Do the right think, Barack.
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09-05-2012, 06:40 PM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
(09-05-2012 05:09 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(09-05-2012 04:58 PM)kineo Wrote:  Same. Thumbsup

I gotta figure out first whether out this might violate the Hatch Act or not. ... But regardless I'm with you in spirit. Thumbsup
I'm sure it's okay for an elected federal official to honestly answer questions from their constituents. It's not like they are helping or endorsing a lobbying group.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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09-05-2012, 07:46 PM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
(09-05-2012 06:40 PM)germanyt Wrote:  
(09-05-2012 05:09 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I gotta figure out first whether out this might violate the Hatch Act or not. ... But regardless I'm with you in spirit. Thumbsup
I'm sure it's okay for an elected federal official to honestly answer questions from their constituents. It's not like they are helping or endorsing a lobbying group.

I'm gonna check with legal. No offense.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
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Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
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09-05-2012, 10:04 PM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
While I'm aware that he might possibly be pandering for votes (which I've heard, but it is really a tough argument to make considering the other argument that he'll alienate just as many voters as he'll gain) - the end result is more important. We now have the first ever sitting President to make this type of affirmative statement.

He may have just earned my vote.

Our brains deceive us on a regular basis, so we have to find ways to fight back.
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10-05-2012, 07:39 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
(09-05-2012 10:04 PM)TheSixthGlass Wrote:  While I'm aware that he might possibly be pandering for votes (which I've heard, but it is really a tough argument to make considering the other argument that he'll alienate just as many voters as he'll gain) - the end result is more important. We now have the first ever sitting President to make this type of affirmative statement.

He may have just earned my vote.
It's def not pandering. It'll cost him conservative independent vote and a large number of socially conservative black Democrats. The only way this helps him is if Romney flies off the handle on an anti gay marriage campaign. I suspect he'll lay low on this issues other than re-verifying his position like he's already done.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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10-05-2012, 08:08 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
He obviously has held this position since before his first election. It bothered me how anti LGBT some of his statements were at first. Then he made some quiet changes for transsexuals and a few gay issues. Then he repealed don't ask don't tell. It's nice that he's making this statement before his reelection, but really it frustrated me that he so obviously held an opinion which he wouldn't seriously act on. I'll be happy to see where his new openness leads, but I really would've preferred if he had ignored the political game and just made his statements from the start.

It's not pandering, but he spent 4 years testing the waters. How am I supposed to expect him to jump in the pool if he gets another 4? He's been a great help for many of my personal social issues, but he's so secretive that he often gets in the way of his own accomplishments. I'm sure we'll see what happens with him in the next 4 years, but really I would've respected him so much more if he had serious conviction.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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10-05-2012, 08:55 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
I think Lil is onto something. I have a hard time to believe this has been a drastic "evolution" in his thinking. I don't keep up with the topic that closely, but I was actually surprised to learn that he had been verbally opposed to Gay marriage. I had just assumed he was in favor of it. There was a clear testing of the waters that Biden made his comments on Sunday and just 2 days later Obama says, "Oh yeah, me too. I love me some gays."
But, the fact it was done before his re-election makes me admire him more for the decision to come out of the closet...so to speak.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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10-05-2012, 09:04 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
Yes - testing the waters - I'm also wondering if he didn't wait to see how North Carolina was going to go; strategically that would be the thing to do whether he did the right thing or not. Mmm... politics ... it can be a filthy game.

I just found myself fighting some fucking moron on a friend's facebook page on this issue... and looky what turn this took!! I wasn't even expecting this at all:

Moron quote: I never believed 10% of the population is homosexual, I believe it is less than 2%. You've raised it to 33 1/3%. I do not believe one out of every three people I meet are homosexual. What rights are denied? Marriage is a Sacrament. Even Obama only a couple years ago believed in "civil unions", not homosexual marriage. What is it you require to be satisfied? Do you need to be able to use the term "Marriage" just to diminish the meaning of the term as it is currently understood? You never stop, first you wanted to be recognized, when you got that, you wanted to be accepted, when you got that, you needed the lifestyle taught in school, when you got that you wanted the lifestyle promoted in school in sex education class, when you got that you wanted to be able to have hospital visits like married people, when you got that you wanted civil unions, when you got that you demanded marriage. When you get that, I know you won't stop, you have to keep digging deeper, like a virus, very virulent (yes, that is what I meant above), your next step will probably be to demand, since the Courts perform homosexual marriage, now churches need to be forced to provide the same service, or you will demand they lose their tax exempt status. Then the attack goes directly against the Roman Catholic Church, the last bulwark against rampant license, which I believe is the original intent in all this anyway.

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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10-05-2012, 09:07 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
Smart move
I think that all he has to do now is sit back and watch the republican party and fox news simultaneously ex and implode attempting to condemn this while trying hard not to appear bigoted
Come to think of it, that seems to be his election strategy all along. "Let the clowns do their thing and then whatever I say will seem reasonable"

The secret to a happy life is lowering your expectations to the point where they are already met
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10-05-2012, 09:12 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
This is just a stupid issue to debate in the first place.

I'm sick of hearing about it.

They should be able to get married. Denying them is a blatant violation of civil rights.

There.

Done.

Move on.

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10-05-2012, 09:21 AM
RE: Do the right think, Barack.
There will be no demand that institutions perform marriages. If a gay catholic couple wants a catholic wedding they will find a catholic priest who is good with that. Churches are not so much a corporations as a private business. Each congregation holds it's own views on much of what the scripture suggests.

England has been having issues with this due to christian marriage counselors who feel their rights being ignored by bosses who want their business to accept gay marriage. If you work for a place that accepts gay marriage it's not the government telling you to be ok with it, it's your boss. There is no reason to have an employee who flat out refuses to do a 3rd of the business.

The quakers have been performing marriage rights for homosexual couples for centuries, and them along with other congregations will happily do the same legally. Just because specific beliefs don't hold something as important doesn't mean they aren't stepping on the toes of others who do.

Marriage has been around longer than christianity, and just because a decree was made that only church marriages be considered viable the culture slowly lost that fact. This has never been about religion. It's the religious who feel everything in society must be about them. Gay Marriage is not talking about holy sacraments, it's talking about a civil issue. If you don't want to annoint a couple because you have a personal issue with them then don't. The catholic church has long held the practice of turning down marriages. If they can say no to a heterosexual couple with one member out of the church then they can say no to a homosexual couple.

And as far as the slow climb towards equality, we would be ecstatic if we could've just started with the end game, but that's not how the world works. If we don't make changes incrementally then they will never be made. So many of the changes that have come to pass only happened because the blow was softened with it's predescessor. Now I ask you to give me one example of a law which was made to directly attack your church. Each of these changes has been made in a civic nature for civic rights. At no time has a law been passed that states all churches must accept gay paritioners. You haven't even had a law demanding you let women get their equal consideration. If you want to be biased then be biased, we're not stopping you, we're just making it so that the world at large can step out of this cloud.

Yeah I know the facebook person isn't reading but sometimes when I see these things I have to say something =p

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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