Does atheism or theism have any practical uses for society?
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07-10-2013, 07:54 AM
RE: Does atheism or theism have any practical uses for society?
(07-10-2013 12:46 AM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  This actually gets at the heart of my point of disconnecting Atheism from the idea of a belief. It may simply be a semantical point, but I think it's an important distinction. But of course it's just my two cents, as it were.

The problem have with your analogy of "A and B" in reference to Theism and Atheism is that it's not an apt comparison. In your example "A" is something and "B" is a contradictory thing. It is true that Theism is contradictory to Atheism, and vice versa. But the flaw is that Atheism is not an alternative to Theism. It's the absence of Theism.
Atheism is the belief that there is no God.
It is also the rejection of the belief that there is a God. To me, these are logically the same. In the same way, theism is the belief that God exists. But it is also the rejection of the belief that there is no God. So both theism and atheism are beliefs,
and rejection of beliefs at the same time. An agnostic could claim that (s)he has no belief at all.

I personally am more of an ignostic. It all depends on the definition of God. For some, the definition of God is so abstract, that there is really no difference between "nature" or "God". If that is the case, I would have to admit that God exists. But if "God" means a personal God, some creature in the sky who listens to your prayers,
then I certainly do not believe in a God.
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07-10-2013, 08:00 AM
RE: Does atheism or theism have any practical uses for society?
(07-10-2013 07:54 AM)black_squirrel Wrote:  
(07-10-2013 12:46 AM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  This actually gets at the heart of my point of disconnecting Atheism from the idea of a belief. It may simply be a semantical point, but I think it's an important distinction. But of course it's just my two cents, as it were.

The problem have with your analogy of "A and B" in reference to Theism and Atheism is that it's not an apt comparison. In your example "A" is something and "B" is a contradictory thing. It is true that Theism is contradictory to Atheism, and vice versa. But the flaw is that Atheism is not an alternative to Theism. It's the absence of Theism.
Atheism is the belief that there is no God.
It is also the rejection of the belief that there is a God. To me, these are logically the same.

No, they are not the same. I lack a belief in that for which there is no evidence.

I do not make the claim that there are are no gods.

Those are different.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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07-10-2013, 09:18 AM (This post was last modified: 07-10-2013 09:56 AM by Raptor Jesus.)
RE: Does atheism or theism have any practical uses for society?
(07-10-2013 07:54 AM)black_squirrel Wrote:  
(07-10-2013 12:46 AM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  This actually gets at the heart of my point of disconnecting Atheism from the idea of a belief. It may simply be a semantical point, but I think it's an important distinction. But of course it's just my two cents, as it were.

The problem have with your analogy of "A and B" in reference to Theism and Atheism is that it's not an apt comparison. In your example "A" is something and "B" is a contradictory thing. It is true that Theism is contradictory to Atheism, and vice versa. But the flaw is that Atheism is not an alternative to Theism. It's the absence of Theism.
Atheism is the belief that there is no God.
It is also the rejection of the belief that there is a God. To me, these are logically the same. In the same way, theism is the belief that God exists. But it is also the rejection of the belief that there is no God. So both theism and atheism are beliefs,
and rejection of beliefs at the same time. An agnostic could claim that (s)he has no belief at all.

I personally am more of an ignostic. It all depends on the definition of God. For some, the definition of God is so abstract, that there is really no difference between "nature" or "God". If that is the case, I would have to admit that God exists. But if "God" means a personal God, some creature in the sky who listens to your prayers,
then I certainly do not believe in a God.

That's just not true. (disclaimer: I'm not trying to tell you what to think about this, just expressing my understanding of it. ...P.S., I am right)

I don't "believe" that "God"/"gods" don't exist.

That is to say, I don’t have a possitive belief of their “non-existence”.

It's more accurate to say, I don't believe that they do exist. That is to say I don’t hold a positive belief in their existence.

In both cases I hold no belief about them. I hold no belief, positive (for), or negative (against) of their existence. I just don’t believe in them.

Not believing in something is not the same as believing in not believing in that same thing. It's just not believing. It is a lack of a belief.

...
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14-10-2013, 02:38 AM
Does atheism or theism have any practical uses for society?
Still no examples of how atheism or atheists are solving any of today's problems. Atheism and religion seem pretty irrelevant.
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14-10-2013, 06:02 PM
RE: Does atheism or theism have any practical uses for society?
(14-10-2013 02:38 AM)I and I Wrote:  Still no examples of how atheism or atheists are solving any of today's problems. Atheism and religion seem pretty irrelevant.

From now on all posts are just a repeat of what he said, with one correction:

Still no examples of how "I and I" are solving any of today's problems. "I and I" seem pretty irrelevant.

There that's better. Hate monger.

Cheers.

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Martin Luther was the "father" of two movements - The Reformation and Nazism.
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