 1,062 killed.
Bombing of Palestine in World War II 137 deaths.[79]
Bombing of Bahrain in World War II – unknown.

Iran crisis of 1946 (combined casualty figure 1,921+):

Azerbaijan People's Republic crisis – 421 killed.[80]
Republic of Mahabad crisis – ~1,000 killed.[citation needed]
Civil interregnum – 500 killed.[81]

Arab–Israeli conflict (combined casualty figure 76,338–87,338+):

Israeli–Palestinian conflict (1948–present) – 23,000 killed

Fedayeen insurgency and Retribution Operations (1950s) – 3,456 casualties
Palestinian insurgency in South Lebanon - 2,600-20,000 killed
First Intifada – 2,000 killed
Second Intifada – 7,000 killed
Gaza–Israel conflict – 3,500+ killed

Arab–Israeli War (1948–1949) – 14,400 casualties.
Suez War (1956) – 3,203 killed.
Six-Day War (1967) – 13,976 killed.
War of Attrition (1967–1970) – 6,403 killed.
[Yom Kippur War (1973) 10,000–21,000.[82]
Second Lebanon War – 1,900 killed.

North Yemen Civil War (combined 100,000–200,000 casualties):

1962 Coup d'état
Ramadan offensive
Haradh offensive
1965 Royalist offensive
Siege of Sana'a (1967)

Lebanese Civil War (combined 39,132–43,970+ mortal casualties):

Bus massacre – 27 killed.
Hundred Days' War – 160 killed.
Karantina massacre – 1,000–1,500 killed.
Damour massacre – 684 killed.
Battle of the Hotels – 700 killed.
Black Saturday (Lebanon) – 200–600 killed.
Tel al-Zaatar massacre – 1,778–3,278 killed.
1982 Lebanon War – 28,280 killed.
Sabra and Shatila massacre – 762–3,500 killed.
War of the Camps (1986–1987) – 3,781 killed.
Mountain War – 1,600 killed.
War of Liberation (1989–1990) – unknown.
October 13 massacre – 500–700 killed, 260 civilians massacred.

Consolidation of the Iranian Revolution (combined fatalities count 12,000):

1979 Kurdish rebellion in Iran – 10,171+ killed and executed.[83][84]
1979 Khuzestan uprising – 112+ killed.
1979 Khorasan uprising – unknown.
1979 Azeri uprising – unknown.
1979 Baluchistan uprising – 50 killed.
Iran hostage crisis – 9 killed.
1979–1980 Tehran clashes – unknown.

Iran–Iraq War (combined death count 645,000–823,000+):

Iraqi invasion 1980
Mujahedin al-Halq uprising 1981–1982
Liberation of Khorramshahr 1982 – 17,000 killed
Operation Undeniable Victory 1982 – 50,000 mortal casualties
Operation Ramadan 1982 – 80,000 killed
Kurdish Rebellion 1983–1988 (including the Al-Anfal Campaign) 50,000–198,000 killed
Operation Before the Dawn 1983 – 6,000+ killed
Operation Dawn 3 – 162,000 killed
Operation Dawn 5 1984 – 50,000 killed
Operation Dawn 6 1984 – unknown
Operation Khaibar 1984 – 49,000 killed
Tanker War 1984
Operation Badr (1985) – 30,000–32,000
War of the Cities 1985–1987
Operation Dawn-8 1986 – unknown
Operation Karbala-4 1986 – 15,000 killed
Operation Karbala-5 – 85,000 killed
Operation Nasr 4 – unknown
Operation Karbala-10 – unknown
Operation Mersad 1987 – 4,900 killed
1988 executions of Iranian political prisoners 2,000[85] – 30,000 executed

Iraq War (combined casualty figure of 192,361–226,056+):

2003 invasion of Iraq – 35,000 killed
Iraqi insurgency (2003–06) – 15,000 killed
Civil war in Iraq 2006–2008 – 30,000–40,000 killed
Iraqi insurgency (2008–2011) – 5,000–10,000 killed

Withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq – ≈1,000 killed

Iraqi insurgency (post-U.S. withdrawal) - 54,000+ killed
Iraqi Civil War (2014–present) - 53,361-72,056 killed

Sectarian conflict in Mandatory Palestine (combined casualties 7,813)

1921 Jaffa riots - 95 killed
1929 Palestine riots – 251 killed.[86][87]
1933 Palestine riots – 20 killed.[88]
Arab Revolt in Palestine – 5,000 killed.[26]
Jewish insurgency in Palestine (1944–47) – 338 British[89] and around 100 Palestinian Jews killed.
1947–48 Civil War in Mandatory Palestine – 2,009 killed by 1 April 1948.[90]

Egyptian Crisis (combined casualties 5,000+)

Egyptian Revolution of 2011 - 846 killed
Sinai insurgency - 2,800+ killed

Syrian Civil War (combined casualties 270-450,000)


Inter-rebel conflict during the Syrian Civil War - 5,641-6,991 killed

Quote:One lovely example of middle eastern love.

Tom Grey answers David Crow's request the empirical basis for his statement on the number of dead under Saddam Hussein. Along with other human rights organizations, The Documental Centre for Human Rights in Iraq has compiled documentation on over 600,000 civilian executions in Iraq. Human Rights Watch reports that in one operation alone, the Anfal, Saddam killed 100,000 Kurdish Iraqis. Another 500,000 are estimated to have died in Saddam's needless war with Iran. Coldly taken as a daily average for the 24 years of Saddam's reign, these numbers give us a horrifying picture of between 70 and 125 civilian deaths per day for every one of Saddam's 8,000-odd days in power"

Source: http://wais.stanford.edu

What a humanitarian! I'm quite certain he is atypical. Right?
Quote:Haraam – What Islam hates about the West


February 13, 2012

By Jennifer Bonne

One of the reasons Islam can never integrate with Western society is because so many things that make up the basic freedoms people in the West enjoy are against the teachings of Islam. Islam has a word for things that it considers ungodly or immoral – Haraam, which means ‘forbidden’ in Arabic. Islamic leaders don’t just want these things forbidden for Muslims, but think the entire world should adhere to their rules too.

The problem with Haraam is that many of the things that Islam considered forbidden and a sin are part and parcel of normal Western society and range from
mortgages and credit cards to drinking alcohol and eating pork. The list of things that are
Haraam is exhaustive. While some of these are perfectly sensible, such as
murder and theft, many things considered Haraam are downright ridiculous, oppressive or simply archaic, and include some of the fundamental freedoms that have been enjoyed in the West for centuries.


Women, Adultery and Sexuality

Islam’s views on women are extreme. The Qur’an states that a woman’s testimony is worth only half that of a man’s; furthermore, a woman who doesn’t abide by her husband’s wishes is committing a sin. It is Haraam, for instance, for a wife to refuse her husband sex, and she must seek to please him at all times. Men can also punish their wives by beating them, while a woman must dress in accordance with the Qur’an. This means not only making sure they are modestly covered which in some Islamic states means from head to toe, but also
basic feminine preening such as dyeing hair or plucking the eyebrows is considered Haraam.

While adultery is considered wrong by many religions, Christianity included, what makes Islam’s views on adultery so startling is that it often includes being a rape victim. While Islam does consider rape itself Haraam, it sets ridiculous, one-sided rules for proving it. For a woman to claim she has been raped, four men who have witnessed the act need to testify. Failing to provide these witnesses means that a woman is guilty of adultery – and the penalties for such a crime in several Islamic states is often stoning to death.

Islam is extremely strict when it comes to sexuality. Not only is homosexuality Haraam, whether gay, lesbian or bisexual, but also Islam forbids women or men dressing as each other. This not only forbids transvestism and harmless drag acts, but also it is Haraam for women to wear clothing such as trousers or shirts.

Capitalism

Modern capitalist society is not one that sits well with Islam. Virtually everything about modern commerce is considered Haraam. Islam is very strict when it comes to business. Any wealth creation in Islam has to be related to the value of the goods traded. It considers interest (Riba) on loans or other financial instruments as sinful. Therefore, everything from getting a mortgage to having a savings account or credit card is Haraam.

Islam also considers gambling Haraam, but this doesn’t just include playing blackjack or roulette. To an Islamic scholar, buying stocks and shares is gambling, as are many forms of insurance. Islam also prohibits the trading of Haraam goods, which includes all sorts of things such as selling alcohol. Goods are also not supposed
to be sold to or purchased from a person or business that has committed a Haraam act.


Archaic Practices

Islam considers all sorts of common food items as Haraam. These range from ham, bacon and alcohol to even medicines that contain ethanol. While Islam allows for the eating of meat, all animals have to be slaughtered in accordance with the Qur’an, which involves ritual bloodletting in order for the meat to be acceptable for consumption. This involves an animal slowly bleeding to death and is far crueler
than modern American methods

Islam is also chalk full of other medieval practices. It is Haraam, for instance, for a slave to run away from its master. Slavery itself, it seems, is something that is not Haraam in Islam. Islam also prohibits the practicing of magic. This not only includes cabaret acts such as David Copperfield and the use of astrology and horoscopes, but also, many modern science practices, which are deemed Haraam. To this end, Saudi Arabia, a country that has proclaimed the Qur’an as its constitution, has deemed the ‘crime’ of witchcraft as a capital offense, and has repeatedly executed people for it.

Islam is not conducive to Western or modern society. It is a belief system that is based on medieval source documents written in a far bloodthirstier and illiberal time. Too many of the freedoms we in the West take for granted are considered Haraam, and Islam is intent on getting rid of all of them.

This is very accurate- read it, research it if you need to. It is.
So with this in mind...why do they want to immigrate HERE, of all places? You seriously are so naive that you can't even entertain the notion of ulterior and perhaps nefarious motives? Every cautious thought, every accusation is simply some wacko conspiracy theory, isn't it?

Zero life experience.

I hope you are never placed in a situation where your own good sense is the only thing standing between you and death. I hope you survive your wake up call.

I've wasted enough time on you. I'm sorry that you are so ignorant and obtuse, but I can't help you. My advice? Wear a helmet.

I mean, just every day. Wear a helmet. Seriously. Even in the bathtub. Really. Please.

You have served as a needed distraction, until my stomach gave out though...so, thanks.

Ciao'.
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27-09-2016, 11:40 PM
RE: Do or Die
(27-09-2016 04:29 PM)The Dark One Wrote:  I agree with all of this- and in the rest of the world, I would be much closer to liberal than conservative. But in the US, the line between socialism and liberalism has been blurred. I DESPISE socialists.

Things like medical care for all, education for all etc - socialist policies - are so terrible?

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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28-09-2016, 02:14 AM
RE: Do or Die
Quote:Things like medical care for all, education for all etc - socialist policies - are so terrible?

Of course not- it's the way they want to pay for them that is ridiculous. Expecting the rich to pay for it is punishing people for succeeding...before long they'll either decide it's not worth it to work so hard, only to have it taken from them...or they'll lie and hide money...or they'll move to a country that doesn't steal their hard earned income. Then who pays for all of this free stuff?

It's like that idiot Bernie...the guy has barely held down a job in his life, how could anyone expect him to understand finance, but...he promised free this and free that, and had no realistic plan for providing all of that free stuff. It all sounds great on paper, but honestly, if he had won, I would have moved to Costa Rica. We're not rich, but we're well enough off that his goofy plans would have hurt us financially before it all collapsed.

Dreaming is great...but you have to wake up sometime. Hopefully before you bankrupt the country!
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